Discussion
bcr5784 said:
I am a firm believe in the Colin Chapman ethos of adding lightness AND softness.
I've been searching for this quote from him but only find this page here. I've always been told this by a friend but today decided to search for it and can't find it. Did he really talk about softness?The one I know about, and I don't know if the attribution is entirely correct, is:
"Any suspension, no matter how poorly designed, can be made to work reasonably well if you just stop it from moving." - Colin Chapman
So kind of the same thing, but only kind of
If you drive any Lotus from the era when he was directly involved the road cars, they were really compliant, and rolled quite a bit, but had exquisite suspension and steering geometry in the main.
The first Boxster I drove was a base 718 when they first came out, and it really reminded me of 1960's and early 70's Lotuses for the suspension compliance, coupled with relatively unflappable steering on bumps and potholes. I was initially surprised how much it rolled when I first picked up the pace on a roundabout, but as soon as it hit a lumpy bit, I thought, "ah, like a Lotus." For some reason it was quite a relief not to be thinking, "ah, like an air-cooled 911."
That was back in 2016. I'm now on my 2nd and 4th Caymans. For lumpy UK road use the base 718 with 18" wheels and PASM is unbeatable in my humble opinion, but somehow the 1st and 3rd were both that, and I no longer own either of them. Still, soon be wintery enough to put 18"s on the 4.0 GTS.
Liam
"Any suspension, no matter how poorly designed, can be made to work reasonably well if you just stop it from moving." - Colin Chapman
So kind of the same thing, but only kind of
If you drive any Lotus from the era when he was directly involved the road cars, they were really compliant, and rolled quite a bit, but had exquisite suspension and steering geometry in the main.
The first Boxster I drove was a base 718 when they first came out, and it really reminded me of 1960's and early 70's Lotuses for the suspension compliance, coupled with relatively unflappable steering on bumps and potholes. I was initially surprised how much it rolled when I first picked up the pace on a roundabout, but as soon as it hit a lumpy bit, I thought, "ah, like a Lotus." For some reason it was quite a relief not to be thinking, "ah, like an air-cooled 911."
That was back in 2016. I'm now on my 2nd and 4th Caymans. For lumpy UK road use the base 718 with 18" wheels and PASM is unbeatable in my humble opinion, but somehow the 1st and 3rd were both that, and I no longer own either of them. Still, soon be wintery enough to put 18"s on the 4.0 GTS.
Liam
LiamH66 said:
"Any suspension, no matter how poorly designed, can be made to work reasonably well if you just stop it from moving." - Colin Chapman
Surely if you stop it from moving then you are stiffening it?I have down sized wheels and tyres on my 981 so now run 18 with smaller tyres than OE. It has the soft passive dampers too - no PASM. It is easily the softest car I have. This pic shows the tiny-ness of them the best.
It's a tongue in cheek statement. Stiffening suspension gives an illusion of improving bad geometry control, because any lack of control (e.g. bump steer) is minimised by the lack of movement. Hence "no matter how poorly designed".
It really is an illusion, because suspension that's too stiff stops being suspension, and doesn't allow the wheels to follow the contours and bumps of the surface, so unless the track is really smooth, reduces overall grip. Chapman's suspension designs and specifications were clearly made in complete opposition to that comical adage, as they were anything but poorly designed.
Liam
It really is an illusion, because suspension that's too stiff stops being suspension, and doesn't allow the wheels to follow the contours and bumps of the surface, so unless the track is really smooth, reduces overall grip. Chapman's suspension designs and specifications were clearly made in complete opposition to that comical adage, as they were anything but poorly designed.
Liam
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