The 718 GT4 might be arriving sooner than you think!

[Geoff39GL]

TrackNutz said:

Just occurred to me, for 20% more you can buy a used 991 GT3.

No hassle, no waiting lists, better engine, no GPF, true motorsport lump, proper suspension front and rear, proper sound.

I'm struggling to warm to the 718 GT4, think I'd even prefer a used 981 GT4 over the new one let alone a used GT3.

Wait until you get the Mags reports, this car will be a peach !!

[JayK12]

Dblue said:

JayK12 said:

GT4RS said:

TrackNutz said:

Just occurred to me, for 20% more you can buy a used 991 GT3.

No hassle, no waiting lists, better engine, no GPF, true motorsport lump, proper suspension front and rear, proper sound.

I'm struggling to warm to the 718 GT4, think I'd even prefer a used 981 GT4 over the new one let alone a used GT3.

Better engine in the old 991 gt3! Have you been sleeping under a rock?

And it’s only available in automatic....

Don’t rule the new gt4 4.0 out into you have actually driven it would be my advice.

Porsche always improves when it releases a new car and have done this time around.

I agree plenty of 991.1 GT3 at 100K now, circa 10K miles, and near enough 9K rev limit.

Depends on what gearbox you want but my money would be heading toward the GT3.

Did you not get the reference - this is the GT3 that had their engines replaced , sometimes more than once because of design faults. That carry additional 10 year warranties on the engines because of that. ???

9000rpm maybe but it was telling that the subsequent RS had that reduced to 8500rpm

If its under warranty what difference does that make?

[GT4RS]

JayK12 said:

Dblue said:

JayK12 said:

GT4RS said:

TrackNutz said:

Just occurred to me, for 20% more you can buy a used 991 GT3.

No hassle, no waiting lists, better engine, no GPF, true motorsport lump, proper suspension front and rear, proper sound.

I'm struggling to warm to the 718 GT4, think I'd even prefer a used 981 GT4 over the new one let alone a used GT3.

Better engine in the old 991 gt3! Have you been sleeping under a rock?

And it’s only available in automatic....

Don’t rule the new gt4 4.0 out into you have actually driven it would be my advice.

Porsche always improves when it releases a new car and have done this time around.

I agree plenty of 991.1 GT3 at 100K now, circa 10K miles, and near enough 9K rev limit.

Depends on what gearbox you want but my money would be heading toward the GT3.

Did you not get the reference - this is the GT3 that had their engines replaced , sometimes more than once because of design faults. That carry additional 10 year warranties on the engines because of that. ???

9000rpm maybe but it was telling that the subsequent RS had that reduced to 8500rpm

If its under warranty what difference does that make?

And when warranty is no longer who will
touch it!

You would need to be a brave man to chance that, even at 85k with no chance of a Porsche warranty it would be one hell of a gamble.

I guess only time will tell and there was a reason Porsche dropped the rs down by 500rpm and why they aren’t selling.

There’s been a low mileage CS car I’ve watched for over a year for sale, he’s tried to sell it privately twice then off to Jzm for 3 for 4 moths then back privately, last time I contacted him he said he was going to start using it.

Be shocked if a manual gt4 4.0 isn’t a step up in car technology over a 991.1.

£86k plus on the road cost gets you a great spec gt4 if you can get a new one for list and apparently if you listen to some on here they are going to make as many as they can sell which I personally think they won’t.

[JayK12]

If you keep renewing your OPC warranty wouldn't it continue to be covered? A 2014 will still have a few years engine warranty on it.

Step up in technology? Not sure thats a good thing.

GT3 will have more fizz over a GT4 imo. Thats where my money would go if it was between an 90K GT4 and a 100K GT3.

Each to there own.

[GT4RS]

JayK12 said:

If you keep renewing your OPC warranty wouldn't it continue to be covered? A 2014 will still have a few years engine warranty on it.

Step up in technology? Not sure thats a good thing.

GT3 will have more fizz over a GT4 imo. Thats where my money would go if it was between an 90K GT4 and a 100K GT3.

Each to there own.

As the GT pool of cars increases it will give more options for all, I’m sure if you go new gt4 or used gt3 for more both will not disappoint.

[av185]

Anyone who thinks even the new GT4 will have an engine anywhere nearing the capabilities of the 991.1 GT3 is deluded.

[GT4RS]

av185 said:

Anyone who thinks even the new GT4 will have an engine anywhere nearing the capabilities of the 991.1 GT3 is deluded.

Yawn

[av185]

Expected reaction from someone who has neither owned or driven both cars.

If you had you would immediately understand the major differences.

[freedman]

av185 said:

Expected reaction from someone who has neither owned or driven both cars.

If you had you would immediately understand the major differences.

So you've driven the new GT4 then? as your post implies, otherwise could you understand the major differences you assert to without doing so?

[TrackNutz]

GT4RS said:

Better engine in the old 991 gt3! Have you been sleeping under a rock?

And it’s only available in automatic....

Wow. You obviously haven't driven one. I won't waste my breath.

[GT4RS]

TrackNutz said:

GT4RS said:

Better engine in the old 991 gt3! Have you been sleeping under a rock?

And it’s only available in automatic....

Wow. You obviously haven't driven one. I won't waste my breath.

I was referring to the reliability issues we all know the 991.1 gt3 has and will be faced with in the future.

I assume you have obviously driven the new gt4 4.0 to make the above comment?

[GT4RS]

av185 said:

Expected reaction from someone who has neither owned or driven both cars.

If you had you would immediately understand the major differences.

Again here he or she’s goes, you seem to know more about me than myself!

Again my comment was about the reliability of the 991.1 gt3 engine. I guess I can expect this reaction from yourself as it has it been seem many times before. Unlike you I’m not here to bicker on who car is better than another’s due to not having ceramic brakes, lack of extended leather or label any car with more than 3000 miles on the clock from new as the millennium falcon!

Heres a question for you which you may choose to answer.

You are happy to say the new GT4 4.0 will not be up much and what a great disappointment you already think it is. I assume by saying this you haven driven one enough already to be able to make this statement? oh and just confirm I’m
yet to drive the new GT4 😊

Oh and one more question if you chose to answer.

You also mentioned on here recently, that you are going to try and order a new GT4 for yourself. Why would someone order a car which they think isn’t up to much and they think is a disappointment?

Is it because you just want to say you own one and how great you are for doing so and then try and sell it on at a small profit, I assume you will then come on here and say I sold it as it wasn’t up to your very high driving standards and couldn’t get on with the car and new it was going to be a disappointment.

Now Av185 remember this is a Internet forum so don’t get to worked up, life’s to short.

[TrackNutz]

GT4RS said:

I was referring to the reliability issues we all know the 991.1 gt3 has and will be faced with in the future.

I assume you have obviously driven the new gt4 4.0 to make the above comment?

Reliability? Assuming both cars have warranty of which they would, as owning either car you'd still pay the annual OPC warranty, then you have no argument at all. All engines were replaced for rod bolt issues and future chocolate valvetrains will be covered by warranty. End of. I imagine the 718 will have issues as every model does.

You obviously haven't driven one, so I highly suggest you do, rather than me list all the reasons why the 991.1 GT3 is a much better car than the 981 GT4 in every way.

Furthermore, with the 718 GT4 only being able to improve upon the chassis and a new PCM fundamentally, anyone who thinks the new 4.0 engine will be any closer to a proper motorsport engine is obviously blinded by marketing. They can't even put the real engine sounds in their videos, embarrassing. Step backwards for me with the added GPF and all of a sudden the GT3 makes every ounce of sense.

[Twinfan]

The biggest problem for me with the new 4.0, and the previous 3.8, is that it's clearly been limited in torque due to the gearbox Porsche are using. There must be all kinds of things going on to handicap it.

I don't think it'll make for a great engine, but we need to see what the journos say now they've driven the car at Knockhill.

[av185]

GT4RS just for the record I think the 718 GT4 will be a reasonable overall package for a GT Porsche although whether it will be value for money especially with a potential additional 10% Brexit surcharge making it effectively a £100k+ car is debatable. The engine will clearly be an improvement over the 981 with a higher rev limit and more torque which should help to override the problematic high gearing which as everyone knows was one of the drawbacks with the 981 GT4.

The one area where the 718 GT4 will most likely fall short is in the sound department which is an important consideration for a road car. Despite its non GT engine, the 981 GT4 nevertheless sounds good at both low and high speeds /revs furthermore it's sound is authentic and less contrived than the 981 Spyder.

Yes I am having a new GT4 for late Spring delivery subject to knowing the final post Brexit price and I think it will be a reasonable road car. Whilst I think the 981 GT4 gearbox and clutch is probably one of Porsches best and likely to be similar in the 718 (although I hope they don't make the clutch too light which imo it is in the 991.2 GT3...a worrying trend) I may spec PDK if it is PDK S at a 'reasonable' extra cost £ also subject to seeing the weight penalties and parasitic losses over the 'manuel'.

But you really need to drive a 981 GT4 and then a 991.1 GT3 followed by a 991.2 GT3 only after which you will be in a position to truly understand the major difference between these cars.

[Porsche911R]

Twinfan said:

The biggest problem for me with the new 4.0, and the previous 3.8, is that it's clearly been limited in torque due to the gearbox Porsche are using. There must be all kinds of things going on to handicap it.

I don't think it'll make for a great engine, but we need to see what the journos say now they've driven the car at Knockhill.

engine is ok imo, it revs higher than a 997 GT3 as an example ;-) and has more torque and there is not a bad thing is said about 997 GT3's !

it's the same gearing that sucks the life from these cars, but you can fit a short final drive a in a 997 GT3 and you cannot in the Cayman.

unlike the 991.2 RS models Porsche got the sound back by removing the 2 side boxes, the GT4 gains weight and losses noise as they cannot do anything with it to over come the filters like the GT3's and Speedsters !!

on paper it will have all the same issues as the older GT4 but with 2 added new ones, noise and extra weight !

weight was a great thing about the GT4 (as was the £64k price) as it made sure it was way below GT3's and you can feel weight every where. Adding weight to a GT product is never good news nor is removing noise.

I cannot under stand any one buying a GT4 at these new prices and extra negatives, over a 997.2 GT3 at todays prices ! if you are serious about owning a drivers GT product.

when I bought my GT4 there was a close to a £40k gap between the two, today if you spec PCCB on the GT4 that buys you a 997.2 GT3 !!

It's not even a choice is it ?

[Sandy59]

'The engine will clearly be an improvement over the 981 with a higher rev limit and more torque which should help to override the problematic high gearing which as everyone knows was one of the drawbacks with the 981 GT4'

I'm sure the new car will be a step up as always, but to be honest if I hadn't read about the high gearing or apparent engine limitations on here I'd never have realised these were actually issues to be bothered about.
I'll admit I'm probably a bit of an amateur in the scheme of things, all I can say is I've had great fun driving my 981 GT4 on road and track without thinking about either the engine, or gearbox ratios for one minute.

[isaldiri]

Twinfan said:

The biggest problem for me with the new 4.0, and the previous 3.8, is that it's clearly been limited in torque due to the gearbox Porsche are using. There must be all kinds of things going on to handicap it.

I don't think it'll make for a great engine, but we need to see what the journos say now they've driven the car at Knockhill.

But it's not the torque limit whether gearbox or artificially limited that imo handicaps the engine in any way. It's the way the power curve tails off after 7000rpm that made the older engine seem somewhat sluggish at the very top of the rev range. Even allowing for the published power curve being a bit unrepresentative (not unknown) the new engine looks to have mostly corrected that.

If people are looking for reasons to knock the engine I'm sure one can find them but take it for what it is and I think it'll be a pretty good engine, not as good as a gt3 (any gt3) one obviously but you are not paying gt3 prices either.....

[isaldiri]

Porsche911R said:

engine is ok imo, it revs higher than a 997 GT3 as an example ;-) and has more torque and there is not a bad thing is said about 997 GT3's !

it's the same gearing that sucks the life from these cars, but you can fit a short final drive a in a 997 GT3 and you cannot in the Cayman.

No the new engine does not rev higher than a 997 gt3.

And for all the moaning about gearing, the 981 gt4 will do similar in gear speeds to the mythical manual 991.2gt3.

[Twinfan]

av185 said:

The engine will clearly be an improvement over the 981 with a higher rev limit and more torque...

Just for clarity, there's no increase in the maximum torque available but the maximum is available over a wider rev range.

Edited by Twinfan on Wednesday 10th July 10:45