981 BGTS owner has loaded 781 BS for 2 days.......
Discussion
I think it does, Macan deliveries are also very long (especially Turbo and GTS variants) and allocations scarce, as they are for some of the more fruity 911's. Seems UK allocations are low pretty much across the board.
Plenty of people in the US getting their 718's delivered in 2-3 months (!)...typically a 9'ish month wait in the UK if you ordered late-2017 / early-2017...Porsche is certainly prioritising other markets at the moment.
The 718 delays are apparently due to moving production back to Stuttgart and out of the previous VW facility (reasons not clear from the internet but rumours around quality, distancing the Porsche brand from the recent VW scandal, improved capacity in Stuttgart and economies of scale - all 2-door Porsche cars are now built on the same production line I believe?).
Who knows, either way 718 allocations have been very low and factory capacity has also been limited during the same period so the flow of 718's into the UK in 2017 has been nothing more than a trickle to this point. Hopefully this will start to improve as the new production line gets up to full capacity.
Plenty of people in the US getting their 718's delivered in 2-3 months (!)...typically a 9'ish month wait in the UK if you ordered late-2017 / early-2017...Porsche is certainly prioritising other markets at the moment.
The 718 delays are apparently due to moving production back to Stuttgart and out of the previous VW facility (reasons not clear from the internet but rumours around quality, distancing the Porsche brand from the recent VW scandal, improved capacity in Stuttgart and economies of scale - all 2-door Porsche cars are now built on the same production line I believe?).
Who knows, either way 718 allocations have been very low and factory capacity has also been limited during the same period so the flow of 718's into the UK in 2017 has been nothing more than a trickle to this point. Hopefully this will start to improve as the new production line gets up to full capacity.
718 S you are not quite correct re 718 Production. Boxster is produced together with 911 at Stuttgart. Cayman production is at a VW plant in Osnabruck. The move to Osnabruck is the reason that Cayman delays have been longer than Boxster. I understand that Cayman WAS being moved to Stuttgart but this decision was changed late in the day - hence the apparent chaos! The Stuttgart factory is being expanded to produce Mission E so I guess this may have influenced the decision re Cayman production site since space for expansion is severely constrained at Stuttgart.
https://newsroom.porsche.com/en/products/porsche-c...
Things have indeed changed since, thanks for the info.
Things have indeed changed since, thanks for the info.
WG said:
718 S you are not quite correct re 718 Production. Boxster is produced together with 911 at Stuttgart. Cayman production is at a VW plant in Osnabruck. The move to Osnabruck is the reason that Cayman delays have been longer than Boxster. I understand that Cayman WAS being moved to Stuttgart but this decision was changed late in the day - hence the apparent chaos! The Stuttgart factory is being expanded to produce Mission E so I guess this may have influenced the decision re Cayman production site since space for expansion is severely constrained at Stuttgart.
Correct. Cayman was to be moved but then wasn't.It looks like Mr 718 S needs to check his facts or stop believing what his salesman tells him
Bit of a noob when it comes to cars - I buy cars on how they look, drive and tbh the interior cabin space; the 'feel' of the car is more important to me than the sound of the exhaust. I realize this is pistonheads, and I'm probs the complete opposite of the majority of users here.
I always wanted a 911, mainly because of how they look. But after driving one and a boxster I preferred the boxster.
Reading this thread, the Turbo element of the 718 seems to get a serious beating. But one thing confusing me, if Turbo is such a bad thing / a much worse drive why is the 911 Turbo the top one in the line up?
Told you I was a noob
I'm sure there's answer for this.
I always wanted a 911, mainly because of how they look. But after driving one and a boxster I preferred the boxster.
Reading this thread, the Turbo element of the 718 seems to get a serious beating. But one thing confusing me, if Turbo is such a bad thing / a much worse drive why is the 911 Turbo the top one in the line up?
Told you I was a noob
I'm sure there's answer for this. Tim718 said:
Reading this thread, the Turbo element of the 718 seems to get a serious beating. But one thing confusing me, if Turbo is such a bad thing / a much worse drive why is the 911 Turbo the top one in the line up?
Told you I was a noob I'm sure there's answer for this.
It's the fastest and most expensive, but I'd say the GT3/RS was the "top" one. Told you I was a noob
I'm sure there's answer for this. My 991 went in for bit of work a few weeks ago and the OPC lent me a 718 S Cayman.
I was really impressed. It sounded great - I don't have recent experience of 981 apart from my Spyder which has a different engine so can't compare, but I thought it was a really nice sound. Flat four's sound like flat four's, so I'm not surprised people think it sounds a bit like a Subaru and nothing like the old flat 6. But I don't think that's a bad.
The car's dynamics were typical of the latest Porsche's I've driven, really well sorted and better than anything else. It drives well in the conditions I drove it in. It's brilliantly balanced, feels really light and planted and rides nicely.
And it's fast. Really fast. I had a quick look on fastest laps. It's got the performance of a 996 Turbo!!!! I remember when they first came out - it was a proper supercar. And now the 718S is just as fast as yesterdays supercar.
If I was in the market for a new two-seater sports car, I can't think what I'd have instead.
I was really impressed. It sounded great - I don't have recent experience of 981 apart from my Spyder which has a different engine so can't compare, but I thought it was a really nice sound. Flat four's sound like flat four's, so I'm not surprised people think it sounds a bit like a Subaru and nothing like the old flat 6. But I don't think that's a bad.
The car's dynamics were typical of the latest Porsche's I've driven, really well sorted and better than anything else. It drives well in the conditions I drove it in. It's brilliantly balanced, feels really light and planted and rides nicely.
And it's fast. Really fast. I had a quick look on fastest laps. It's got the performance of a 996 Turbo!!!! I remember when they first came out - it was a proper supercar. And now the 718S is just as fast as yesterdays supercar.
If I was in the market for a new two-seater sports car, I can't think what I'd have instead.
Tim718 said:
Bit of a noob when it comes to cars - I buy cars on how they look, drive and tbh the interior cabin space; the 'feel' of the car is more important to me than the sound of the exhaust. I realize this is pistonheads, and I'm probs the complete opposite of the majority of users here.
I always wanted a 911, mainly because of how they look. But after driving one and a boxster I preferred the boxster.
Reading this thread, the Turbo element of the 718 seems to get a serious beating. But one thing confusing me, if Turbo is such a bad thing / a much worse drive why is the 911 Turbo the top one in the line up?
Told you I was a noob I'm sure there's answer for this.
The 981 fans aren't into it simple because of the noise the F6 makes. Most who don't like the 718 aren't say it's rubbish because of the engine, all the great attributes for both cars are there... it's the F6 v F4 that the divide. Prefence for one or the other. Or indifferent. I always wanted a 911, mainly because of how they look. But after driving one and a boxster I preferred the boxster.
Reading this thread, the Turbo element of the 718 seems to get a serious beating. But one thing confusing me, if Turbo is such a bad thing / a much worse drive why is the 911 Turbo the top one in the line up?
Told you I was a noob
I'm sure there's answer for this. HighwayStar said:
The 981 fans aren't into it simple because of the noise the F6 makes. Most who don't like the 718 aren't say it's rubbish because of the engine, all the great attributes for both cars are there... it's the F6 v F4 that the divide. Prefence for one or the other. Or indifferent.
Yep - the 718 actually drives great due to the excellent chassis. At the PEC handling wise it felt very similar to the Spyder to me due to the same steering rack from the 911 turbo being used. At the current price point it's hard to justify the engine for me, however. Obviously not helped by inflation / brexit effect on the pound.New Porsche customers coming through over the next few years probably won't care about the engine having 2 less cylinders as much as flat 6 fans but it might take a year or so for it all to settle in market wise. Times change.... (even if this is an emissions driven move)
As a used buy once they've depreciated I think it makes more sense, personally. I see them as more of a daily driver than a Sunday car that's really exciting.
This review is fairly close to how I felt about it:
https://www.topgear.com/videos/chris-harris-drives...
They are still great handling cars let's face it.
griffgrog said:
My 991 went in for bit of work a few weeks ago and the OPC lent me a 718 S Cayman.
I was really impressed. It sounded great - I don't have recent experience of 981 apart from my Spyder which has a different engine so can't compare, but I thought it was a really nice sound. Flat four's sound like flat four's, so I'm not surprised people think it sounds a bit like a Subaru and nothing like the old flat 6. But I don't think that's a bad.
The car's dynamics were typical of the latest Porsche's I've driven, really well sorted and better than anything else. It drives well in the conditions I drove it in. It's brilliantly balanced, feels really light and planted and rides nicely.
And it's fast. Really fast. I had a quick look on fastest laps. It's got the performance of a 996 Turbo!!!! I remember when they first came out - it was a proper supercar. And now the 718S is just as fast as yesterdays supercar.
If I was in the market for a new two-seater sports car, I can't think what I'd have instead.
That's how I'm feeling about the F4 at the moment, I'm really enjoying the sound, it's brutal. Part of it could be because it's so fresh to me, I've pretty much had the same sound/engine for 10 years (3 987's, 2 987.2's, and 2 981's). I was really impressed. It sounded great - I don't have recent experience of 981 apart from my Spyder which has a different engine so can't compare, but I thought it was a really nice sound. Flat four's sound like flat four's, so I'm not surprised people think it sounds a bit like a Subaru and nothing like the old flat 6. But I don't think that's a bad.
The car's dynamics were typical of the latest Porsche's I've driven, really well sorted and better than anything else. It drives well in the conditions I drove it in. It's brilliantly balanced, feels really light and planted and rides nicely.
And it's fast. Really fast. I had a quick look on fastest laps. It's got the performance of a 996 Turbo!!!! I remember when they first came out - it was a proper supercar. And now the 718S is just as fast as yesterdays supercar.
If I was in the market for a new two-seater sports car, I can't think what I'd have instead.
Sage words regarding new sales to non-existing Porsche owners. The majority of existing owners I have spoken to do not intend to change. Many are looking to the Carerra...........
Maybe that is what Porsche are looking to happen. Existing F6 owners move into the more lucrative (for Porsche) 911 ranges and the void is filled with newcomers to the brand, who over time, will be embraced by 911.
Maybe that is what Porsche are looking to happen. Existing F6 owners move into the more lucrative (for Porsche) 911 ranges and the void is filled with newcomers to the brand, who over time, will be embraced by 911.
Edited by Bennachie on Sunday 6th August 19:26
Here are a few of my thoughts after being given a 718 Boxster as a courtesy car whilst my 981 Boxster was in for a service; first impressions when I saw the 718 was very much the usual Porsche evolution rather than revolution approach, and Leeds OPC even gave me a white one! I would have to say that I was also very pleased with service from Leeds.
old meet new...
I was actually quite excited to be given a 718 after all of the disappointment so vocally expressed in forums and on the internet in general. The cabin, to me, felt pleasantly familiar, although I have a few more toys in my car. The PCM update is excellent though and made mine feel as dated as it is. I didn't like the feel of the new steering wheel with the little manettino dial - it felt very 'plasticky' to me, as did the unpainted parts of the exterior trim to be honest - although I'm sure that the unfinished look could be improved with optioning the external bits painted during the build. Otherwise, business as usual.
Well, I was very pleasantly surprised by the 4 cylinder in the non-s that I borrowed, and actually quite liked the noise, including all teh whooshing and what is presumably the dump valve when you lift off. I could certainly see why others have mentioned subaru, beetle and possibly even a hint of v-twin in there. Sports exhaust and auto blipping left me with mixed feelings in the 718 - not sure I would spec it. On the move I though the engine felt quite low down torquey, but began to get a little breathless higher in the rev range, just around the point where the old 6 cylinder starts to get into its stride. I'd also echo almost everyone else in saying that to my mind the new 718 motor doesn't sound as good as the older 981 with PSE on. But it went well, particularly given that it wasn't the 's' version and didn't feel that much slower than my 981. The new S must be quite rapid!
I also had a manual gearbox, which suits the 718 down to the ground and it was a lot of fun. I felt it could do with a 7th cruising gear though as on the motorway I was around 3k revs (please don't tell me that I missed 7th...) and that certainly hurt the fuel economy (av 31 - 36 mpg over the 2 days and couple of hundred miles I had it).
Just a couple of whitterings. But, I have to say that it is a great little car with a characterful engine, not at all what I was lead to expect by the internet. Would I change my 981 for a 718. No. I don't think it's worse, just needs to be thought of as different to the preceding generation IMO.
But, I really miss a manual gearbox (my 981 is a 2nd car but has PDK), and I'm now looking to change into a Spyder or GT4 if I can find a good 'un - damn you Porsche, I was quite happy with my 981 until tempted by you....
old meet new...
I was actually quite excited to be given a 718 after all of the disappointment so vocally expressed in forums and on the internet in general. The cabin, to me, felt pleasantly familiar, although I have a few more toys in my car. The PCM update is excellent though and made mine feel as dated as it is. I didn't like the feel of the new steering wheel with the little manettino dial - it felt very 'plasticky' to me, as did the unpainted parts of the exterior trim to be honest - although I'm sure that the unfinished look could be improved with optioning the external bits painted during the build. Otherwise, business as usual.
Well, I was very pleasantly surprised by the 4 cylinder in the non-s that I borrowed, and actually quite liked the noise, including all teh whooshing and what is presumably the dump valve when you lift off. I could certainly see why others have mentioned subaru, beetle and possibly even a hint of v-twin in there. Sports exhaust and auto blipping left me with mixed feelings in the 718 - not sure I would spec it. On the move I though the engine felt quite low down torquey, but began to get a little breathless higher in the rev range, just around the point where the old 6 cylinder starts to get into its stride. I'd also echo almost everyone else in saying that to my mind the new 718 motor doesn't sound as good as the older 981 with PSE on. But it went well, particularly given that it wasn't the 's' version and didn't feel that much slower than my 981. The new S must be quite rapid!
I also had a manual gearbox, which suits the 718 down to the ground and it was a lot of fun. I felt it could do with a 7th cruising gear though as on the motorway I was around 3k revs (please don't tell me that I missed 7th...) and that certainly hurt the fuel economy (av 31 - 36 mpg over the 2 days and couple of hundred miles I had it).
Just a couple of whitterings. But, I have to say that it is a great little car with a characterful engine, not at all what I was lead to expect by the internet. Would I change my 981 for a 718. No. I don't think it's worse, just needs to be thought of as different to the preceding generation IMO.
But, I really miss a manual gearbox (my 981 is a 2nd car but has PDK), and I'm now looking to change into a Spyder or GT4 if I can find a good 'un - damn you Porsche, I was quite happy with my 981 until tempted by you....
I have a 2 yr old 981 Boxster gts, fully loaded, and it's an amazing car, absolutely love it, but I change my car every 3 yrs so started looking for a replacement.
IMO it's one if the best sounding porsches ever, and my heart sank when I heard the 718 was a turbo 4pot, I knew we'd lose the sound, so I knew I probably wouldn't be able to just swap to a 718, but I'd still give it a go.
I did a pec Porsche range day and spent some time in the 718, and that secured my decision, it wasn't for me. I love the new look rear, not a fan of the front, not aggressive enough for me, but the gts should sort that like it did on the 981 gts. I like the new ICE, that's a decent upgrade.
The same day I drove a 911s (991.2), and decided that was really going to be my next car, but the gts version again. Really struggled to find a dealer with one, but finally managed it and decided to order one, so have gone for a 991.2 GTS cabriolet in viper green.
I just couldn't get excited with the 718 after the 981, even with the Improvements, the engine just kills it for me. The flat 6 turbo is a good compromise imo.
They might produce a decent sound on the 718 gts, but it's not going to make enough of a difference for me.
For me, the 718 is mainly going to appeal to people new to Porsche.
IMO it's one if the best sounding porsches ever, and my heart sank when I heard the 718 was a turbo 4pot, I knew we'd lose the sound, so I knew I probably wouldn't be able to just swap to a 718, but I'd still give it a go.
I did a pec Porsche range day and spent some time in the 718, and that secured my decision, it wasn't for me. I love the new look rear, not a fan of the front, not aggressive enough for me, but the gts should sort that like it did on the 981 gts. I like the new ICE, that's a decent upgrade.
The same day I drove a 911s (991.2), and decided that was really going to be my next car, but the gts version again. Really struggled to find a dealer with one, but finally managed it and decided to order one, so have gone for a 991.2 GTS cabriolet in viper green.
I just couldn't get excited with the 718 after the 981, even with the Improvements, the engine just kills it for me. The flat 6 turbo is a good compromise imo.
They might produce a decent sound on the 718 gts, but it's not going to make enough of a difference for me.
For me, the 718 is mainly going to appeal to people new to Porsche.
Davidkn said:
The same day I drove a 911s (991.2), and decided that was really going to be my next car, but the gts version again. Really struggled to find a dealer with one, but finally managed it and decided to order one, so have gone for a 991.2 GTS cabriolet in viper green.
That’s one heck of s financial leap! I’d go the same route as you (when the time comes), but there’s no way I could double the purchase cost of my GTS. Sadly. Davidkn said:
For me, the 718 is mainly going to appeal to people new to Porsche.
I’d go a step further and say ‘new to Porsche sports cars’. I’ve met a couple of people now with 718s and they have all come from (of all things) a Macan. I suppose really that could be stepped down further to ‘new to sports cars’....Although I'm a fan of the 911.2 engine, unfortunately the Cab is nothing like as stiff as the Boxster and it shows. Whereas you don't actually notice that the Boxster is much less stiff than the Cayman because the Cayman is needlessly stiff, the Cab shimmies over rough surfaces and that would be a killer for me. It doesn't feel like a £100k car to me.
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