Discussion
Spenno said:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202208108...
Bought on CC for £43k, listed the next day on AT for £59,980 and already down by £5k. Seriously optimistic. Still has 9 year old tyres and a missing service - no mention of that though.
Similarly there was a yellow 996 GT3 on CC, bought by a dealer for £60k plus fees, then listed on their website for £75k (iirc), after a few months still not sold, now dropped to £60k so the dealer would make a loss! Bought on CC for £43k, listed the next day on AT for £59,980 and already down by £5k. Seriously optimistic. Still has 9 year old tyres and a missing service - no mention of that though.
BrotherMouzone said:
Similarly there was a yellow 996 GT3 on CC, bought by a dealer for £60k plus fees, then listed on their website for £75k (iirc), after a few months still not sold, now dropped to £60k so the dealer would make a loss!
This tactic seems quite common and it really frustrates me. Dealer buys car at public auction (which is presumably the best indicator of actual market value) and then attempts to flip it days later at a hugely inflated price. I think it's at least partly been driving some of these mad "values" we've seen recently and I hope that those guilty are deterred from doing it in the future.Often they're quite distinctive cars - the GT3 above being an example - and if you're looking for one you'll generally have checked most of the sites regularly and know what's around at a given time. So I don't get how it makes good business sense for them. Their target market will easily see that the asking price is way too high.
I will add that I have nothing against dealers making a living, but when they're buying in a public auction and then literally just flipping a car without doing any work to it I think it's pretty sly. An iffy 3 month warranty is not worth £15k.
blueovercream said:
This tactic seems quite common and it really frustrates me. Dealer buys car at public auction (which is presumably the best indicator of actual market value) and then attempts to flip it days later at a hugely inflated price. I think it's at least partly been driving some of these mad "values" we've seen recently
Its exactly that... Ive posted before about private sale asking prices vs dealer prices... One clown sticks a £60K price on a car and suddenly everyone thinks they're sat on a £50K CaymanR where as the reality is that the black car in question took two goes on CC to sell at £43k...
The pre 991/981 era GT3/R/Spyder market is pretty small. You're almost into the realms of beards and sandals. As mentioned anyone looking to buy will be all over the internet doing research on cars and prices etc.. There was a post a few pages back about someone who took several months to sell their CaymanR.
The right car at the right price at the right time. - Those are the cars that sell. Everything else will just hang around...or end up on CC
These are peoples toys... and there will be plenty of people that will have to start to choose between paying the monthlies on a summer toy sat in the garage over winter or paying their bills...
anyone fancy catching a falling knife?
Slippydiff said:
It’s merely opportunism in a rising market, when the chances of making a quick, easy killing/profit are much increased, though this appears to have been a case of “It’s got a GT3 badge on the engine cover, so there MUST be a profit in it”, rather than a measured bid after studying the market for some months.
I’d suggest any buyer needs to know the 996 GT3 market fairly intimately before dipping a toe into it at this stage of the proceedings ...
Yes, one thing I have learnt is so many old GT3's have wee stories to go along with them...(not mine thankfully)...and the older the R's get the same will apply.I’d suggest any buyer needs to know the 996 GT3 market fairly intimately before dipping a toe into it at this stage of the proceedings ...
The yellow 996 GT3 on CC was bought by Rindt and they had it for months...it has now disappeared - did it actually sell as with the amount of social media effort they put into advertising it and dropping the price I'd assumed a massive SOLD post would have been a fitting end to it all?
Had a go in my old R last weekend as it's had more mapping done bu new owner and she does fly!
I still love the challenge of the GT3 though.
Edited by Andyoz on Friday 16th September 19:05
Da Original Whyayedee said:
I’m in Bristol, the biggest issue for me with it is that it’s black.
That Cardiff one I think is solid black, not Basalt. Mine is solid black and they look great in my opinion, deep inky rich black. You might fall in love with it in person. Will you be going to see it?julian987R said:
Da Original Whyayedee said:
I just don’t like black cars of any variety
Surprised by that. Not even a classic black 930 Turbo?Fair enough.
Well that Cardiff one simply isn't for you then. Plenty of others for sale though.
julian987R said:
Surprised by that. Not even a classic black 930 Turbo?
Fair enough.
Well that Cardiff one simply isn't for you then. Plenty of others for sale though.
Nope, not for me. What I did say about the Cardiff car though is that it represented value compared to some of the others that came up, so you could budget for a quality respray and have it whatever colour you wanted, which would be a nice proposition. I am at risk of repeating myself here, but at £36k unless there is something else up with it, I am surprised it hasn't sold.Fair enough.
Well that Cardiff one simply isn't for you then. Plenty of others for sale though.
I'll be honest though, since going to look at one I have 997.1 GT3's on my mind and I can't shake that.
Da Original Whyayedee said:
I'll be honest though, since going to look at one I have 997.1 GT3's on my mind and I can't shake that.
If you have the budget for it then buy the GT3 no question. The R is a wonderful thing and way more than the sum of its parts. In "some" cases better to drive than the GT3 but the caveat to that statement is ive compared my modified R to a number of mostly stock 7.1 GT3s.The fact is the R will never be a GT3 and you will never cure that itch buying an R over the 911. The GT3 is a different league of visceral experience, do it while you can
frayz said:
The R is a wonderful thing and way more than the sum of its parts.
Is it more than the sum of it's parts? I'd describe it as literally the sum of it's parts when compared to a 987.2 S. If you buy a Cayman R that's not been optioned up with the good stuff like carbon seats, ceramics, etc it's essentially the same car?Escy said:
Is it more than the sum of it's parts? I'd describe it as literally the sum of it's parts when compared to a 987.2 S. If you buy a Cayman R that's not been optioned up with the good stuff like carbon seats, ceramics, etc it's essentially the same car?
Easy to say that about anything though isnt it. We all know the bits that make an R that little bit more special, ie seats, wheels etc. You're right its a Cayman S with some trinkets. But id argue they're a far more enjoyable ownership experience than a Cayman S with some trinkets.We all know its easy to mod an S to be way more capable than a stock R, but that doesn't tell the whole story does it.
People with a modified base model will always shout about how good their car is compared to the so called special edition in the same way an Android user will gloat about how much better their Samsung is than an iPhone.
I still dont want an Android.
Da Original Whyayedee said:
julian987R said:
Surprised by that. Not even a classic black 930 Turbo?
Fair enough.
Well that Cardiff one simply isn't for you then. Plenty of others for sale though.
Nope, not for me. What I did say about the Cardiff car though is that it represented value compared to some of the others that came up, so you could budget for a quality respray and have it whatever colour you wanted, which would be a nice proposition. I am at risk of repeating myself here, but at £36k unless there is something else up with it, I am surprised it hasn't sold.Fair enough.
Well that Cardiff one simply isn't for you then. Plenty of others for sale though.
I'll be honest though, since going to look at one I have 997.1 GT3's on my mind and I can't shake that.
I'd recommend it if you have empty roads where you can stretch it's legs. My modified R had more midrange punch so was probably more usable on some roads but I have access to stuff where I can open the GT3 up...with a GT3 the stuff happening at lower revs until about 5000 is just the prelude to that amazing race to 8000rpm top end (it would apply even more so in a 997.1 GT3).
They are very different driving experiences really...playing with the weight of the 911 more and the VERY mechanical feel of the GT3 drivetrain which has it origins from a totally different era to the Cayman R.
Don't discount 996.1 GT3 on stock (refreshed) suspension if it'll be predominantly road use. The suspension/tyre package is actually more compliant than an R and the early GT3's are more raw/playful at lower speeds than later GT3's. 997.1 GT3 has switchable suspension though I think?
Edited by Andyoz on Tuesday 20th September 09:44
Escy said:
frayz said:
The R is a wonderful thing and way more than the sum of its parts.
Is it more than the sum of it's parts? I'd describe it as literally the sum of it's parts when compared to a 987.2 S. If you buy a Cayman R that's not been optioned up with the good stuff like carbon seats, ceramics, etc it's essentially the same car?Gassing Station | Boxster/Cayman | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff