550 Maranello article - they'll be £200k before you know it!
Discussion
Having had a chance to drive a 550 recently, I've been reading this thread with interest. Currently I have a 911 as my weekend car and it has been really great, but given that I'm only doing 5K a year in it, I was wondering if I might be better off taking the opportunity to realise the Ferrari V12 dream, particularly if I may also benefit from potential depreciation free motoring also. I'm aware the F car running costs will be far more than Porsche.
This looks like a really lovely example. Do you think the asking price is reflective of the likely sale price? I'd be looking to trade in my 2017 Carrera if I could get a sensible offer.
This looks like a really lovely example. Do you think the asking price is reflective of the likely sale price? I'd be looking to trade in my 2017 Carrera if I could get a sensible offer.
Grantstown said:
Having had a chance to drive a 550 recently, I've been reading this thread with interest. Currently I have a 911 as my weekend car and it has been really great, but given that I'm only doing 5K a year in it, I was wondering if I might be better off taking the opportunity to realise the Ferrari V12 dream, particularly if I may also benefit from potential depreciation free motoring also. I'm aware the F car running costs will be far more than Porsche.
This looks like a really lovely example. Do you think the asking price is reflective of the likely sale price? I'd be looking to trade in my 2017 Carrera if I could get a sensible offer.
I think that will not be depreciation free as the price is now at 2015 levels, four years on with an older car it still has a bit to drop in the current market, they were sub-40k for at least 8 years prior. And yes, as pointed out running costs will be triple which is just a 550 fact of life, however nice an example.This looks like a really lovely example. Do you think the asking price is reflective of the likely sale price? I'd be looking to trade in my 2017 Carrera if I could get a sensible offer.
Having said all that, looks a great example and a reputable dealer, David Miller has been around for a long time and does not retail rubbish.
It will cost but will put a smile on your face every time you drive it. Do look at the airbags carefully, there are no dash pics but a retrim will cost £5k to do properly for starters.
cgt2 said:
Grantstown said:
Having had a chance to drive a 550 recently, I've been reading this thread with interest. Currently I have a 911 as my weekend car and it has been really great, but given that I'm only doing 5K a year in it, I was wondering if I might be better off taking the opportunity to realise the Ferrari V12 dream, particularly if I may also benefit from potential depreciation free motoring also. I'm aware the F car running costs will be far more than Porsche.
This looks like a really lovely example. Do you think the asking price is reflective of the likely sale price? I'd be looking to trade in my 2017 Carrera if I could get a sensible offer.
I think that will not be depreciation free as the price is now at 2015 levels, four years on with an older car it still has a bit to drop in the current market, they were sub-40k for at least 8 years prior. And yes, as pointed out running costs will be triple which is just a 550 fact of life, however nice an example.This looks like a really lovely example. Do you think the asking price is reflective of the likely sale price? I'd be looking to trade in my 2017 Carrera if I could get a sensible offer.
Having said all that, looks a great example and a reputable dealer, David Miller has been around for a long time and does not retail rubbish.
It will cost but will put a smile on your face every time you drive it. Do look at the airbags carefully, there are no dash pics but a retrim will cost £5k to do properly for starters.
Given the GBP:EUR we may be getting to a point where UK cars start getting taken overseas.
ferrisbueller said:
Do you think the European market will soften, too? It seems to have been pretty stable while RHDs have dropped back. 80k entry point with better cars over 100k.
Given the GBP:EUR we may be getting to a point where UK cars start getting taken overseas.
Lots of RHD cars went over to Europe around 2009 when there was a big disparity in GB vs EU values. Given the GBP:EUR we may be getting to a point where UK cars start getting taken overseas.
ferrisbueller said:
Do you think the European market will soften, too? It seems to have been pretty stable while RHDs have dropped back. 80k entry point with better cars over 100k.
Given the GBP:EUR we may be getting to a point where UK cars start getting taken overseas.
If we hit a no deal Brexit, think both the UK and European market will soften.Given the GBP:EUR we may be getting to a point where UK cars start getting taken overseas.
However the Europeans will still have access to free-trade deals, the UK won't for the time being so I'm struggling to see how Europe will be hit as hard as the UK.
If I was in the market for a 2nd hand supercar, I'd certainly be waiting until after the end of October.
ferrisbueller said:
cgt2 said:
Grantstown said:
Having had a chance to drive a 550 recently, I've been reading this thread with interest. Currently I have a 911 as my weekend car and it has been really great, but given that I'm only doing 5K a year in it, I was wondering if I might be better off taking the opportunity to realise the Ferrari V12 dream, particularly if I may also benefit from potential depreciation free motoring also. I'm aware the F car running costs will be far more than Porsche.
This looks like a really lovely example. Do you think the asking price is reflective of the likely sale price? I'd be looking to trade in my 2017 Carrera if I could get a sensible offer.
I think that will not be depreciation free as the price is now at 2015 levels, four years on with an older car it still has a bit to drop in the current market, they were sub-40k for at least 8 years prior. And yes, as pointed out running costs will be triple which is just a 550 fact of life, however nice an example.This looks like a really lovely example. Do you think the asking price is reflective of the likely sale price? I'd be looking to trade in my 2017 Carrera if I could get a sensible offer.
Having said all that, looks a great example and a reputable dealer, David Miller has been around for a long time and does not retail rubbish.
It will cost but will put a smile on your face every time you drive it. Do look at the airbags carefully, there are no dash pics but a retrim will cost £5k to do properly for starters.
Given the GBP:EUR we may be getting to a point where UK cars start getting taken overseas.
Also a lot of cars seem to be sitting
Thank you for the responses.
I think the message is that exercising restraint at this stage may pay off. I'll keep an eye on the market.
The prospect of forking out 5K to re-trim a dash would be irritating, so this is very good advice. I thought it was just a cohort of early cars that had a dodgy glue, which would melt if the car was left out in the sun, but I take your point that there is no photo of the car's dash and therefore it would need to be confirmed that there's no outstanding issue.
I think the message is that exercising restraint at this stage may pay off. I'll keep an eye on the market.
The prospect of forking out 5K to re-trim a dash would be irritating, so this is very good advice. I thought it was just a cohort of early cars that had a dodgy glue, which would melt if the car was left out in the sun, but I take your point that there is no photo of the car's dash and therefore it would need to be confirmed that there's no outstanding issue.
The ‘wrong glue’ is a bit of a misnomer IMO.
The semi-aniline hides used in these cars are exquisite but not optimised for any serious exposure to UV and the associated heat.
This is the real greenhouse effect and it is not simply the leather coming unstuck but an overall shrinkage and while in theory if the leather was fused to the rigid substructure it would be impossible for it to move, it would certainly create some tension and it’s hard to imagine that it would look as good as new indefinitely if exposed to serious UV over time which also ages exposed rubber seals and this is the key difference between an honest car that may have been detailed to look its best with a pampered car that will have spent the vast majority of its life in a garage and could look ‘as new’ even with a reasonable mileage under its belt.
P.s. the early 550 cars have Connolly hides but as they went bust around that time, the factory switched over to an Italian firm: Poltrona Frau.
Both are extremely high quality but susceptible to shrinkage.
The car linked above looks amazing and if you can you should but my assessment of where things are are that there is a greater risk of losing 25% on something like this than making 25%.
The semi-aniline hides used in these cars are exquisite but not optimised for any serious exposure to UV and the associated heat.
This is the real greenhouse effect and it is not simply the leather coming unstuck but an overall shrinkage and while in theory if the leather was fused to the rigid substructure it would be impossible for it to move, it would certainly create some tension and it’s hard to imagine that it would look as good as new indefinitely if exposed to serious UV over time which also ages exposed rubber seals and this is the key difference between an honest car that may have been detailed to look its best with a pampered car that will have spent the vast majority of its life in a garage and could look ‘as new’ even with a reasonable mileage under its belt.
P.s. the early 550 cars have Connolly hides but as they went bust around that time, the factory switched over to an Italian firm: Poltrona Frau.
Both are extremely high quality but susceptible to shrinkage.
The car linked above looks amazing and if you can you should but my assessment of where things are are that there is a greater risk of losing 25% on something like this than making 25%.
A lot of people chose to live with dash and steering wheel shrinkage when they were £40k so it wasnt uncommon to see bubbling but I personally couldn't live with it. There probably are cheaper fixes but I wanted an exact match trimmed perfectly so ended up getting a chap who trimmed old rare Ferraris to do the job properly. It took around three weeks and was bang on £5k. At the time that represented around 15% of what I paid for the whole car!
ooid said:
I thought, probably incorrectly, that it was the ratarossa bloke (silver Testarossa convertible) who purchased the 17k 456.Mogul said:
P.s. the early 550 cars have Connolly hides but as they went bust around that time, the factory switched over to an Italian firm: Poltrona Frau.
I have a very early 550 (1997) and found the Poltrona Frau stamps on the dash when it was being retrimmed. Are you sure Connolly was ever used ? The leather is a darn sight better than the poor quality stuff used on modern Ferraris. My 458 creased badly within 15k kms Paracetamol said:
I have a very early 550 (1997) and found the Poltrona Frau stamps on the dash when it was being retrimmed. Are you sure Connolly was ever used ? The leather is a darn sight better than the poor quality stuff used on modern Ferraris. My 458 creased badly within 15k kms
All early-mid 90s Ferrari had Connolly until the changeover as mentioned. The owner of Connolly had a 1992 (I think- so late production) F40 which uniquely for the era was the only one I saw trimmed in leather from new (many more have of course been done since) which was featured in various magazines as a showcase for what the company did.Early 1996 550's may have had Connolly but I think the company was going out of business around that time so it would be right in the time window.
Hi All - this (31 pages and counting) thread has been my bedside reading for the past week and I am all caught up now.
It is fascinating to have followed a peak in the making and seeing it fade little by little, all this post after post.
After much deliberation and after years of ownership of nice cars (911s, Maserati etc...) I took the plunge bought my first Ferrari 3 years ago - a 2008 F430 w 16k miles. It’s been a brilliant experience so far and the car has proven to be as reliable as one could hope.
I have totally fallen in love with Ferrari’s, and as prices are starting to get “affordable” again for people who actually want to drive them, I am now fairly set on adding a 550 to the stable next to the F430.
I am trying to understand what they are worth now. Keeping in mind that £45-50k was buying a nice 30k miles RHD 5 years ago and that this same car would have hit £125-150k 2/3 years ago, I want to make sure I am not overpaying for appears to be a down trending market.
I am happy to buy a 40-45k Miles car that has been well maintained. They seem to stagnate around £75-80k at the moment and not moving. Is that because they’re over valued or they are not in good knicks? (Which is the same thing in the end)
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
I would also considering be considering a LHD for the right value as most of my driving happens in Europe anyway.
This one looks decent and has been know by TKFC for the past 5 years, but it’s not moving and has a patchy (at best) european history in its early years and show a slight bubbling on the glove box.
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
It makes the RHD Grigio for £78k look like much better value.
In an ideal world - I would want to spend around £50k for a well sorted LHD with 40-50k miles and patchy history, or mid-high 60s for the equivalent RHD.
Am I being realistic?
It is fascinating to have followed a peak in the making and seeing it fade little by little, all this post after post.
After much deliberation and after years of ownership of nice cars (911s, Maserati etc...) I took the plunge bought my first Ferrari 3 years ago - a 2008 F430 w 16k miles. It’s been a brilliant experience so far and the car has proven to be as reliable as one could hope.
I have totally fallen in love with Ferrari’s, and as prices are starting to get “affordable” again for people who actually want to drive them, I am now fairly set on adding a 550 to the stable next to the F430.
I am trying to understand what they are worth now. Keeping in mind that £45-50k was buying a nice 30k miles RHD 5 years ago and that this same car would have hit £125-150k 2/3 years ago, I want to make sure I am not overpaying for appears to be a down trending market.
I am happy to buy a 40-45k Miles car that has been well maintained. They seem to stagnate around £75-80k at the moment and not moving. Is that because they’re over valued or they are not in good knicks? (Which is the same thing in the end)
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
I would also considering be considering a LHD for the right value as most of my driving happens in Europe anyway.
This one looks decent and has been know by TKFC for the past 5 years, but it’s not moving and has a patchy (at best) european history in its early years and show a slight bubbling on the glove box.
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
It makes the RHD Grigio for £78k look like much better value.
In an ideal world - I would want to spend around £50k for a well sorted LHD with 40-50k miles and patchy history, or mid-high 60s for the equivalent RHD.
Am I being realistic?
I don't think the expectations you've suggested are overly optimistic. I think it's a buyer's market as financial uncertainty has tightened purse strings and there aren't as many people actively pursuing cars. Flip side of that is owners holding on to good cars until the market comes back. The market has definitely cooled but small numbers of the right cars, at the right money, are still moving but there's nothing like the turnover of 2-3 years ago. The challenge is getting close to the accurate definition of "right".
The massive inflation over the last few years brought all kinds of cars out of the woodwork with some people looking to cash in on average cars for top money. I think those cars will have been the first casualties as anyone buying (accepting) average cars with an eye on a potential upside now probably doesn't have that same view.
I think LHD vs RHD has closed up over the last few years, compounded by the GBP:EUR rate. I don't know if anyone has a comprehensive study of global markets and their relativity for cars like the 550 i.e. UK vs Europe vs Japan vs USA vs Gulf vs China etc. I know people who have bought and sold cars to/from the Far East in recent times as the markets have ebbed and flowed.
I guess a lot depends on whether you think things will return to the conditions of a few years ago or whether we're looking at a permanent negative shift. There's also the mindset of have it and enjoy it while everything else sorts it out but that means accepting uncertainty in the market.
The massive inflation over the last few years brought all kinds of cars out of the woodwork with some people looking to cash in on average cars for top money. I think those cars will have been the first casualties as anyone buying (accepting) average cars with an eye on a potential upside now probably doesn't have that same view.
I think LHD vs RHD has closed up over the last few years, compounded by the GBP:EUR rate. I don't know if anyone has a comprehensive study of global markets and their relativity for cars like the 550 i.e. UK vs Europe vs Japan vs USA vs Gulf vs China etc. I know people who have bought and sold cars to/from the Far East in recent times as the markets have ebbed and flowed.
I guess a lot depends on whether you think things will return to the conditions of a few years ago or whether we're looking at a permanent negative shift. There's also the mindset of have it and enjoy it while everything else sorts it out but that means accepting uncertainty in the market.
The Rosso Car at KHPC is clean, I had a look at it earlier this year when it was still priced at £95K. I don't like red on these cars I think they suit more subtle colours. If red floats your boat it was certainly tidy.
The LHD argento car at KHPC is an import from Japan with sketchy history. Information I got second hand - so not gospel but worth checking.
I've had my eye on the Forza288 car for a while - the photography isn't that great but I have feeling that car is Grigio Alloy which I quite like.
It's a buyers market, these cars should be high £50's to low £60's now. I'm glad I waited. I offered £90k on a £100K 575m 18 months ago. The same car is still for sale in the £70's now and not sold, with a different dealer this time. My offer at the time was flatly refused, no potential for negotiation. That's Meridien for you.
I'm out until the political nonsense has been sorted out, my business (which imports in US$) is really hurting now, so right now isn't the time to be buying a third car as a toy.
Later this month there's a Ferrari auction at Silverstone - see here:- https://www.silverstoneauctions.com/events/2019-au...
As I type there are 6 Maranellos listed, three 550's and three 575's of varying degrees of condition, mileage and driving position. It's got to be worth watching those go through and see what the results are.
The LHD argento car at KHPC is an import from Japan with sketchy history. Information I got second hand - so not gospel but worth checking.
I've had my eye on the Forza288 car for a while - the photography isn't that great but I have feeling that car is Grigio Alloy which I quite like.
It's a buyers market, these cars should be high £50's to low £60's now. I'm glad I waited. I offered £90k on a £100K 575m 18 months ago. The same car is still for sale in the £70's now and not sold, with a different dealer this time. My offer at the time was flatly refused, no potential for negotiation. That's Meridien for you.
I'm out until the political nonsense has been sorted out, my business (which imports in US$) is really hurting now, so right now isn't the time to be buying a third car as a toy.
Later this month there's a Ferrari auction at Silverstone - see here:- https://www.silverstoneauctions.com/events/2019-au...
As I type there are 6 Maranellos listed, three 550's and three 575's of varying degrees of condition, mileage and driving position. It's got to be worth watching those go through and see what the results are.
Gassing Station | Ferrari V12 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff