"Family-friendly" Ferrari
Discussion
In a quest for a "family-friendly" Ferrari to complement my 550, I am considering a number of options and these are my current thoughts on each one:
1. The most obvious choice for a 550 owner is a 456, although in some ways 550 ownership is a reason not to go for a 456, as it would be too similar (I should add that this is as well as, not instead of - the 550 is staying!). If I do go for one of these, then my research so far leads me towards an M and my preference would be for a manual, but should I consider an auto M, or a manual non-M, if I can't find a nice manual M? Opinion seems to be divided as to just how useable are the rear seats. The key questions are: are they comfortable for a reasonable sized adult and how would my 5'8" daughter find it sitting behind her 6'1" father? Running costs, I understand, are a bit higher than for a 550 and I don't see depreciation as a factor with the 456, which I suspect has reached rock bottom (although I don't see much likelihood of a rise in prices in the foreseeable future either).
2. 612. If I went for one of these, I think I would be happy with the auto / F1 option and I get the impression that the rear seats would pass the test above. My concerns, however, are the size of the 612 - parking, narrow roads, etc. - and further depreciation: I imagine that even early 612s at c. £55/60K have some way to go yet. I have no information on running costs, so any thoughts on this would be welcome.
3. I have also been toying with the idea of a 365 / 400 / 412, almost certainly with a manual box. While I am attracted to the looks / purity of the 365, are the later cars a better bet - more reliable, better equipped, etc. and what are the pros and cons of fuel injection vs. carburettors? Just how good are the rear seats (see above) and ride comfort generally? I don't know anything about running costs and again I don't see much likelihood of a significant rise in prices in the foreseeable future, but I guess that will come sooner than with a 456. My main concern is reliability and potential rust / engine etc. rebuild issues.
I shan't go into looks - opinion seems very divided on all of these, so I guess it comes down to "beauty is in the eye of the beholder". for what it is worth, I love the looks of the 365 / 400 / 412, but am less keen on the 456 and the 612 is my least favourite, but even the 612 is a good looking car.
Any thoughts on the relative merits of each option would be greatly appreciated. Apologies to anyone who has already answered these questions in re the 456 on an earlier thread. Thanks.
1. The most obvious choice for a 550 owner is a 456, although in some ways 550 ownership is a reason not to go for a 456, as it would be too similar (I should add that this is as well as, not instead of - the 550 is staying!). If I do go for one of these, then my research so far leads me towards an M and my preference would be for a manual, but should I consider an auto M, or a manual non-M, if I can't find a nice manual M? Opinion seems to be divided as to just how useable are the rear seats. The key questions are: are they comfortable for a reasonable sized adult and how would my 5'8" daughter find it sitting behind her 6'1" father? Running costs, I understand, are a bit higher than for a 550 and I don't see depreciation as a factor with the 456, which I suspect has reached rock bottom (although I don't see much likelihood of a rise in prices in the foreseeable future either).
2. 612. If I went for one of these, I think I would be happy with the auto / F1 option and I get the impression that the rear seats would pass the test above. My concerns, however, are the size of the 612 - parking, narrow roads, etc. - and further depreciation: I imagine that even early 612s at c. £55/60K have some way to go yet. I have no information on running costs, so any thoughts on this would be welcome.
3. I have also been toying with the idea of a 365 / 400 / 412, almost certainly with a manual box. While I am attracted to the looks / purity of the 365, are the later cars a better bet - more reliable, better equipped, etc. and what are the pros and cons of fuel injection vs. carburettors? Just how good are the rear seats (see above) and ride comfort generally? I don't know anything about running costs and again I don't see much likelihood of a significant rise in prices in the foreseeable future, but I guess that will come sooner than with a 456. My main concern is reliability and potential rust / engine etc. rebuild issues.
I shan't go into looks - opinion seems very divided on all of these, so I guess it comes down to "beauty is in the eye of the beholder". for what it is worth, I love the looks of the 365 / 400 / 412, but am less keen on the 456 and the 612 is my least favourite, but even the 612 is a good looking car.
Any thoughts on the relative merits of each option would be greatly appreciated. Apologies to anyone who has already answered these questions in re the 456 on an earlier thread. Thanks.
can't contribute much, but saw something about used cars a few days ago on German TV and one of the cars was a 365 I think. The servicing costs were quite high (maybe something to do with adjusting the carbs frequently??)/ right sized tyres expensive or difficult to get ... unfortunately did not pay close attention to the specifics
A few years ago my mechanic also had a 400 sitting in his shop and from memory it needed a full engine rebuild.
No first hand knowledge, just a pointer to do some research on the old cars as there might be some financial/reliability pitfalls
I would not get a 456 auto, seems wrong to me - obviously purely personal opinion
A few years ago my mechanic also had a 400 sitting in his shop and from memory it needed a full engine rebuild.
No first hand knowledge, just a pointer to do some research on the old cars as there might be some financial/reliability pitfalls
I would not get a 456 auto, seems wrong to me - obviously purely personal opinion
If you want a 612 and are worried about depreciation I'd go for a manual….there's another thread about an overpriced manual currently advertised but they are around and not that rare. I think there will be a substantial pricing gap between manuals and automatic/F1 box cars in years to come. These cars are pretty much the last V12 manual Ferrari's made (other than the uber rare manual 599) which will help make them sort after.
I don't think either the 456 or the 400/412 are as much of a four-seater as you are looking for. My partner (5ft 3in) can sit behind me (5ft 10in) but probably not for a long journey in the 412 and I don't think the 456 is any better in the back.
I set out to replace a much-loved 328 with a four-seat Ferrari, though mostly for my six-year old daughter to sit in the back (and now a baby too). I tried a Mondial t and was very disappointed with the way it drove. Loved the 308 GT4 but found that most were in poor condition, so switched my attentions to the 456. Then everyone but everyone who knows Ferraris said don't do it. These cars are infamous for their running costs - hence the low prices to buy them.
So I finally bought a manual 412 two years ago. They only built 24 RHD manuals so prices should never drop (and seem to be creeping up) but what matters most is that the car is fabulous. A proper old-school V12 Ferrari with great looks and sounds and even the fuel consumption isn't nearly as bad as I feared. Ignore anyone who scoffs at the 400/412 (at least as a manual car) as these comments come from folk who haven't driven them. The well-known Ferrari specialist that looks after my car says it's a far better Ferrari than a 430...
I set out to replace a much-loved 328 with a four-seat Ferrari, though mostly for my six-year old daughter to sit in the back (and now a baby too). I tried a Mondial t and was very disappointed with the way it drove. Loved the 308 GT4 but found that most were in poor condition, so switched my attentions to the 456. Then everyone but everyone who knows Ferraris said don't do it. These cars are infamous for their running costs - hence the low prices to buy them.
So I finally bought a manual 412 two years ago. They only built 24 RHD manuals so prices should never drop (and seem to be creeping up) but what matters most is that the car is fabulous. A proper old-school V12 Ferrari with great looks and sounds and even the fuel consumption isn't nearly as bad as I feared. Ignore anyone who scoffs at the 400/412 (at least as a manual car) as these comments come from folk who haven't driven them. The well-known Ferrari specialist that looks after my car says it's a far better Ferrari than a 430...
John,
This is a great problem to have!
I've been on this journey too...and it really depends on what you want to do with the car.
On my quest for a family Ferrari I've had a manual 400i and now have a 612 Scaglietti F1.
Contrary to public perception, both are wonderful looking and fantastic cars.
A 365 / 400 / 412 is a genuine classic V12 Ferrari with sound to match. But it does need loving care and things do go wrong.
I finally sold the 400 because my family didn't enjoy a car that was a bit old fashioned (limited heater etc)
The 612 is completely different. We have used it as a family grand tourer, latest trip down to Alsace and it has never been less than fantastic. Space wise, it works for 3 + luggage but not 4. The F1 suits the car because you never take your hands from the wheel although it can be tricky to drive in traffic.
I considered a 456 (love the shape) but was put off my previous owners who had many things go wrong...
PM me if you want any more info
This is a great problem to have!
I've been on this journey too...and it really depends on what you want to do with the car.
On my quest for a family Ferrari I've had a manual 400i and now have a 612 Scaglietti F1.
Contrary to public perception, both are wonderful looking and fantastic cars.
A 365 / 400 / 412 is a genuine classic V12 Ferrari with sound to match. But it does need loving care and things do go wrong.
I finally sold the 400 because my family didn't enjoy a car that was a bit old fashioned (limited heater etc)
The 612 is completely different. We have used it as a family grand tourer, latest trip down to Alsace and it has never been less than fantastic. Space wise, it works for 3 + luggage but not 4. The F1 suits the car because you never take your hands from the wheel although it can be tricky to drive in traffic.
I considered a 456 (love the shape) but was put off my previous owners who had many things go wrong...
PM me if you want any more info
sure sorry
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it has the full carbon pack and HGT2 pack which includes the wheels, carbon brakes and exhaust. Also has the diamond cross headlining which I love. Its a great car has not skipped a beat. changed from a Bentley GT at the time. Also I would say it is as fast that the 430. Obviously not as nimble but sounds amazing
it has the full carbon pack and HGT2 pack which includes the wheels, carbon brakes and exhaust. Also has the diamond cross headlining which I love. Its a great car has not skipped a beat. changed from a Bentley GT at the time. Also I would say it is as fast that the 430. Obviously not as nimble but sounds amazing
Thankyou all for your contributions. In light of your various comments, although my heart says 365/400/412, my head is definitely telling me that the only Ferrari that is going to tempt my family out of our modern Merc (highly specced E-class) is a 612, because it offers a combination of adequate accommodation, reliability and creature comforts, so there would be little point in my buying said 365/400/412.
I am not yet convinced, however, that it is a car I really want to own.
But thanks again for all your thoughts, which have been very helpful.
I am not yet convinced, however, that it is a car I really want to own.
But thanks again for all your thoughts, which have been very helpful.
I had two 456GTs going from an original to a modificatta both of which I loved to pieces. I upgraded to 612, what a weapon. Great with family, loads of boot space will cruise at 100mph all day long and yet can drive like a hooligan. I went to nurburgring with it, to do just that and frightened myself a few times. You won't be disappointed. 612 belts on a 5yr cycle and no more expensive to run than you'd expect
My only contribution to this is to suggest you rule out the 456, not because of servicing costs, but it will be, as you point out, far too much of a deja vu experience. I had a 456M, manual, and was looking for a 2 seater to go alongside it. I tried a 550 and there are *loads* of parts in common, eg dials, gearlever & gate, even the smells and sounds. It's similar to drive too. Plus, when you look at the service parts for a 456, half of them are listed as 550 items on the invoice.
I think you already arrived at the conclusion; if you want speed, comfort and practicality, go more modern, if you want a bit of fun, go older. I absolutely LOVE the 250GTE, but my 'kids' are teenagers now and far more tolerant of old school quirks.
I think you already arrived at the conclusion; if you want speed, comfort and practicality, go more modern, if you want a bit of fun, go older. I absolutely LOVE the 250GTE, but my 'kids' are teenagers now and far more tolerant of old school quirks.
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