Discussion
carspath said:
R8Steve----I totally understand that a 355 is a car.
The point I was making is that you cannot treat it like a 2010 R8
Yes, both are cars , but one was designed to be pretty much an everyday car , and one was patently not.
This surely does not need further explanation or clarification to anyone who has had personal experience in dealing with low production volume Italian cars of the 70's ,80's or 90's (and beyond)
The OP presumably came here for some clear-headed, practical advice , and it does him no favours to bleat on about ''its just a car, so just use it ''
In my case , a 355 which had been meticulously serviced , and never gave any problems over a 10 year period , would not start after being left out (the first time during my ownership ) in the rain for 48 hours
A small amount of water had got into the electronics as well as the spark plug wells , and the cost to diagnose and repair the resultant fault came to over £2500
I believe this documented personal experience should be of greater value to the OP , in answer to his question , than a bleat
I understand your point, but as I posted above my personal experience - I used it is a daily driver in London, left it outside and treated it just like any other car - it did not break as a result - actually I first had to sort out some stuff it developed in the beginning due to not being driven enough previously. I think 20-25k miles is a sufficiently large sample size. The only time it broke down was at the beginning of my ownership due to a broken CV joint. The point I was making is that you cannot treat it like a 2010 R8
Yes, both are cars , but one was designed to be pretty much an everyday car , and one was patently not.
This surely does not need further explanation or clarification to anyone who has had personal experience in dealing with low production volume Italian cars of the 70's ,80's or 90's (and beyond)
The OP presumably came here for some clear-headed, practical advice , and it does him no favours to bleat on about ''its just a car, so just use it ''
In my case , a 355 which had been meticulously serviced , and never gave any problems over a 10 year period , would not start after being left out (the first time during my ownership ) in the rain for 48 hours
A small amount of water had got into the electronics as well as the spark plug wells , and the cost to diagnose and repair the resultant fault came to over £2500
I believe this documented personal experience should be of greater value to the OP , in answer to his question , than a bleat
Edit: I think they still can be used "just like any other car", one just has to accept the higher servicing costs and keep on top of potential issues - 355 was easier to drive than my FF thanks to smaller size
Edited by MDL111 on Friday 28th July 10:54
Hi MDL111,
I entirely agree with your own documented experience that there are 355's that are left outside ,and they appear to do fine.
I was just trying to do the OP a service and explain that I had not been so fortunate in the 1 instance that I had left the car standing in the rain
I drove the 355 in torrential rain on more than a few occasions without any problems , so my limited sample and limited experience would suggest that its when the car is stationary that the opportunity is created for water to collect in the spark-plug wells----apparently a known prob with the 2.7's
I really enjoy reading PH, but the one thing that I pick up on , is the notion that cars are there only to be driven, at every opportunity irrespective ----surely there is so much more that can be appreciated about any given car----be it the ease of the manual hood mechanism on the early MX5 , the guillotine doors of the countach, the shape of the murcie the carbon weave of the X Bow
Also I cannot understand the idea that driving in the (at least the southern ) UK after 6.30 am is any fun at all-----the roads are just too congested with other cars , and cameras , for that to be the case
Most of the cars in this particular section of PH , only come alive past a certain rev and speed point , and are as dull as ditch-water before that.
What i think I need for a really good drive , is not a supercar , but clear roads, and you can now get a decent series1 mx5 for £3k and a cheap alarm clock for £0.50
I entirely agree with your own documented experience that there are 355's that are left outside ,and they appear to do fine.
I was just trying to do the OP a service and explain that I had not been so fortunate in the 1 instance that I had left the car standing in the rain
I drove the 355 in torrential rain on more than a few occasions without any problems , so my limited sample and limited experience would suggest that its when the car is stationary that the opportunity is created for water to collect in the spark-plug wells----apparently a known prob with the 2.7's
I really enjoy reading PH, but the one thing that I pick up on , is the notion that cars are there only to be driven, at every opportunity irrespective ----surely there is so much more that can be appreciated about any given car----be it the ease of the manual hood mechanism on the early MX5 , the guillotine doors of the countach, the shape of the murcie the carbon weave of the X Bow
Also I cannot understand the idea that driving in the (at least the southern ) UK after 6.30 am is any fun at all-----the roads are just too congested with other cars , and cameras , for that to be the case
Most of the cars in this particular section of PH , only come alive past a certain rev and speed point , and are as dull as ditch-water before that.
What i think I need for a really good drive , is not a supercar , but clear roads, and you can now get a decent series1 mx5 for £3k and a cheap alarm clock for £0.50
carspath said:
Hi MDL111,
I entirely agree with your own documented experience that there are 355's that are left outside ,and they appear to do fine.
I was just trying to do the OP a service and explain that I had not been so fortunate in the 1 instance that I had left the car standing in the rain
I drove the 355 in torrential rain on more than a few occasions without any problems , so my limited sample and limited experience would suggest that its when the car is stationary that the opportunity is created for water to collect in the spark-plug wells----apparently a known prob with the 2.7's
I really enjoy reading PH, but the one thing that I pick up on , is the notion that cars are there only to be driven, at every opportunity irrespective ----surely there is so much more that can be appreciated about any given car----be it the ease of the manual hood mechanism on the early MX5 , the guillotine doors of the countach, the shape of the murcie the carbon weave of the X Bow
Also I cannot understand the idea that driving in the (at least the southern ) UK after 6.30 am is any fun at all-----the roads are just too congested with other cars , and cameras , for that to be the case
Most of the cars in this particular section of PH , only come alive past a certain rev and speed point , and are as dull as ditch-water before that.
What i think I need for a really good drive , is not a supercar , but clear roads, and you can now get a decent series1 mx5 for £3k and a cheap alarm clock for £0.50
fully agree with you - now live in Germany and Austria and driving here is a lot more enjoyable than it was in the UK. Having said that I still much preferred sitting in traffic in London to sharing the tube with what felt like most of London in the morning and evening. At least I could here the clack clack all the time - clack - first - clack neutral - clack first .... repeat about a hundred times each way I entirely agree with your own documented experience that there are 355's that are left outside ,and they appear to do fine.
I was just trying to do the OP a service and explain that I had not been so fortunate in the 1 instance that I had left the car standing in the rain
I drove the 355 in torrential rain on more than a few occasions without any problems , so my limited sample and limited experience would suggest that its when the car is stationary that the opportunity is created for water to collect in the spark-plug wells----apparently a known prob with the 2.7's
I really enjoy reading PH, but the one thing that I pick up on , is the notion that cars are there only to be driven, at every opportunity irrespective ----surely there is so much more that can be appreciated about any given car----be it the ease of the manual hood mechanism on the early MX5 , the guillotine doors of the countach, the shape of the murcie the carbon weave of the X Bow
Also I cannot understand the idea that driving in the (at least the southern ) UK after 6.30 am is any fun at all-----the roads are just too congested with other cars , and cameras , for that to be the case
Most of the cars in this particular section of PH , only come alive past a certain rev and speed point , and are as dull as ditch-water before that.
What i think I need for a really good drive , is not a supercar , but clear roads, and you can now get a decent series1 mx5 for £3k and a cheap alarm clock for £0.50
I also enjoyed looking at it and thinking about how to modify it to my taste (read lighten it) .... sth that is not possible in Germany due to TUV being rather more difficult that an MOT
God I miss that car ... might have to buy one again even if they are a little pricey now (now that I have the FF for winter/snow, it could be a summer car and live a - slightly - easier life)
enjoy in good health
carspath said:
drove the 355 in torrential rain on more than a few occasions without any problems , so my limited sample and limited experience would suggest that its when the car is stationary that the opportunity is created for water to collect
Yes. My 40 year old 308's fine in the rain. Like the 355, it has a forest of louvres on the engine cover, but these disperse water well when moving and the coils have additional rain covers to protect them. But I wouldn't leave the car standing for too long in a downpour. I carry a simple car cover for overnights in bad weather. Aside from that, avoid the temptation to boot it, even after bad weather clears, as the rear could easily let go if you catch standing water at the wrong moment.
A couple of months ago, we did a 5 day road trip around North Wales in our 250GTE. No traction control or power anything in that, and yes it did rain. Not an issue though unless you insist on driving like a loon, and a hot engine bay keeps all the moisture from doing any monkey business. The only thing that concerned me was leaving it out overnight in the rain, and I bought a large waterproof car cover from Halfords to keep the weather out. I don't know if that was overkill, but the car started first turn every time and ran pretty much faultlessly throughout.
Have to say I was a bit worried about whether we'd make it, but it was fine and we had an absolute blast.
Have to say I was a bit worried about whether we'd make it, but it was fine and we had an absolute blast.
carspath said:
..........Also I cannot understand the idea that driving in the (at least the southern ) UK after 6.30 am is any fun at all-----the roads are just too congested with other cars , and cameras , for that to be the case
Most of the cars in this particular section of PH , only come alive past a certain rev and speed point , and are as dull as ditch-water before that......
What a complete load of generalised nonsense!Most of the cars in this particular section of PH , only come alive past a certain rev and speed point , and are as dull as ditch-water before that......
You don't have to drive a 355 (or any Ferrari for that matter), in the UK at massively high speeds to enjoy it fully! (or only before 6.30 am).
Where I live, there are plenty of twisty A and B roads with no cameras on them, with "S" bends, fast sweeping bends, tight hairpins, short straights and such like, on which you can enjoy a 355 without any need to be doing massively high speeds (in fact, through some of the corners you'd be hard pushed to take them at 30~40mph, but in second gear, feeling the car grip and rotate beneath you, you'll have a massive smile on your face!)
You make it sound as though everyone in the UK should just buy a 1 litre Ford Fiesta and forget any thoughts of buying a car capable of getting anywhere near the National speed limit as they will just spend their all of their time barely bumbling along in nose to tail traffic!
The reality is, the UK has plenty of roads that can be enjoyed in a Ferrari without the need for stupidly high speeds!
4rephill----did you take the time to read and assimilate what I wrote , before calling it generalised rubbish ?
3 simple points :
1. I specifically said REV POINT ----are you really telling me that a 355 (or in your case a 348 ) , is as exciting to drive at 3500 as it is at 7500 ?
Have you ever looked at the torque and power curves that are at the back of your owner's handbook ?---they tell you an important story
2. At medium to high revs , you are approaching the legal speed limit in 2nd gear in a 355 I think (I sold my 355 about 2 years ago, so am not sure about the exact figures)
3. Your ''where I live'' comment , is really immaterial-------most of us who live in the south of the UK (again, I was specific about location in my posting ) are cursed with traffic-laden , and camera-infested roads-----certainly my ''car friends'' share this sentiment , so I suspect it is a wide-spread feeling.
You might be lucky in where you live in this regard , but many/most of us don't share this good fortune------so where you live and the access you personally have to good , clear roads at all times of the day is irrelevant to the rest of us. Incidentally , where is this nirvana?.
So the only time to get relatively empty roads , is early in the morning.
And yes , it really is much much more fun revving a 1.6 litre 24 year old mx5 through the gears, than pootling about in 2 gears in a Ferrari , at a fraction of that car's rev range ( all while trying to keep your license intact )
3 simple points :
1. I specifically said REV POINT ----are you really telling me that a 355 (or in your case a 348 ) , is as exciting to drive at 3500 as it is at 7500 ?
Have you ever looked at the torque and power curves that are at the back of your owner's handbook ?---they tell you an important story
2. At medium to high revs , you are approaching the legal speed limit in 2nd gear in a 355 I think (I sold my 355 about 2 years ago, so am not sure about the exact figures)
3. Your ''where I live'' comment , is really immaterial-------most of us who live in the south of the UK (again, I was specific about location in my posting ) are cursed with traffic-laden , and camera-infested roads-----certainly my ''car friends'' share this sentiment , so I suspect it is a wide-spread feeling.
You might be lucky in where you live in this regard , but many/most of us don't share this good fortune------so where you live and the access you personally have to good , clear roads at all times of the day is irrelevant to the rest of us. Incidentally , where is this nirvana?.
So the only time to get relatively empty roads , is early in the morning.
And yes , it really is much much more fun revving a 1.6 litre 24 year old mx5 through the gears, than pootling about in 2 gears in a Ferrari , at a fraction of that car's rev range ( all while trying to keep your license intact )
Agreed south UK roads are congested and not much fun in peak times, you can seek out the odd B or A road that can give you the nice empty roads.
As regarding taking 355 out in rain, personally I don't do it, I have done a few occasions but it's no fun for me, Car is twitchy and I had back slide out once which was scary, so you can't really enjoy in rain and I'm always thinking about poor car getting wet. I would not advise leaving it stationary in heavy down pours. My 355 is a spider and gas done 14k miles and I really like to keep it in good shape so I now only really take it out in dry.
As regarding taking 355 out in rain, personally I don't do it, I have done a few occasions but it's no fun for me, Car is twitchy and I had back slide out once which was scary, so you can't really enjoy in rain and I'm always thinking about poor car getting wet. I would not advise leaving it stationary in heavy down pours. My 355 is a spider and gas done 14k miles and I really like to keep it in good shape so I now only really take it out in dry.
Behemoth---I don't have any experience with a 308 , but I suspect that you are completely correct when you say that it can be revved through at least the first 3 gears , while staying relatively legal, and while enjoying the high rev music.
That generation of supercar was more in tune with today's roads (again , I am talking about the south of England) , in that the lower power and torque numbers , and the gearing make it more appropriate for enjoyable driving in today's conditions
My current feeling , is that it is the sense acceleration is what gives me the biggest thrill (and a short burst doesn't offend Plod)
Putting aside the big,heavy and expensive hitters , the most affordable way to get this acceleration is by going for a road biased track-day car----something narrow , open to the elements and sub 800kg with 200bhp+ , would do the trick
Enjoy the 308
OP ---how did the w/e go?
Did you take the 355 ?
That generation of supercar was more in tune with today's roads (again , I am talking about the south of England) , in that the lower power and torque numbers , and the gearing make it more appropriate for enjoyable driving in today's conditions
My current feeling , is that it is the sense acceleration is what gives me the biggest thrill (and a short burst doesn't offend Plod)
Putting aside the big,heavy and expensive hitters , the most affordable way to get this acceleration is by going for a road biased track-day car----something narrow , open to the elements and sub 800kg with 200bhp+ , would do the trick
Enjoy the 308
OP ---how did the w/e go?
Did you take the 355 ?
It was a great weekend thanks and yes I did take the 355. Journey there had a moderate amount of rain which required sensible driving but the journey home was nigh on completely dry and thus a huge amount of fun. While I was away there was a large amount of rain but the £4.99 tarp from Wickes kept the engine bay perfectly dry while I wasn't using the car. It didn't look good but did the job.
Ironically the only issue I had was the drivers side windscreen wiper broke due to the bolt attaching the minor arm to the windscreen appearing to shear off. This was easily solved by taping the 2 arms together but I am going to need to get this sorted at the next service.
Thanks to all the PHers on here for advice.
Ironically the only issue I had was the drivers side windscreen wiper broke due to the bolt attaching the minor arm to the windscreen appearing to shear off. This was easily solved by taping the 2 arms together but I am going to need to get this sorted at the next service.
Thanks to all the PHers on here for advice.
I also had my 355 out this weekend (Silverstone Classic), met up with some car nut friends who arrived in interesting cars, so, it would of been rude not to take the 355, it was wet at points but driven appropriately for conditions at the time all without drama, but don't we do that regardless of car driven? It ran faultlessly and put a smile on my and taz turbo juniors faces on many occasions.
It ticked past the 35K miles on route, so with that in mind and that it got wet I guess it's now rendered basically scrap!
It's now back in its's heated dehumidified garage and looking great, with a belt service booked with John Greatorex booked in imminently life is good.
Chris.
It ticked past the 35K miles on route, so with that in mind and that it got wet I guess it's now rendered basically scrap!
It's now back in its's heated dehumidified garage and looking great, with a belt service booked with John Greatorex booked in imminently life is good.
Chris.
carspath said:
What I would be much more concerned (and I speak from bitter experience ), is leaving the car out in the pouring rain for 48 hours
the only time I had a breakdown in the 10 years , was following just such park-up , and it was neither cheap nor easy to fix the problem
the are vent all along the rear engine cover, and water just pours in
Not just 355s either, the 360 spider suffers the same issue.... water pours through the slats into the engine bay and directly onto lots of electrical connectors...the only time I had a breakdown in the 10 years , was following just such park-up , and it was neither cheap nor easy to fix the problem
the are vent all along the rear engine cover, and water just pours in
For this reason I always leave mine under a cover, though beyond that I have no issue driving it in any weather condition.
taz turbo said:
It ticked past the 35K miles on route, so with that in mind and that it got wet I guess it's now rendered basically scrap!
Chris.
If yours is scrap then I dread to think about mine... approaching 53K now and I'm taking it to Italy at the end of this month.Chris.
Assuming it makes the round trip back home I guess I may as well just get it crushed when I get back :-)
Current owner:
I have taken it out in heavy rain a few times - just be careful. It twitched a bit crossing the white lines on the M1 and it got covered in mud on a B-road, but it cleaned up ok. My main problem with rain is that to be able to get out of it in the garage I have to take the roof off (GTS), so if it is raining when I want to put it away I have to be quick!
I have taken it out in heavy rain a few times - just be careful. It twitched a bit crossing the white lines on the M1 and it got covered in mud on a B-road, but it cleaned up ok. My main problem with rain is that to be able to get out of it in the garage I have to take the roof off (GTS), so if it is raining when I want to put it away I have to be quick!
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