ECU tune a 718 2.0ltr?

[Filibuster]

Is it really true that in the UK you can basically tune your car to whatever you like??

Over here in Switzerland they are much, much more strict regarding tuning.
You need a type approval for every increase in power. This certificate can be obtained at vast costs.
It is divided in 3 stages:
1. < 20% increase in output
2. 20-40 % increase in output
3. > 40% increase in output

Even the first stage will cost you in excess of 5k £ and several months. Of course you have to meet all the emission regulations, etc. The >40% increase in power basically means a complete new type approval as if you'd built a car from scratch. Go figure what this will cost you!

A Tuner only needs to do this once of course and sell the chip with the certificate. But it needs to be done for every car; engine; drivetrain; bodytype (not sure); configuration separately. You can't use the one from an Audi TT for your VW Golf, although they are the exact same engine and drivetrain, for example.

This is why (chip-)tuning is horrendously expensive over here!

You void your type approval and thus your insurance if you have an illegally tuned car!
Imagine having an accident where the other party will need medical treatment for the rest of their life (touch wood). Your insurance will not pay out because your car is not road legal. You will be handing over every single penny you earn for the rest of your life to them, just because you wanted some more horses...
Not worth it!!

From a respectable tuner, yes, anytime!!

So are there really no boundaries in the UK regarding tuning? I know you have to inform your insurer (some are more relaxed than others I hear) but regarding your type approval is it really no problem??

[Twinfan]

Filibuster said:

Is it really true that in the UK you can basically tune your car to whatever you like??

...

So are there really no boundaries in the UK regarding tuning? I know you have to inform your insurer (some are more relaxed than others I hear) but regarding your type approval is it really no problem??

Correct. As long as the car passes an annual MOT test, you can do what you want.

[Porsche911R]

Twinfan said:

Correct. As long as the car passes an annual MOT test, you can do what you want.

old cars don't even need an MOT now which is mental !!!!

[Filibuster]

Twinfan said:

Filibuster said:

Is it really true that in the UK you can basically tune your car to whatever you like??

...

So are there really no boundaries in the UK regarding tuning? I know you have to inform your insurer (some are more relaxed than others I hear) but regarding your type approval is it really no problem??

Correct. As long as the car passes an annual MOT test, you can do what you want.

Wow! That is great!!

And all your C02 taxing system basically doesn't matter?

Because over here in Switzerland, theoretically you could be accused of tax fraud because your car emits more CO2 than you are paying taxes for.


Another reason why road taxes should purely be based on the size (footprint) and weight of your car.
Taxes based on CO2 should only be put on petrol and diesel, as this is the only accurate taxing on fuel consumption.

[Twinfan]

Only the car spec when it was new matters - after that, game on

[Porsche911R]

Filibuster said:

Wow! That is great!!

And all your C02 taxing system basically doesn't matter?

Because over here in Switzerland, theoretically you could be accused of tax fraud because your car emits more CO2 than you are paying taxes for.


Another reason why road taxes should purely be based on the size (footprint) and weight of your car.
Taxes based on CO2 should only be put on petrol and diesel, as this is the only accurate taxing on fuel consumption.

I think the manufacturer already fake the co2 lol as for road TAX, it's an out dated system, add TAX to petrol, it's a simple solution ie you drive more you pay more TAX !!!! nothing fairer than that.

[Filibuster]

Porsche911R said:

I think the manufacturer already fake the co2 lol as for road TAX, it's an out dated system, add TAX to petrol, it's a simple solution ie you drive more you pay more TAX !!!! nothing fairer than that.

hmmm... is that a broad hint I'm wrongly using the plural of TAX when not necessary?? (much appreciated, I eager to improve my english all the time!)

Oh, and I'm absolutely with you regarding road TAX!

[gtsralph]

Porsche911R said:

I think the manufacturer already fake the co2 lol as for road TAX, it's an out dated system, add TAX to petrol, it's a simple solution ie you drive more you pay more TAX !!!! nothing fairer than that.

For every winner there is a loser.

In this case enthusiasts who drive their cars pay more than 'collectors' who sell a 200 mile 3 year old car for an untaxed profit.

Paying for usage is OK in principle but should profit on such sales be untaxed?

[Porsche911R]

gtsralph said:

For every winner there is a loser.

In this case enthusiasts who drive their cars pay more than 'collectors' who sell a 200 mile 3 year old car for an untaxed profit.

Paying for usage is OK in principle but should profit on such sales be untaxed?

it's a small market, profit on private sales over road tax ! and not possible to put anything into place easy.

Tax on fuel is easy and fair. Also a collector will be paying £2k 1st to tax a car and £540 a year there after so a 10 car collection nets £20k in tax and £5,400 year after year. lets not work out the VAT on that collection also paid !

As it's road tax only paying for road use is again fair. I did 200 miles in my 987 Spyder last year but paid the same tax on that car as a rep doing 45k miles in that BMW !!!

I also have 5 cars so my road tax is mental PA these cars for cars to sit about unused.

Edited by Porsche911R on Friday 18th May 11:04

[Honeywell]

The 400bhp Boxster is achievable for the price of the stereo upgrade plus 18 way Seats.

http://www.evo.co.uk/porsche/718-boxster/19188/tec...

The 993 Turbo had 402bhp....

[gtsralph]

Porsche911R said:

it's a small market, profit on private sales over road tax ! and not possible to put anything into place easy.

Tax on fuel is easy and fair. Also a collector will be paying £2k 1st to tax a car and £540 a year there after so a 10 car collection nets £20k in tax and £5,400 year after year. lets not work out the VAT on that collection also paid !

As it's road tax only paying for road use is again fair. I did 200 miles in my 987 Spyder last year but paid the same tax on that car as a rep doing 45k miles in that BMW !!!

I also have 5 cars so my road tax is mental PA these cars for cars to sit about unused.

Edited by Porsche911R on Friday 18th May 11:04

Valid perspective but with 5 cars you’d save and be a winner and with my 2 I’d lose.

[Porsche911R]

gtsralph said:

Valid perspective but with 5 cars you’d save and be a winner and with my 2 I’d lose.

I am not looking at it from winners and losers. I am looking at it being fair use.

not sure any one would loose really.

[homerdog]

dreamcar said:

Well you feel free, tune your car and play Russian roulette with your money. Just don’t expect Porsche to pick up the bill over any issues!

I've owned plenty of tuned cars over the years and never had a problem with any of them, nor with the dealers who have had to fix faults that have nothing to do with the tuning.

But thanks for the patronising lecture!

[Far Cough]

Filibuster said:

Is it really true that in the UK you can basically tune your car to whatever you like??

Over here in Switzerland they are much, much more strict regarding tuning.
You need a type approval for every increase in power. This certificate can be obtained at vast costs.
It is divided in 3 stages:
1. < 20% increase in output
2. 20-40 % increase in output
3. > 40% increase in output

Even the first stage will cost you in excess of 5k £ and several months. Of course you have to meet all the emission regulations, etc. The >40% increase in power basically means a complete new type approval as if you'd built a car from scratch. Go figure what this will cost you!

A Tuner only needs to do this once of course and sell the chip with the certificate. But it needs to be done for every car; engine; drivetrain; bodytype (not sure); configuration separately. You can't use the one from an Audi TT for your VW Golf, although they are the exact same engine and drivetrain, for example.

This is why (chip-)tuning is horrendously expensive over here!

You void your type approval and thus your insurance if you have an illegally tuned car!
Imagine having an accident where the other party will need medical treatment for the rest of their life (touch wood). Your insurance will not pay out because your car is not road legal. You will be handing over every single penny you earn for the rest of your life to them, just because you wanted some more horses...
Not worth it!!

From a respectable tuner, yes, anytime!!

So are there really no boundaries in the UK regarding tuning? I know you have to inform your insurer (some are more relaxed than others I hear) but regarding your type approval is it really no problem??

How would anyone know ? With all the remote via email tuning that is available these days that come with a gadget to put it all back to stock I cant see how anyone would find out ?

[Filibuster]

Far Cough said:

How would anyone know ? With all the remote via email tuning that is available these days that come with a gadget to put it all back to stock I cant see how anyone would find out ?

In a severe accident, your vehicle gets taken by the police and inspected for road worthiness. Plugging in a laptop and checking for any fault/log data would be fairly standard procedure today, or so I would have thought. If using a tuning box, it is even more easy to spot.
Granted these are all minimal chances, and you'd have to be extremely unlucky, but my point still stands. And of course they would make an example of you in order to scare off others. At the end of the day it simply comes down to being illegal.

[alan718Gts]

dreamcar said:

Well you feel free, tune your car and play Russian roulette with your money. Just don’t expect Porsche to pick up the bill over any issues!

I had a Remap, intercooler and decat downpipes on my 2008 335i twin turbo version, ran a tune from 30k miles to 90k miles. Never had a problem and it ran strongly when i sold it. Maintainece plays a big part for the engine. So modern ECU tuning isn’t as dangerous as you might think.

[dreamcar]

homerdog said:

dreamcar said:

Well you feel free, tune your car and play Russian roulette with your money. Just don’t expect Porsche to pick up the bill over any issues!

I've owned plenty of tuned cars over the years and never had a problem with any of them, nor with the dealers who have had to fix faults that have nothing to do with the tuning.

But thanks for the patronising lecture!

I’m not being patronising by disagreeing surely? Usual Pistonheads insults when someone disagrees! Regarding warranty claims, as an example the dynamic power train mounts have a history of failing in these cars, i’ve had one go and know several others that have. The cost of replacement by a Porsche dealer is around £1,200. You take your modded car into them for a warranty claim for this failure, they will check for any engine mods and if found - well Porsche won’t be paying.

[alan718Gts]

dreamcar said:

I’m not being patronising by disagreeing surely? Usual Pistonheads insults when someone disagrees! Regarding warranty claims, as an example the dynamic power train mounts have a history of failing in these cars, i’ve had one go and know several others that have. The cost of replacement by a Porsche dealer is around £1,200. You take your modded car into them for a warranty claim for this failure, they will check for any engine mods and if found - well Porsche won’t be paying.

Surely those who mod wouldn’t expect warranty to pay for anything that is modifield. The term Pay to play comes to mind. There is always risk involved. The dynamic mounts failing, how much would take be cause by a 10% increase in engine power? Anyway I’ve been looking at Techart techtronic powerkit and it cost like 2.9k Euro and they take over the warranty for engine and drive train. Maybe that is worth it?

[Honeywell]

I’m never convinced the warranty is worth the money once the car is over 3 years old. It’s just an insurance product and it wouldn’t be offered unless on average more got paid out than got paid in...

Little point in tuning a NA Porsche but the new fourand six cylinder turbos offer a big gain for not much pain.

It seems like the abritish OPC network has the customer base tightly held on a short leash to the point where dealers tell customers what to option, only allow certain customers to buy certain cars and act with disdain to anything a few years old or modified. It’s not the most appealing aspect of the brand to be honest.

[homerdog]

dreamcar said:

I’m not being patronising by disagreeing surely?

Your comment was the very definition of patronising! Which is fine, you can say what you like, but try not to get upset when I point it out!