458 v 488 market

[f1z]

Rari said:

What is your ideal spec F1z.....?

I'm not too picky. I might be the odd one out who would actually prefer the comfort seats over the carbons as they do give me some lower back pain. Reverse cam would also convenient as I plan to daily drive it but most have the parking sensors which is fine. There's no specific color im looking at so its whatever comes up. I may hold out to see how spider prices do and just roll into one of them if its in that 135-140k range as I am big fan of open roof cars.

My thought process doesn't at all consider re-sale value. I am just purely looking for a car to run the miles up and have no care what its price will be if I ever do sell.

Edited by f1z on Friday 21st April 21:12

[col68]

Had been out of the Ferrari scene for a while, having owned 360, 430, 458 and 488 in the past. Bought an approved 458 coupe with a great spec in February and just think the car hits the sweet spot in so many ways, in my opinion the current cars styling and adoption of hybrid tech holds no appeal to me. The 458 still drives like a modern car, most of my friends who are not up on cars assume it’s brand new….

[Chad_Hugo]

I can relate to that, when I collected my 458 this time last year and some neighbours (who are not really into cars, and have no knowledge of Ferrari's) saw it for the first time and we got talking about the car they did not believe me when I told them it was almost 10 years old.

To this day they still don't!! Really is one of the most stunning modern Ferrari's, the design was just perfect...

OP, some advice on spec:

The 'standard' seats are great and if you see a car you like spec/price/miles/condition wise don't be put off for a second by lack of buckets. The standard seats also have the advantage of being fully adjustable electric memory seats, heated too (think that was extra?), so they give you a far greater degree of flexibility which you would want if you plan to use the car daily. The rear camera for me was a must have, despite it's somewhat odd angle and position in terms of what it displays, quite a wide lens. Front not so much as it's a short car and easy to place (unlike a V12 for e.g.) with excellent ground clearance. Not that many cars have both camera's as they were seperate options. Look for one with rear though if you can, many do have it. You don't need the suspension lifter IMO. The ground clearance as mentioned is excellent, probably among the best you will see on an out and out supercar.

[caminator11]

I'm also thinking about either a 488 or a 458 spider for the summer. Leaning towards a 488 because I'm coming out of a 720s and I think even though its not as pure as a 458 I'll still be getting an upgrade in noise.

Am I likely to lose my shirt buying one directly from Ferrari used if I want to move it on in say 6-12 months?

[garystoybox]

caminator11 said:

I'm also thinking about either a 488 or a 458 spider for the summer. Leaning towards a 488 because I'm coming out of a 720s and I think even though its not as pure as a 458 I'll still be getting an upgrade in noise.

Am I likely to lose my shirt buying one directly from Ferrari used if I want to move it on in say 6-12 months?

Not really….. I’d guess £25-£30k for a years ownership with dealer spread. Possible private sale as still 12 months warranty remaining (2 year compulsory on approved).
The approved warranties on cars up to 7 years are now the same as factory warranty and cover absolutely everything, unlike the previous power warranty.

[Gibbo205]

caminator11 said:

I'm also thinking about either a 488 or a 458 spider for the summer. Leaning towards a 488 because I'm coming out of a 720s and I think even though its not as pure as a 458 I'll still be getting an upgrade in noise.

Am I likely to lose my shirt buying one directly from Ferrari used if I want to move it on in say 6-12 months?

Yes main dealers are adding anywhere between 15-30k profit on the cars, in short if you give them 160k for a 488, six months later they will happily take it back off you for circa 130k.

Buy private and split the difference I say.

[caminator11]

Wow - thats a serious margin. It explains why dealers have been so incredibly lovely and accommodating so far on my search!!

If anyone wants to offload their 488 spider let me know!

[Chad_Hugo]

You shouldn't and won't lose your shirt!

The car won't depreciate, if you do the average miles most 458/488 spyders do in a year.

The dealer margin is 15k-20k in most cases, so if you sell it back to the dealer that's the 'cost', but that's only assuming you need a very quick sale and have to have the money right away.

Most dealers offer SOR, there are many trustworthy places. Many Ferrari dealers offer SOR too.

If you are prepared to wait a few months, all you have as a cost is a much more modest SOR fee 3.5k-5k.

Obviously timing/luck plays a role. If you buy in winter and sell in spring/summer it makes the process even more favorable to you.

[Gibbo205]

Chad_Hugo said:

You shouldn't and won't lose your shirt!

The car won't depreciate, if you do the average miles most 458/488 spyders do in a year.

The dealer margin is 15k-20k in most cases, so if you sell it back to the dealer that's the 'cost', but that's only assuming you need a very quick sale and have to have the money right away.

Most dealers offer SOR, there are many trustworthy places. Many Ferrari dealers offer SOR too.

If you are prepared to wait a few months, all you have as a cost is a much more modest SOR fee 3.5k-5k.

Obviously timing/luck plays a role. If you buy in winter and sell in spring/summer it makes the process even more favorable to you.

If buying from a dealer to suggest only losing 15-20k is very conservative. I know a few people who work in the game and the dealer margins are generally far great than 15-20k now on a 150k car, part due to greed but also because those lovely shiny dealerships have had an explosion in running cost, energy cost increase, staffing cost increase it all needs paying for.

So if you go into a dealership, buy a 170k 488 Spider, then six months later want to hand it back during Winter, even worse say the markets slip more you could seriously only be looking at a 120k trade offer !

Hence why it is better to try and buy privately for circa 150k, then that 120k trade offer is less damaging (30k), even better sell it private yourself for a fair competitive price, say 140k and you have lost 10k.

Buy smart, sell smart!

Some dealers are fair, also never pay ticket price, but remember some dealers are really taking the mickey with their profits.
One Ferrari dealer was trying to offer me less on my 458 than WBAC on a part-ex against an 812, absolute jokers, the market is slowing and it is becoming a buyers markets again, so buy aggressively.

[South tdf]

Someone I know has just sold their 488 Spider to a main dealer, beautiful car but I could not get my head around how much the dealer paid for it compared to where I saw it’s value when I had first refusal.

[Spleen]

South tdf said:

Someone I know has just sold their 488 Spider to a main dealer, beautiful car but I could not get my head around how much the dealer paid for it compared to where I saw it’s value when I had first refusal.

Go on then, tell us.

[speedbird1000]

sold an F12 I had for 5 years and couple months back got a low miles 458 with racing seats lots of carbon. OMG.. is my reaction, its a low slung go kart rocket ship thing...and the magnificent sounding engine revs so sweetly to a massive 9k (my ex 4 L GT3 was more "strained" at high revs). Then that the Engine is pretty well in the cabin with you ...is really great...
Verdict vastly more fun than the more serious F12 which is a bit more GT like, 458 is just a more youthful innocent like feeling. Looked at a load of 488s, beautiful looking, great specs, fab prices now but that 458 - i never selling that, its so joyful my little pocket rocket, i think prices will climb strongly soon aided by rarity, desirability and inflation.

[WCZ]

speedbird1000 said:

sold an F12 I had for 5 years and couple months back got a low miles 458 with racing seats lots of carbon. OMG.. is my reaction, its a low slung go kart rocket ship thing...and the magnificent sounding engine revs so sweetly to a massive 9k (my ex 4 L GT3 was more "strained" at high revs). Then that the Engine is pretty well in the cabin with you ...is really great...
Verdict vastly more fun than the more serious F12 which is a bit more GT like, 458 is just a more youthful innocent like feeling. Looked at a load of 488s, beautiful looking, great specs, fab prices now but that 458 - i never selling that, its so joyful my little pocket rocket, i think prices will climb strongly soon aided by rarity, desirability and inflation.

Completely agree, the 458 is all you need on roads realistically. The speciale is the icing on the cake but any further power or capability is largely wasted and isn’t anymore fun

[speedbird1000]

I found stepping i to 458 from f12 actually a bit scary. I was pretty confident in f12 and respected the only real danger on cold/worn rear tyres... rear end can step out at full bore... a long way ...even in Sport, and all in a heart beat as so free revving. But the 458 feels more the race car and tempts you more to dart in and out here and there in places the heavier V12 just did not. Then my insurer telling me 458 much higher crash risk, i get the picture now. A lot more self restraint needed I finding and on more windy roads 458 a total weapon.

[f1z]

speedbird1000 said:

I found stepping i to 458 from f12 actually a bit scary. I was pretty confident in f12 and respected the only real danger on cold/worn rear tyres... rear end can step out at full bore... a long way ...even in Sport, and all in a heart beat as so free revving. But the 458 feels more the race car and tempts you more to dart in and out here and there in places the heavier V12 just did not. Then my insurer telling me 458 much higher crash risk, i get the picture now. A lot more self restraint needed I finding and on more windy roads 458 a total weapon.

Is the F12 a more tame car to handle compared to a 458? I would like to drive daily which would also include a lot of inner city driving and would think the F12 being the larger car that it is more difficult to park, with the long front hard to gauge going down tight roads. I think i have seen more F12's spin out due to the added horsepower to the rear wheels than 458's

[garystoybox]

f1z said:

Is the F12 a more tame car to handle compared to a 458? I would like to drive daily which would also include a lot of inner city driving and would think the F12 being the larger car that it is more difficult to park, with the long front hard to gauge going down tight roads. I think i have seen more F12's spin out due to the added horsepower to the rear wheels than 458's

Ditto this…. Having owned a couple of 458’s and a 488, they were the most user friendly, predictable and chuckable of cars; you could really Iean on them without any fear of being bitten; would have happily thrown the keys to a 17 year old and be fairly confident he would bring it back in one piece. Not owned an F12 but my 812 requires much more respect and demands 100% concentration pushing on.

[Chad_Hugo]

speedbird1000 said:

sold an F12 I had for 5 years and couple months back got a low miles 458 with racing seats lots of carbon. OMG.. is my reaction, its a low slung go kart rocket ship thing...and the magnificent sounding engine revs so sweetly to a massive 9k (my ex 4 L GT3 was more "strained" at high revs). Then that the Engine is pretty well in the cabin with you ...is really great...
Verdict vastly more fun than the more serious F12 which is a bit more GT like, 458 is just a more youthful innocent like feeling. Looked at a load of 488s, beautiful looking, great specs, fab prices now but that 458 - i never selling that, its so joyful my little pocket rocket, i think prices will climb strongly soon aided by rarity, desirability and inflation.

That's very good to hear as I was I was at fist after an F12 and that was the plan for some time, drove some 488's and now very happy to have a stunning 458 which has exceeded my expectations! The stability or should I have 'checkability' is one of the biggest surprises as you say.

Due to current F12 market for high spec 2015/2016 car I can't really justify adding a F12 and keeping my 458 (which I LOVE and don't plan on selling at all) so great to hear your thoughts and very positive impression of the 458 vs the F12.

Still want a V12 but only ever alongside my 458 so looking at an Aston, to scratch the V12 itch..

[speedbird1000]

f1z said:

Is the F12 a more tame car to handle compared to a 458? I would like to drive daily which would also include a lot of inner city driving and would think the F12 being the larger car that it is more difficult to park, with the long front hard to gauge going down tight roads. I think i have seen more F12's spin out due to the added horsepower to the rear wheels than 458's

If you guard carefully to risk of rear end step out wide at full bore in F12 ...then I think the chance of coming home alive is quite a bit better than in the 458. 458 more planted and when it slides under power it slides more predictably (as engine weight over rear and so more time to step out than in F12) BUT 458 nimbleness can tempt you into a road manoeuvre that ends up being a close call..just my finding its happened a few times to me and I had to give myself a firm talking to !!

[Saweep]

Saweep said:

Saweep said:

https://www.sytner.co.uk/vehicle-details/6eeee487-...

Was up at 165 for ages.

Both this and their black coupe price dropped today again.

Black 458 at Brum down again today to 142k. Was 159 6 weeks or so ago.

[Spleen]

Prices seem to be softening but they’re still strong.