944T/968 how many years owned?
Discussion
16 valve get's very expensive & I'm trying to keep my a matching numbers car. I'm using a SFR big-valve N/A head, SFR intake manifold & with modern ECU & modern turbo - it will be enough.
Torque is more important than power & besides the 951/952 gearbox isn't designed for 500+ bhp. I've ditched the Porsche chocolate diff in favour of the Guard LSD & am using a KEP Stage I PP & clutch.
I'm happy to have spent money on the dry sump system & the closed -deck Darton liners rather than the 16 valve head which would require complete rebuilding with bronze valve guides, new seats, new valves, new cams, new springs, retainers & ideally a twin pulley system rather than the original exhaust> intake cam chain take-off.
Torque is more important than power & besides the 951/952 gearbox isn't designed for 500+ bhp. I've ditched the Porsche chocolate diff in favour of the Guard LSD & am using a KEP Stage I PP & clutch.
I'm happy to have spent money on the dry sump system & the closed -deck Darton liners rather than the 16 valve head which would require complete rebuilding with bronze valve guides, new seats, new valves, new cams, new springs, retainers & ideally a twin pulley system rather than the original exhaust> intake cam chain take-off.
I don't know - I'll be limited by boost & rpm. I'm doing everything I can to improve efficiency except for a 16 valve head.
It will have a 70mm TB, Web 274 cam, rebuilt lifters, SFR intake, SFR Stage 4 N/A big-valve head, SFR Stage 2 FMIC with 2.5" intercooler pipes, SFR Stage 1 headers but full 3" down pipe, no cat & 3" exhaust with only a Borla XR-1 back box.
The exhaust to the turbo has been Zircotec ceramic coated.
I'd like to get to 500 fwhp after running in and at around 21- 22 psi.
I'm intending to run at at no more than 18 psi with a 6.5K rev limit - all in the interests of durability.
If Jon Mitchell was seeing 417 fwbhp & 425 lb/ft from his 2.5 litre which had less modifications than this - then I'm hoping this 2.7 litre with the Garrett GTX3576R Gen 2 (Tial 0.82 housing) will add at least another 80 fwhp.
Those are the aspirations after running in & post run-in mapping.
As you say, more than 400 lb/ft of torque will be tough on the gearbox, especially in 1st & 2nd which means that tight tracks will really stress the box. It will really be better suited to fast, flowing open circuits where you're in 3rd & higher more of the time.
It will have a 70mm TB, Web 274 cam, rebuilt lifters, SFR intake, SFR Stage 4 N/A big-valve head, SFR Stage 2 FMIC with 2.5" intercooler pipes, SFR Stage 1 headers but full 3" down pipe, no cat & 3" exhaust with only a Borla XR-1 back box.
The exhaust to the turbo has been Zircotec ceramic coated.
I'd like to get to 500 fwhp after running in and at around 21- 22 psi.
I'm intending to run at at no more than 18 psi with a 6.5K rev limit - all in the interests of durability.
If Jon Mitchell was seeing 417 fwbhp & 425 lb/ft from his 2.5 litre which had less modifications than this - then I'm hoping this 2.7 litre with the Garrett GTX3576R Gen 2 (Tial 0.82 housing) will add at least another 80 fwhp.
Those are the aspirations after running in & post run-in mapping.
As you say, more than 400 lb/ft of torque will be tough on the gearbox, especially in 1st & 2nd which means that tight tracks will really stress the box. It will really be better suited to fast, flowing open circuits where you're in 3rd & higher more of the time.
That's it - that's why I decided that the 8 valve head - if optimised - would give me all the power & torque (a) I need; (b) the car can feasibly put down using R-spec rubber; (c) the remainder of the drivetrain can handle.
I've been in close contact with Chris White who sourced the Mahle pistons for me (custom build).
Once you go to 16 valve you're very much on your own in terms of prepping the head for a turbo motor, prepping an ECU solution, fabricating bespoke intake & exhaust manifolds, ordering custom pistons etc - and really a a top notch 8 valve will be sufficient for 95% of people.
Durability & reliability are key, hence dry-sumping, closed-deck liners, strong oil cooling for the engine & transaxle, a sophisticated ECU & a fuel system that won't run out of capacity & has redundancy should it experience a pump failure at boost.
Besides - you have to make a call on budget, spec & expectations & not go down the slippery slope of scope creep & financial ruin.
It's too easy for the project to either (a) never get started; (b) never get finished - so momentum is key.
I've been in close contact with Chris White who sourced the Mahle pistons for me (custom build).
Once you go to 16 valve you're very much on your own in terms of prepping the head for a turbo motor, prepping an ECU solution, fabricating bespoke intake & exhaust manifolds, ordering custom pistons etc - and really a a top notch 8 valve will be sufficient for 95% of people.
Durability & reliability are key, hence dry-sumping, closed-deck liners, strong oil cooling for the engine & transaxle, a sophisticated ECU & a fuel system that won't run out of capacity & has redundancy should it experience a pump failure at boost.
Besides - you have to make a call on budget, spec & expectations & not go down the slippery slope of scope creep & financial ruin.
It's too easy for the project to either (a) never get started; (b) never get finished - so momentum is key.
Standard seats - wanted to keep recline for access to the back , retain long distance comfort, make access & egress easy & retain the sleeper look.
The only give-aways for this car will be:
(1) Sits lower;
(2) Nose panel may have 924 turbo grills (undecided);
(3) 18" Hollow-spoke 993 or Fuchs wheels (have both sets) with 225/40 & 265/35 Yokohama A048 & A052;
(4) 4" tail pipe;
(5) Big Blacks;
(6) Hump in the carpet under the boot (for dry-sump tank) - boot floor was re-fabricated.
The only give-aways for this car will be:
(1) Sits lower;
(2) Nose panel may have 924 turbo grills (undecided);
(3) 18" Hollow-spoke 993 or Fuchs wheels (have both sets) with 225/40 & 265/35 Yokohama A048 & A052;
(4) 4" tail pipe;
(5) Big Blacks;
(6) Hump in the carpet under the boot (for dry-sump tank) - boot floor was re-fabricated.
The SFR exhaust is never narrower then 3" (even the down pipe) - it comes with a 4" tail pipe - so not my choice.
I'm not concerned too much about weight - if I was I'd start with a different platform.
In terms of cheap wait saving - I'm down to 73 kg & I'm 180 cm tall - running 65-78km /week - so that's the first weight saving!
If you run the numbers the total weight difference between a pair of PP's & the electric seats is about 30kg. On a drive to the 'Ring, Spa, Monza or Imola the Recaro's may get wearying.
The vented nose panel may not happen - I've told Robert Gant not to bother if it's too much trouble.
He refused to fit the carbon fibre vented nose panel I provided as he said the fit was S**t.
I'm not concerned too much about weight - if I was I'd start with a different platform.
In terms of cheap wait saving - I'm down to 73 kg & I'm 180 cm tall - running 65-78km /week - so that's the first weight saving!
If you run the numbers the total weight difference between a pair of PP's & the electric seats is about 30kg. On a drive to the 'Ring, Spa, Monza or Imola the Recaro's may get wearying.
The vented nose panel may not happen - I've told Robert Gant not to bother if it's too much trouble.
He refused to fit the carbon fibre vented nose panel I provided as he said the fit was S**t.
Triple fuel pumps - one Bosch 044 as a lift pump from the tank to the swirl pot & then dual 044's (with inline filters) working in parallel from the swirl pot to the fuel rail.
If a highly tuned turbo motor suffers a fuel pump failure under boost the resultant starvation can cause piston-melting detonation.
If a highly tuned turbo motor suffers a fuel pump failure under boost the resultant starvation can cause piston-melting detonation.
Belt & braces on the fuel system - but I agree the ECU should catch it - but catastrophic engine failure can happen in the blink of any eye if the temperatures, pressures & rpm are high enough.
I do the odd triathlon for fun - but I've been running since I was a kid, but really shoes ought to be replaced every 500 miles - not that I do!
In terms of modding the 952 - in hindsight I probably won't do it if I'd known what's required to do a proper job.
I do the odd triathlon for fun - but I've been running since I was a kid, but really shoes ought to be replaced every 500 miles - not that I do!
In terms of modding the 952 - in hindsight I probably won't do it if I'd known what's required to do a proper job.
Yeah, think carefully about what you want & are comfortable spending. A tuned 2.5 with new pistons, rods, honed alusil bores, ECU & Turbo is probably the best VFM of the available options.
I think around 400 fwhp is plenty in these cars, which are light by modern standards.
It’s all diminishing returns after that.
I think around 400 fwhp is plenty in these cars, which are light by modern standards.
It’s all diminishing returns after that.
Mine had 134K miles when I bought it.
The interior was fine & I had two new front wings put on & some paint work done before it went into dehumidified storage.
Now everything was removed from the shell, ( engine, transmission, torque tube, suspension, brakes, fuel tank etc) every bearing replaced, all gaskets, everything replated, new radiator, oil coolers, intercooler, steering rack, power steering pump, alternator, starter motor, clutch master & slave cylinders, brake master cylinder, brake servo etc.
Your sounds like it's been well maintained - mine was ok but getting a little tired.
The interior was fine & I had two new front wings put on & some paint work done before it went into dehumidified storage.
Now everything was removed from the shell, ( engine, transmission, torque tube, suspension, brakes, fuel tank etc) every bearing replaced, all gaskets, everything replated, new radiator, oil coolers, intercooler, steering rack, power steering pump, alternator, starter motor, clutch master & slave cylinders, brake master cylinder, brake servo etc.
Your sounds like it's been well maintained - mine was ok but getting a little tired.
That sounds an awsome car!
Well, at the other end of the scale you pair have inspired me to source a VW coil pack with built in ignitors so I can have a play with a wasted spark setup. I'm not totally convinced but if I never have to bugger around with the stupid spring fasteners on the dizzy again then it might be worth it.
I'm still waiting for decent weather to swap the front hub assemblies to the later type. I have the hubs ready to go with fresh bearings.
Well, at the other end of the scale you pair have inspired me to source a VW coil pack with built in ignitors so I can have a play with a wasted spark setup. I'm not totally convinced but if I never have to bugger around with the stupid spring fasteners on the dizzy again then it might be worth it.
I'm still waiting for decent weather to swap the front hub assemblies to the later type. I have the hubs ready to go with fresh bearings.
Blade7, good idea! I resorted to unbolting the whole housing, then fitted the cap.
With your car and mileage I'd be reluctant to modify it .
Mine as you'll remember is never going to be original or mint, rough would be a fair description. I have no qualms messing about with it, using it for tip runs or MTB transport. Can a lux still be had for sensible money? Might be a good home for all those 3litre goodies you've been hoarding?
With your car and mileage I'd be reluctant to modify it .
Mine as you'll remember is never going to be original or mint, rough would be a fair description. I have no qualms messing about with it, using it for tip runs or MTB transport. Can a lux still be had for sensible money? Might be a good home for all those 3litre goodies you've been hoarding?
I just spotted this advert on marketplace for a 3.0 engine.
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/28190159...
Could be worth it for some parts for someone.
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/28190159...
Could be worth it for some parts for someone.
Bit late to this thread but I bought my S2 in 2005 and ran it as a daily in London until last year. Did almost exactly 100,000 miles on it in that time, changed the head gasket and clutch and rebuilt the suspension (twice).
ULEZ has priced me off the road so I bought a 987 Cayman as a replacement daily and have put the 944 into a garage for now. I'll bring her out some time in the future when either I've moved out of London or she's old enough to be ULEZ-exempt (i.e. 40 years old).
My 987 is a lovely car. But I still prefer the 944. (Shame I can't drive her!)
ULEZ has priced me off the road so I bought a 987 Cayman as a replacement daily and have put the 944 into a garage for now. I'll bring her out some time in the future when either I've moved out of London or she's old enough to be ULEZ-exempt (i.e. 40 years old).
My 987 is a lovely car. But I still prefer the 944. (Shame I can't drive her!)
2Btoo said:
Bit late to this thread but I bought my S2 in 2005 and ran it as a daily in London until last year. Did almost exactly 100,000 miles on it in that time, changed the head gasket and clutch and rebuilt the suspension (twice).
ULEZ has priced me off the road so I bought a 987 Cayman as a replacement daily and have put the 944 into a garage for now. I'll bring her out some time in the future when either I've moved out of London or she's old enough to be ULEZ-exempt (i.e. 40 years old).
My 987 is a lovely car. But I still prefer the 944. (Shame I can't drive her!)
Still driving my 944 t daily in London for the moment, I reckon the classic insurance offsets the future ulez to a large degreeULEZ has priced me off the road so I bought a 987 Cayman as a replacement daily and have put the 944 into a garage for now. I'll bring her out some time in the future when either I've moved out of London or she's old enough to be ULEZ-exempt (i.e. 40 years old).
My 987 is a lovely car. But I still prefer the 944. (Shame I can't drive her!)
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