Cayman GTS

[TDT]

JasonSteel said:

anonymous said:

[redacted]

i thought i'd try and nip it in the bud

TBH i'm not even sure i'd sell... half of me would love a (981) GT4, the other half of me thinks the GTS is more car than i'll ever need.

car is a pretty rare spec manual GTS with sports chassis, buckets and PTV (and a whole load of extras). could be a good opportunity for all involved.

I’d keep it unless you a definitely going on track, a lot. From a former GTS X73 owner(3years) and current 981 GT4 Owner (3years and counting)

[Twinfan]

Unless you would like the more direct chassis feeling you get from the GT setup (want to change), or as TDT says if you're going on track fairly often (need to change), you're probably better off sticking with what you have if you're happy with it

[JasonSteel]

TDT said:

I’d keep it unless you a definitely going on track, a lot. From a former GTS X73 owner(3years) and current 981 GT4 Owner (3years and counting)

i've only ever driven a GT4 at the PEC and it didn't strike me as a car i wouldn't be able to live with day to day (and it would be my main car, though i work from home most of the time). in terms of day to day use, how does the GT4 differ from the GTS? if anything i think the GT4 SPASM is easier to live with than X73?

Twinfan said:

Unless you would like the more direct chassis feeling you get from the GT setup (want to change), or as TDT says if you're going on track fairly often (need to change), you're probably better off sticking with what you have if you're happy with it

i do like the more direct chassis but i'm not gonna lie, for me this is more about aesthetics than chassis. i'm just really into the GT4 styling (that wing though...) and i regularly catch myself ogling over GT4 images and videos.
probably about 40% chassis and 60% looks. and no i wouldn't track regularly, though i would like to try it at some point.

edit: Twinfan, how are you finding your experience vs the GTS?

Edited by JasonSteel on Tuesday 21st April 13:23

[Twinfan]

JasonSteel said:

Twinfan, how are you finding your experience vs the GTS?

Very limited, given that I only managed to squeeze in around 250 miles over the week before lockdown! Some initial thoughts though:

1. Ground clearance, which I thought was going to be a real issue, is absolutely fine. My GTS was on PASM and the GT4 is therefore 20mm lower with a larger splitter overhang. Other than taking it easy over speed bumps, which I had to do in the GTS anyway, I've not had a problem. I have a flat drive with only a short, slight slope up to it so it's all good.

2. The engine is much meatier, as you'd expect, even though I've not gone over 4.5k revs yet. It spins up well like the 3.4 does, and I personally would take the 3.4 or the 4.0 over the 3.8 in the 981 GT4 which always feels a bit strangled to me.

3. The chassis is superb, truly wonderful. Compliant, firm and forgiving all at the same time. Steering is sharp and precise, the 918 buckets are super comfortable and really hook you in to the car.

4. In the cabin while driving the sound is good as it's mostly induction and mechanical noise, but the lack of exhaust noise will be a problem for a lot of people. I don't mind it as I think the public are less tolerant of pops, bangs and loud volume now that all modern turbo-engined cars seem to do it.

5. The interior is virtually identical to the 981 and I still hate the 718 air vent styling!

6. I'm loving the yellow, go big or go home on a GT car

Overall, I wouldn't go back to my GTS. The GT4 is more what I expect from a sports car, the GTS was more of a luxury car if that makes sense? Too posh for me, I wanted something a bit more motorsport and raw which is what the GT4 is.

However the GTS is a truly fabulous thing and I'd recommend them to anyone if it's the kind of car they're after

[TDT]

JasonSteel said:

TDT said:

I’d keep it unless you a definitely going on track, a lot. From a former GTS X73 owner(3years) and current 981 GT4 Owner (3years and counting)

i've only ever driven a GT4 at the PEC and it didn't strike me as a car i wouldn't be able to live with day to day (and it would be my main car, though i work from home most of the time). in terms of day to day use, how does the GT4 differ from the GTS? if anything i think the GT4 SPASM is easier to live with than X73?

Twinfan said:

Unless you would like the more direct chassis feeling you get from the GT setup (want to change), or as TDT says if you're going on track fairly often (need to change), you're probably better off sticking with what you have if you're happy with it

i do like the more direct chassis but i'm not gonna lie, for me this is more about aesthetics than chassis. i'm just really into the GT4 styling (that wing though...) and i regularly catch myself ogling over GT4 images and videos.
probably about 40% chassis and 60% looks. and no i wouldn't track regularly, though i would like to try it at some point.

edit: Twinfan, how are you finding your experience vs the GTS?

You could daily a 981 GT4 but it would start to grate... has a little bit of a skunkworks feel.
718 GT4 is much more polished... refined and more like a series car...at normal road speeds to me. You could defo daily one of these - as i even thing the front lip approach angle is bigger. On a 981 you will end up catching it.

GT4 PASM vs 981 GTS X73.... so the chassis and ride is more than just down to the suspension... its also the geometries and contact patch.
GT4 contact patch is larger, grip is much higher and so at normal speeds - the GTS on x73 and skinner tyres will be more playful and light-footed due to the contact patch being smaller and slightly more body movement.
GT4, and GT car philosophy is a locked down ride...tightly controlled body movement and big grip( in the dry on Cup2). So to start to manipulate the angles on the road - you need to be going faster or pushing harder - which may or may not be more fun and carry risk (cup2 in Wet!).
So you can really only get the full benefit of this extra capability on track.

When I had my GTS - after 3years as my daily - I started hankering after a GT4, as I wanted something distinctly as a toy.... in that regard its perfect and you use it as you will. But I don't think it's a primary mode of transport... although it can do it. For you current spec of GTS - it actually might not make that much differnence - as you are manual, x73 and buckets.. so interior will be pretty much identical. Luggage capacity is identical if no cage.
You'll just get a bigger engine, the looks and the ride will be a bit different. Which I why i say... unless you have the space cash... why change unless you are going to track it...where the extra heat management and chassis adjustability is the benefit. GTS x73 is perfect for road.

[TDT]

And of course if you want a sport car to sound like a sports car.. the 718 GT4 is redundant... only 981 3.4, 981 GT4 and 981 Spyder need apply. lol

[JasonSteel]

thanks guys that's all really useful info, though it doesn't make the decision any easier

either way i appreciate what i've got but the GT4 may be an itch i have to scratch at some point.

if anyone is interested in the GTS please PM me and we can at least discuss it.

[StevenRugg]

This is interesting to read, as I have a 981 GTS (which I love) and on and off hanker for a GT4 too. The car isn't needed for daily duties, and I do four or five track days a year.

It's interesting to hear that the 718 GT4 is a bit easier to live with day to day. I'd be interested for more owner's reviews on this point over time. One thing I particularly like about the GTS is how easy and comfortably it does the motorway cruise to a track day, then goes around all day in a lot of noise and fun, and then comes home all comfortable again.

And I know it might get everyone's hackles up and it's completely illegal, etc, but I'm particularly waiting for the PDK in a year or two to see how it fares as a mix of sensible/easy and fun/fast.

[Twinfan]

StevenRugg said:

It's interesting to hear that the 718 GT4 is a bit easier to live with day to day. I'd be interested for more owner's reviews on this point over time. One thing I particularly like about the GTS is how easy and comfortably it does the motorway cruise to a track day, then goes around all day in a lot of noise and fun, and then comes home all comfortable again.

The big difference is cabin noise - rattles from stones hitting the underside of the car and the wheelarches, induction noise, mechanical engine and gearbox noises etc. If you like to sit back in relative peace and quiet for a cruise home you won't get that.

Otherwise the chassis comfort and engine smoothness are superb

[Porsche911R]

Twinfan said:

Unless you would like the more direct chassis feeling you get from the GT setup (want to change), or as TDT says if you're going on track fairly often (need to change), you're probably better off sticking with what you have if you're happy with it

the x73 is pretty direct more so than a GT4 on PASM off imo and PASM ON on is unusable on the road. , REAL shocks always work better and are more direct imo. Hence the 1st thing Manthey do is rip PASM out.

GT4 no more direct bar tyres and geo, both of which you change on a GTS if you like driving. P zero are dire and so is a oem geo set up.

but X73 is firm over GT4 PASM off setting and makes the car a lot more exciting.

If I had that spec GTS I would give it 380BHP put some PS4S on it and have a basic £80 geo done and go GT4 hunting. A PDK car would be faster than the GT4 in that spec. a PDK basic GTS out drags a GT4 as is.

[GT4P]

I would purchase an X73 over PASM car every time , never found the gt4 too harsh in sport mode on the road but would have preferred X73 on the car, the above GtS sounds the perfect 981 bar gt4/spyder

[JasonSteel]

took some essentials to my parents out in the sticks earlier in the GTS... such a lovely car to drive, to experience and look at, especially when the sun's out.

i wonder if they will do a GT4 'Touring' (718 Cayman R?) before they go all electric?

[Budflicker]

JasonSteel said:

took some essentials to my parents out in the sticks earlier in the GTS... such a lovely car to drive, to experience and look at, especially when the sun's out.

i wonder if they will do a GT4 'Touring' (718 Cayman R?) before they go all electric?

They have, it's called the 718 GTS 4.0

[JasonSteel]

the GTS is the GTS.

Touring is pretty much the same as a GT car but without the wing.

would be the perfect car for me. the 718 GTS i'm sure is a great car but styling wise it just doesn't do it for me.

[bcr5784]

JasonSteel said:

the GTS is the GTS.

Touring is pretty much the same as a GT car but without the wing.

would be the perfect car for me. the 718 GTS i'm sure is a great car but styling wise it just doesn't do it for me.

I am somewhat at a loss to understand why the (to me) minor styling differences 718 vs 918 outweigh the (to me) more significant chassis (and engine) enhancements.

[JasonSteel]

bcr5784 said:

I am somewhat at a loss to understand why the (to me) minor styling differences 718 vs 918 outweigh the (to me) more significant chassis (and engine) enhancements.

i think it's easy to understand if you accept that we all have different priorities and passions.

you clearly value technical enhancements and that's great. if i was into racing i would too but i'm not, and i doubt those improvements would make any difference to my driving experience on the road.

i'm really into design, so the way a car looks is very important to me. the styling differences between the 981 and 718 may seem small to you but to me they change the personality of the car, and i think the comparison images i posted a few weeks ago ( https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...) are a perfect example of this.

if we all had the same priorities and requirements, there would only be 1 sports car and we would all love it.

[Milnsey]

Porsche911R said:

the x73 is pretty direct more so than a GT4 on PASM off imo and PASM ON on is unusable on the road. , REAL shocks always work better and are more direct imo. Hence the 1st thing Manthey do is rip PASM out.

GT4 no more direct bar tyres and geo, both of which you change on a GTS if you like driving. P zero are dire and so is a oem geo set up.

but X73 is firm over GT4 PASM off setting and makes the car a lot more exciting.

If I had that spec GTS I would give it 380BHP put some PS4S on it and have a basic £80 geo done and go GT4 hunting. A PDK car would be faster than the GT4 in that spec. a PDK basic GTS out drags a GT4 as is.

What geo settings would you recommend?

[bcr5784]

JasonSteel said:

i think it's easy to understand if you accept that we all have different priorities and passions.

you clearly value technical enhancements and that's great. if i was into racing i would too but i'm not, and i doubt those improvements would make any difference to my driving experience on the road.

i'm really into design, so the way a car looks is very important to me. the styling differences between the 981 and 718 may seem small to you but to me they change the personality of the car, and i think the comparison images i posted a few weeks ago ( https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...) are a perfect example of this.

if we all had the same priorities and requirements, there would only be 1 sports car and we would all love it.

Fair enough but if you do not value the technical differences, then I would have thought the GTS was the more natural choice.

[JasonSteel]

bcr5784 said:

JasonSteel said:

i think it's easy to understand if you accept that we all have different priorities and passions.

you clearly value technical enhancements and that's great. if i was into racing i would too but i'm not, and i doubt those improvements would make any difference to my driving experience on the road.

i'm really into design, so the way a car looks is very important to me. the styling differences between the 981 and 718 may seem small to you but to me they change the personality of the car, and i think the comparison images i posted a few weeks ago ( https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...) are a perfect example of this.

if we all had the same priorities and requirements, there would only be 1 sports car and we would all love it.

Fair enough but if you do not value the technical differences, then I would have thought the GTS was the more natural choice.

if that's what you think then you've missed the point of my post.

in any case, it's not that the technical differences aren't important to me, it's just that the styling differences do matter to me.

found these the other day which might be of interest to those that also like the idea of a GT4 sans wing:

https://imgur.com/a/Cx9EgXL

[swanny71]

JasonSteel said:

found these the other day which might be of interest to those that also like the idea of a GT4 sans wing:

https://imgur.com/a/Cx9EgXL

Oh yes, I like that a lot!

Thoughts on any potential problems if wing is removed?