12 GT4's for sale on PistonHeads and growing

[Twinfan]

Koln-RS said:

(posted to mitigate Twinfan's relentless GT4 bashing)

Really?

I'm not bashing the car, just expressing an opinion to Ian on what he should do as that's what he was asking.

[Porsche911R]

keep it imo why sell now ?

[decrassius]

Ian, GT4s seem to be depreciating in the medium term. So you're basically "paying money" in depreciation.

If you're not driving the car, what are you getting in return for your money? Very little of tangible value.

So: if you have enough money that £10k isn't really relevant - keep it. Otherwise, sell it. Sorry to be so rational...

[decrassius]

Separate question - as I pick up mine tomorrow - what would be the first thing you do with your new GT4?

[chrisABP]

decrassius said:

Separate question - as I pick up mine tomorrow - what would be the first thing you do with your new GT4?

Press the exhaust valve button for the full hit!

Enjoy your day, you'll love it.

[GT4P]

I find myself in the same boat as mdian in that I don't get to use as much as I would like but when I do I really enjoy it but I could do with 4 seats on occasion but the only Porsche I would buy new is the 991.2 Gts but that will cost me £110k which is new gt3 money! Or secondhand a 997.2 GtS is £80k and would end up costing more in ownership than what I have! So what do you buy to replace it with? And it's still costing me nothing as I was lucky to secure at list!
I was also the same with my previous 987 spyder and watched prices tumble to £30k with a lot of cars for sale in relation to numbers but I kept it a bit longer and prices stabilised and I eventually sold after nearly 4 years of ownership for roughly what I paid new £46k it then went to climb to a recent sale of £55k!
What I am trying to say is yes prices will fall as many cars now have miles on them so it's only natural but then they will stabilise (circa £75-80k)and if the 991.2gt3 manual numbers are very low and prices at £200k the gt4 price may start to rise again next spring/summer!
So if you paid list I can see it being the same when it is 4 years old so you are not going to lose much if anything but have a great car to drive every time you get the chance!
As for a new gt4 that could be f4 turbo if not released in next 12/18 months (big changes coming october 2019)so that will have no effect on current gt4 prices and even if it is f6 n/a its going to cost closer to £100k with extras new !

[GT4P]

decrassius said:

Ian, GT4s seem to be depreciating in the medium term. So you're basically "paying money" in depreciation.


"Not if paid list "

If you're not driving the car, what are you getting in return for your money? Very little of tangible value.

"But he is still better off than money in the bank if he paid list"

So: if you have enough money that £10k isn't really relevant - keep it. Otherwise, sell it. Sorry to be so rational

"£10k is not relevant as he is not losing it as he paid list" Unless he is looking at cashing in and making a small profit but then you might as well cashed in 3 months ago!"
...

[md_ian]

Thanks guys for not just calling me a soft tw4t Yeah, so much going on in my life that it gets one reasonably long run every few weeks (I won't take out if I cannot at least warm the engine fluids fully). The biggest problem being that when I do take it out, I'm blown away by it every time, such a special car. I have equal apprehension of selling it, versus storing it; both a massive shame. I'll consider over the weekend, has been a very deflating week, so probably sensible not to make any immediate decisions.

[GT4P]

md_ian said:

it gets one reasonably long run every few weeks (I won't take out if I cannot at least warm the engine fluids fully). s.

like you I will not take mine out unless it involves going minimum of 10 miles and due to where I live it takes you at least 30/40 minutes to get out to some nice driving roads and even then they are congested with cyclists at the weekend hence mine only does mainly long journeys of 140 miles each way to see family or an odd day out of 100miles or so!So it can be 2 months between use and even more in the winter but as long as it's not costing me I am not to bothered and as said before buying at list secures some years of protection against depreciation unless there is a market crash then it all becomes relative because everything else comes down in price!
What you have to ask yourself is what you would do with the money if it is for house purchase/extension or to clear debt then sell but if it's just going to sit in the bank then keep!
If your selling to buy another car you could find yourself in the same position you are now so what's the point and what do you buy in that price range or less?

[ags11]

md_ian said:

Thanks guys for not just calling me a soft tw4t Yeah, so much going on in my life that it gets one reasonably long run every few weeks (I won't take out if I cannot at least warm the engine fluids fully). The biggest problem being that when I do take it out, I'm blown away by it every time, such a special car. I have equal apprehension of selling it, versus storing it; both a massive shame. I'll consider over the weekend, has been a very deflating week, so probably sensible not to make any immediate decisions.

I'm in much the same situation, being pulled in too many directions!
Like yourself I'm considering things carefully. I'm very attached to mine having agonised over the spec etc.
A few days ago I had a drive in the much hyped 991.2 gts- the minute I sat back in the 4 I knew it's nearly impossible to replace- don't take it for granted!
The GTS is just transport I'd be bored quickly - expensive transport too- a GT4 bought at list is a bargain in new car terms. I don't think keeping it will be the worst financial decision you'll take. If you decide to cash in,putting the money in a bank will mean depreciation given inflation anyway- the stock market is perhaps looking a bit bubbley too!
There's risk in everything, the next 4 could be a turbo, the stock market could crash etc etc.
I caught the car bug from my dad, he's in a care home now- man he'd love the GT4.
We are here for a good time, not a long time!
If you've got yourself in a position to own a GT4 I'm sure you're more than capable of taking the right desicion yourself, without help from us keyboard people!
Btw many thanks for your time spent on the sold charts!!

[Porsche911R]

decrassius said:

Separate question - as I pick up mine tomorrow - what would be the first thing you do with your new GT4?

Minimum Get a geo and some rear adjustable toe links, if it has Dunlop tyres throw them away ;-)

if you want to track it and have more feel and feed back this kit is ace.

Please don't drive a stock car, it can be very much improved and £90k is a lot of money to get a "safe set up car"

Edited by Porsche911R on Friday 23 June 15:51

[GT4P]

Hi 'ags11' is the 991.2 Gts that bad ? Bar the gt3 that's the only new Porsche I could think of to replace the gt4 with going forward!
This is the sad direction I think we find ourselves in and I think it started with the 981/991 series wherein before I always lusted after the latest model ie 9x6 to 9x7.1 to 9x7.2 and that was where it stopped for me until the gt4 arrived and the R I can't have or the 991.2 gt3 manual which I am not worthy of
The 9x1 and 9x1.2 are nice enough cars but if that is all they are I might as well save cash and drive a Ford Focus ( not talking RS or ST either)or such like on our congested roads!

[Fokker]

GT4P said:

I find myself in the same boat as mdian in that I don't get to use as much as I would like but when I do I really enjoy it but I could do with 4 seats on occasion but the only Porsche I would buy new is the 991.2 Gts but that will cost me £110k which is new gt3 money! Or secondhand a 997.2 GtS is £80k and would end up costing more in ownership than what I have! So what do you buy to replace it with? And it's still costing me nothing as I was lucky to secure at list!
I was also the same with my previous 987 spyder and watched prices tumble to £30k with a lot of cars for sale in relation to numbers but I kept it a bit longer and prices stabilised and I eventually sold after nearly 4 years of ownership for roughly what I paid new £46k it then went to climb to a recent sale of £55k!
What I am trying to say is yes prices will fall as many cars now have miles on them so it's only natural but then they will stabilise (circa £75-80k)and if the 991.2gt3 manual numbers are very low and prices at £200k the gt4 price may start to rise again next spring/summer!
So if you paid list I can see it being the same when it is 4 years old so you are not going to lose much if anything but have a great car to drive every time you get the chance!
As for a new gt4 that could be f4 turbo if not released in next 12/18 months (big changes coming october 2019)so that will have no effect on current gt4 prices and even if it is f6 n/a its going to cost closer to £100k with extras new !

Porsche don't put prices up like that. I guarantee you that the new GT4 will be a n/a flat six and it'll be about 70k plus options.

Ian, don't sell it. I sold my first one and really regretted it hence I bought another one. Once you drive anything else this side of 150k, nothing stacks up. Its as simple as that. They will not bomb in price, they may depreciate slightly but it's only because there are 20 on the used locator. As soon as that number lowers to say 10 cars as in the GT3 situation for the 991.1, prices will firm and stay there in my opinion. Its a bargain car and one that's not going depreciate much from where it is now. Its been almost 2 years now and prices are still strong and they're still selling very well with 3 people on here collecting cars this week?.Keep it or you'll be sorry. You might not get an allocation on the next one?

[Fokker]

GT4P said:

Hi 'ags11' is the 991.2 Gts that bad ? Bar the gt3 that's the only new Porsche I could think of to replace the gt4 with going forward!
This is the sad direction I think we find ourselves in and I think it started with the 981/991 series wherein before I always lusted after the latest model ie 9x6 to 9x7.1 to 9x7.2 and that was where it stopped for me until the gt4 arrived and the R I can't have or the 991.2 gt3 manual which I am not worthy of
The 9x1 and 9x1.2 are nice enough cars but if that is all they are I might as well save cash and drive a Ford Focus ( not talking RS or ST either)or such like on our congested roads!

I bought a 991.1 GTS to replace the GT4 and while it was an excellent car that sounded gorgeous, it wasn't anywhere near a go-kart like as the GT4. That's about the best way I can describe the difference, it was all in the feel and what was going on underneath you. You take the GT4 for granted until you drive a more mainstream model on more normal tyres and suspension. The 991 GTS was excellent and I waxed lyrical about it but in comparison to the feel, the GT4 has it licked in every way you can imagine. It's an event whereas other stuff even much more expensive stuff is relatively mundane in comparrison.

[GT4P]

Fokker said:

Porsche don't put prices up like that. I guarantee you that the new GT4 will be a n/a flat six and it'll be about 70k plus options.

?

I am aware Porsche prices are a gradual increase over time but I think that's changed a little more so from where prices were at with the first 996gt3 circa £72k to the last 997.2 gt3 at circa £80k an increase of £8k over 7 years to leap of £30k in the last 6 years to the current gt3.
A 718s with nice spec. is what £65k a 718 Gts is going to be £70k+ with nice options so if the gt4 was turbo I see a list of perhaps £70k plus but if there is any truth in the detuned gt3 lump then expect a list of at least £90k and limited supply perhaps gt3 levels .
Not being rude or questioning but how can you guarantee it will be £70k plus options and a n/a flat 6?

[champ19ns]

By the time I sell in 2 years time the car will most likely be on 20k miles

Whether a car is 10k or 20k miles covered, I don't think will make a huge difference in value, especially if there are less GT4's for sale.

Use it and enjoy is what I say

[Twinfan]

GT4P said:

A 718s with nice spec. is what £65k a 718 Gts is going to be £70k+ with nice options so if the gt4 was turbo I see a list of perhaps £70k plus but if there is any truth in the detuned gt3 lump then expect a list of at least £90k and limited supply perhaps gt3 levels .
Not being rude or questioning but how can you guarantee it will be £70k plus options and a n/a flat 6?

It's very likely to be an NA flat 6 based on AP's comments in interviews and the recent spy shot of a 718 GT4 being based on the 981 chassis not the 718/982.

Pricing will all depend on the engine IMHO. The last one was 'cheap' as it used the Carrera S motor and I think the only way the 718 GT4 will be similar in price is if it uses the same engine but with the X51 PowerKit. If it has a version of the 4.0 GT3 engine it will be £££££££.

[nw942]

Nickz said:

This weekend you really need to drive your favourite road in the sweetest handling car Porsche have made in a while.

Many thanks for the market updates.

Set your alarm for 6am on Sunday

+1

[ags11]

GT4P said:

Hi 'ags11' is the 991.2 Gts that bad ? Bar the gt3 that's the only new Porsche I could think of to replace the gt4 with going forward!
This is the sad direction I think we find ourselves in and I think it started with the 981/991 series wherein before I always lusted after the latest model ie 9x6 to 9x7.1 to 9x7.2 and that was where it stopped for me until the gt4 arrived and the R I can't have or the 991.2 gt3 manual which I am not worthy of
The 9x1 and 9x1.2 are nice enough cars but if that is all they are I might as well save cash and drive a Ford Focus ( not talking RS or ST either)or such like on our congested roads!

Hey there, it's not bad I guess, just a totally different feel,or lack of it as others have said!
Everything was just watered down too much- in normal mode it was whisper quiet.
On the way in traffic with the heavier clutch in the GT4 I thought maybe pdk might be the way to go, on the drive home in the 4 I thought feck that manual is the only job if u want a fun car.
There's no way I'd spend 30k to get a GTS - I could have a golf r as a daily for that and possibly more fun.
For all the talk of the low down torque with the turbo's the 4 felt razor sharp in comparison.
Don't get me wrong the GTS is a mighty car, the 4 seats would mean I'd get more use out of it, but to me it's too good/expensive as a daily & not enough interaction or soul for the weekend.
Moving from it is tricky as getting another new GT car isn't guaranteed.
It's a shame because Porsche used to be the enthusiast's choice off the shelf, now it's evolved into a scramble for the GT cars if one appreciates their senses tickled a bit!

[Fokker]

GT4P said:

I am aware Porsche prices are a gradual increase over time but I think that's changed a little more so from where prices were at with the first 996gt3 circa £72k to the last 997.2 gt3 at circa £80k an increase of £8k over 7 years to leap of £30k in the last 6 years to the current gt3.
A 718s with nice spec. is what £65k a 718 Gts is going to be £70k+ with nice options so if the gt4 was turbo I see a list of perhaps £70k plus but if there is any truth in the detuned gt3 lump then expect a list of at least £90k and limited supply perhaps gt3 levels .
Not being rude or questioning but how can you guarantee it will be £70k plus options and a n/a flat 6?

No thats fine, you're right to ask. I have a contact at porsche who said the GT3 engined GT4 does exist but its only a test vehicle. Personally I can't see that gong into production and neither can my contact. It's very much a given that a GT car won't be turbocharged, certainly not now anyway, in a few years who knows. As a result, I'm convinced its going to be the same unit as in the last one but probably a bit more free revving akin to the power kitted 991 GTS motor which they can still use for the time being.

If the GT3 motor does indeed work its way into the GT4 then it'll be the car of the century and I would love it along with every other person with a ounce of petrol in their veins! I agree with you that if that were to happen, it would be quite a jump up in cost, who knows, probably about £80 - £85k plus options at a guess. That would make it the bargain of the century too!

I can't wait to find out but I would bet quite a lot of money that there won't be a turbo in sight.