12 GT4's for sale on PistonHeads and growing (Vol. 2)

[TDT]

Don’t think we should talk about this particular car anymore. Waste of time.

[dougle_turbo]

04BAP said:

Really enjoying some of these posts, for me I would be getting control arms,shims to run more camber, lower the car as much as I could get away with, front 2 piece brake disc, braided lines, dot 6 brake fluid, rs 29 brake pads then learn to drive the car to 80% of its capabilities, then I would be fairly confident I would be pissing past most things on a track day, but to give a insight in times on 3 different tracks Bedford, Snetterton, Donnington which I have done with my standard 981 GT4 with a aim solo timer against my clubsport E46 M3 with AP PRO brakes, intrax 1k2 suspension, slick tyres and a few other trick track orientated bits, Bedford, GT4 2.52 then thrown off for noise, M3 2.46, Donny GT4,1.23, M3 1.19 and Snetterton GT4 2.16, M3, 2.10, the M3 is 360bhp, 285 torque and about 120kg heavier than the GT4, I have run sticky road going tyres at snetty with a time of 2.13 in the M3, the new 781 clubsport GT4 done some testing at Snetterton early this year with a best time of 2.02 on slicks, so with a few changes to my standard 981 GT4 on the new cup 2s I will be hoping to get very close to the M3 times if not better, I would consider my times in the E46 M3 decent for a clubsport road car but let you be the judge of that, just got to wait for the warranty to run out on the GT4 then all systems go then look forward to using the car as intended, to get back on thread who cares what the price of a 981 GT4 is, great value for what ever you pay for it

Edited by 04BAP on Monday 20th April 20:40

Edited by 04BAP on Monday 20th April 20:46

Thanks for posting these times - you don't often see actual times on here for any sort of comparison/benchmark. I have a 987.2 that's had some tweaks on the engine + geo, designed to approach GT4 levels of performance. My best times are as follows - Bedford best is 2:51, Donnington 1:23, Snetterton 2:19, Spa 2:57 (first time there, but what a track). I realise that we are comparing different driver etc, but I assume we both have some solid track experience so I'll take this a sure sign of progress for the 987.2.

Apologies to the OP for going off-topic.

[04BAP]

dougle_turbo said:

Thanks for posting these times - you don't often see actual times on here for any sort of comparison/benchmark. I have a 987.2 that's had some tweaks on the engine + geo, designed to approach GT4 levels of performance. My best times are as follows - Bedford best is 2:51, Donnington 1:23, Snetterton 2:19, Spa 2:57 (first time there, but what a track). I realise that we are comparing different driver etc, but I assume we both have some solid track experience so I'll take this a sure sign of progress for the 987.2.

Apologies to the OP for going off-topic.

It looks like you are going in the right direction, tyres are a game changer if you have all the goodies on the car as I am sure you are well aware of, changing camber,brakes and running slick tyres on the GT4 from standard form I would expect it to be a lot quicker

[JasonSteel]

just curious - had badly would aero be affected if one removed the wing from a GT4?

[TDT]

JasonSteel said:

just curious - had badly would aero be affected if one removed the wing from a GT4?

For the road, it’ll make zero difference.

On track you may feel the difference on high speed (80mph+) corners.... the effect will be that the rear will be loose relative to the front that will still have the splitter lip...unless you also change that out for a 981 Spyder lip.....but actually you are just going to end up losing performance capacity on track.

[JasonSteel]

TDT said:

For the road, it’ll make zero difference.

On track you may feel the difference on high speed (80mph+) corners.... the effect will be that the rear will be loose relative to the front that will still have the splitter lip...unless you also change that out for a 981 Spyder lip.....but actually you are just going to end up losing performance capacity on track.

so not a safety issue at all then.

what % hit in performance on track do you think?

[TDT]

JasonSteel said:

TDT said:

For the road, it’ll make zero difference.

On track you may feel the difference on high speed (80mph+) corners.... the effect will be that the rear will be loose relative to the front that will still have the splitter lip...unless you also change that out for a 981 Spyder lip.....but actually you are just going to end up losing performance capacity on track.

so not a safety issue at all then.

what % hit in performance on track do you think?

Safety is relative to whether or not you can deal with rear instability during high speed cornering. As the front will have comparatively more grip vs the rear, potentially make in the rear feel loose in those situations.

Performance depends on the circuit and the driver.
On tight and twisty circuits… aero is not a factor at all at the levels that these road cars produce.
Then it also depends on whether you as a driver are maximising mechanical grip and going quicker enough over a lap where having aero grip would make a difference.

On longer straights taking the wing off might actually allow you to hit a higher top speed (2 -5mph), e.g Hanger or Kemmel, .… due to no drag from the wing. If you then have a high speed corner after that… car might be comparatively more unstable on entry and through the corner vs having the wing.

The car has been design to be balanced front to rear. If you take away from one side the car will be unbalanced in particular situations.

Edited by TDT on Sunday 26th April 10:36

[finmac]

My mate took the rear wing off his 997 RS as he thinks it’s a bit too in your face and he doesn’t like the look. Has run it on road only for years like that!

[JasonSteel]

TDT said:

Safety is relative to whether or not you can deal with rear instability during high speed cornering. As the front will have comparatively more grip vs the rear, potentially make in the rear feel loose in those situations.

Performance depends on the circuit and the driver.
On tight and twisty circuits… aero is not a factor at all at the levels that these road cars produce.
Then it also depends on whether you as a driver are maximising mechanical grip and going quicker enough over a lap where having aero grip would make a difference.

On longer straights taking the wing off might actually allow you to hit a higher top speed (2 -5mph), e.g Hanger or Kemmel, .… due to no drag from the wing. If you then have a high speed corner after that… car might be comparatively more unstable on entry and through the corner vs having the wing.

The car has been design to be balanced front to rear. If you take away from one side the car will be unbalanced in particular situations.

thanks for the info. i would definitely explore this option if it presents itself but so much uncertainty right now so this is lowest priority.

in the meantime for those interested:

https://imgur.com/a/Cx9EgXL

[JasonSteel]

finmac said:

My mate took the rear wing off his 997 RS as he thinks it’s a bit too in your face and he doesn’t like the look. Has run it on road only for years like that!

also some photos around of 991 GT3's with wing delete looking great.

[Porsche911R]

finmac said:

My mate took the rear wing off his 997 RS as he thinks it’s a bit too in your face and he doesn’t like the look. Has run it on road only for years like that!

makes you wonder why people buy them in the 1st place !

[finmac]

Porsche911R said:

finmac said:

My mate took the rear wing off his 997 RS as he thinks it’s a bit too in your face and he doesn’t like the look. Has run it on road only for years like that!

makes you wonder why people buy them in the 1st place !

Not really, it’s still a GT3 RS, still has full buckets, cage, lighter glass etc etc. He still drives it like he stole it - just doesn’t have the massive rear wing.

[boxsey]

dougle_turbo said:

Thanks for posting these times - you don't often see actual times on here for any sort of comparison/benchmark. I have a 987.2 that's had some tweaks on the engine + geo, designed to approach GT4 levels of performance. My best times are as follows - Bedford best is 2:51, Donnington 1:23, Snetterton 2:19, Spa 2:57 (first time there, but what a track). I realise that we are comparing different driver etc, but I assume we both have some solid track experience so I'll take this a sure sign of progress for the 987.2.

Apologies to the OP for going off-topic.

Those are some extremely impressive times for a 987. Especially the time for Spa. A friend who I regard as a very quick driver and has done a lot of days at Spa in various Pork has only managed 3.01 in his Cayman R (supersport tyres).

[dougle_turbo]

boxsey said:

Those are some extremely impressive times for a 987. Especially the time for Spa. A friend who I regard as a very quick driver and has done a lot of days at Spa in various Pork has only managed 3.01 in his Cayman R (supersport tyres).

Thanks! I've still got a few more tweaks I'd like to get sorted on the car. LSD being at the top of the list. My car runs Eagle F1 Supersports, impressive tyre in both the dry and wet. Hopefully, I'll get to Spa again this year for round 2. Youtube lap below, not quite the quickest of the day but the most tidy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXibKJcp5X0

As good as my 987 is I still find my self looking for a GT4. This one, in particular, is stunning.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

Edited by dougle_turbo on Wednesday 29th April 18:09

[Jim1556]

It's lovely, but strong money for a non Clubsport with 24k miles - unless you really want Porsche Green...?

BTW, nice lap! Not had chance to go to Spa myself, the Nurburgring has too big a magnet for me at the mo (plus time constraints).

At the end of the lap, it looked like your tyres were a little overheated? Not saying they were as you're probably far more experienced than me on track - but, I had this issue on the Nurburgring GP circuit on my road tyres (MPSS) after a 15 min stint (E46 M3). Had Cup 2s on for track since, night and day better when they're up to temp!

Anyway, sorry for going off topic...

Edited by Jim1556 on Wednesday 29th April 21:33

[Armitage.Shanks]

dougle_turbo said:

As good as my 987 is I still find my self looking for a GT4. This one, in particular, is stunning.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

The owner of that car is a PH member I believe who has a 'collection' of green GT4? I have to say that car does look outstanding and has dropped in price a lot from where it started.

[boxsey]

dougle_turbo said:

Thanks! I've still got a few more tweaks I'd like to get sorted on the car. LSD being at the top of the list. My car runs Eagle F1 Supersports, impressive tyre in both the dry and wet. Hopefully, I'll get to Spa again this year for round 2. Youtube lap below, not quite the quickest of the day but the most tidy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXibKJcp5X0

As good as my 987 is I still find my self looking for a GT4. This one, in particular, is stunning.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/202...

Edited by dougle_turbo on Wednesday 29th April 18:09

Haha fun end to the lap! Your speed through blanchimont is very impressive.

The green GT4 is in indeed stunning. The only thing missing for me is the sports chrono. It doesn't add anything performance wise but the clock it gives you on the dash just finishes it off IMO. And I totally disagree with Jim, at £68.5K it's a lot of car for the money.

[woollyjoe]

Green GT4 is special - great spec and suits bright colours.

I could never buy a bright coloured car - it simply attracts Police attention. I have GT Silver and 4 times stopped by Police. Once I got blues and twos doing 20mph in central London (on way back from detailers) and the “car caught caught our eye” and wanted to “make sure it wasn’t stolen”. Every time “car is bright”, “popped up”. They were honest - it’s human nature for the eye to be drawn to the things which stand out.

so now stick to black and dark coloured cars.

[Porsche911R]

woollyjoe said:

Green GT4 is special - great spec and suits bright colours.

I could never buy a bright coloured car - it simply attracts Police attention. I have GT Silver and 4 times stopped by Police. Once I got blues and twos doing 20mph in central London (on way back from detailers) and the “car caught caught our eye” and wanted to “make sure it wasn’t stolen”. Every time “car is bright”, “popped up”. They were honest - it’s human nature for the eye to be drawn to the things which stand out.

so now stick to black and dark coloured cars.

" I have GT Silver and 4 times stopped by Police"

seems slivers not working for you either !

[JohnGK]

I have Lightening Mcqeen and never get stopped, maybe I drive too sedately.