Jeez - PH has descended into personal insults :(
Discussion
Is there not also a tinge of apathy from the PH community, in the "good old days" malicious posters would get flamed quite severely by a number of responses, generally firm but polite.
Are we expecting the mods to do everything or is it up to the members to set the tone of the site / forums? Maybe this is just a change in the dynamics and we should bow to the new demographic and accept it as majority rule?
Are we expecting the mods to do everything or is it up to the members to set the tone of the site / forums? Maybe this is just a change in the dynamics and we should bow to the new demographic and accept it as majority rule?
what was that about?
Don't panic, was just about the PH show (was an old magazine)spend said:
Is there not also a tinge of apathy from the PH community, in the "good old days" malicious posters would get flamed quite severely by a number of responses, generally firm but polite.
Are we expecting the mods to do everything or is it up to the members to set the tone of the site / forums? Maybe this is just a change in the dynamics and we should bow to the new demographic and accept it as majority rule?
By all means press the report button, by definition we don't get to read every thread let alone every post. If you think someone is out of order and needs a slap then report it, and well pick up on it. Are we expecting the mods to do everything or is it up to the members to set the tone of the site / forums? Maybe this is just a change in the dynamics and we should bow to the new demographic and accept it as majority rule?
What I'd like to see is the ability to rate an individual post so that the site admins can see who is consistently stirring up ill feeling. I quite often see posts that are utterly unhelpful and confrontational. If the mods were involved in every single one of these posts the workload would be huge. But with millions of people to flag the trouble makers up, they could focus on the worst 'scorers', the people who are consistently detracting from the discussions, and deal with them. And sometimes I see posts that I want to applaud and it would be nice to be able to do that without diverting the thread they're in. It's a feature that I think would only be used rarely but would give the site admins a way to find out who their best and worst users are and encourage/discourage accordingly.
Edited by GreenV8S on Monday 22 December 12:21
GreenV8S said:
What I'd like to see is the ability to rate an individual post so that the site admins can see who is consistently stirring up ill feeling. I quite often see posts that are utterly unhelpful and confrontational. If the mods were involved in every single one of these posts the workload would be huge. But with millions of people to flag the trouble makers up, they could focus on the worst 'scorers', the people who are consistently detracting from the discussions, and deal with them. And sometimes I see posts that I want to applaud and it would be nice to be able to do that without diverting the thread they're in. It's a feature that I think would only be used rarely but would give the site admins a way to find out who their best and worst users are and encourage/discourage accordingly.
I believe Ted tried this at some point in the past and it was not deemed a success.Edited by GreenV8S on Monday 22 December 12:21
It is a nice idea, but I can see backslapping cliques forming where the idiots rate the other idiots well, reducing the usefulness of any scores.
For the time being just hit the report button and the mods will take a look. The won't necessarily take action every time, but if the same name starts popping up regularly then they will definitely have a word.
When I first found PH I found it different to all other car forums as is was intelligent, knowlegable people, discussing cars, sharing information and a general community feel of helping each other out. Its what made me stay.
Lately there seems to be a lot of bullying/trolling type behaviour usually of the 'you dont agree with my opinion so you can go f
k yourself' variety. Its not nice to read and not nice for someone to be subjected to. It also takes away from the thread itself, sometimes several pages are filled with sgging matches no-one cares about. I'm seriously considering leaving PH altogether for several reasons but the negativity and bad attitude of some posters would be a big reason.
The core of PH is still decent enthusiasts, but if many more of these sad types trawling the internet looking for an argument turn up then there won't be much point hanging around.
Lately there seems to be a lot of bullying/trolling type behaviour usually of the 'you dont agree with my opinion so you can go f
k yourself' variety. Its not nice to read and not nice for someone to be subjected to. It also takes away from the thread itself, sometimes several pages are filled with sgging matches no-one cares about. I'm seriously considering leaving PH altogether for several reasons but the negativity and bad attitude of some posters would be a big reason. The core of PH is still decent enthusiasts, but if many more of these sad types trawling the internet looking for an argument turn up then there won't be much point hanging around.
patmahe said:
When I first found PH I found it different to all other car forums as is was intelligent, knowlegable people, discussing cars, sharing information and a general community feel of helping each other out. Its what made me stay.
Lately there seems to be a lot of bullying/trolling type behaviour usually of the 'you dont agree with my opinion so you can go fk yourself' variety. Its not nice to read and not nice for someone to be subjected to. It also takes away from the thread itself, sometimes several pages are filled with sgging matches no-one cares about. I'm seriously considering leaving PH altogether for several reasons but the negativity and bad attitude of some posters would be a big reason.
The core of PH is still decent enthusiasts, but if many more of these sad types trawling the internet looking for an argument turn up then there won't be much point hanging around.
A lot of this type of posting occurs in General Gassing and (especially) the P&P, I think the smaller forums are pretty much untouched (but please correct me if I am wrong!)Lately there seems to be a lot of bullying/trolling type behaviour usually of the 'you dont agree with my opinion so you can go f
k yourself' variety. Its not nice to read and not nice for someone to be subjected to. It also takes away from the thread itself, sometimes several pages are filled with sgging matches no-one cares about. I'm seriously considering leaving PH altogether for several reasons but the negativity and bad attitude of some posters would be a big reason. The core of PH is still decent enthusiasts, but if many more of these sad types trawling the internet looking for an argument turn up then there won't be much point hanging around.
As has been mentioned above, we've just given the mod some new tools to play with, which should make it easier for them to have a bit of a crackdown. Get hitting the report button whenever you see anyone being out of order and hopefully we should be able to steer them back into line...
BigLepton said:
jezzaaa said:
skylinecrazy said:
What do you expect from a public forum?
But it's always been public...why the change so recently? Why has PH suddenly 'attracted' this element?Losers.
BigLepton said:
haven't bothered to fill in their profiles
I took all my real info off after people started to try to discredit others by what they drove, or tried to dig up personal information.It's a shame it has gone like that now, it used to be a nice feature of the site when used properly.
Yea But...Yea But... 
The report button is a bit of dilemma though, most of us 'reflective' members are not always convinced that we are representative of the majority these days? I guess to an extent also that many feel PH should largely be self-moderating, and are well aware that the mods are voluntary so do not wish to prevail upon them either 
In addition maybe we are a bit like schoolboys and consider ratting as bad form (yes some of us do have ethics as well as not being very grown up even though we are nearly pensionable)
So it seems that you really want us to report rather than retort, kind of goes against the grain, but better to try something to improve the situation
I promise to comply and avoid anything outside discussion by reporting snipes
ETA:Ooops wrong smiley for this site
The report button is a bit of dilemma though, most of us 'reflective' members are not always convinced that we are representative of the majority these days? I guess to an extent also that many feel PH should largely be self-moderating, and are well aware that the mods are voluntary so do not wish to prevail upon them either In addition maybe we are a bit like schoolboys and consider ratting as bad form (yes some of us do have ethics as well as not being very grown up even though we are nearly pensionable)So it seems that you really want us to report rather than retort, kind of goes against the grain, but better to try something to improve the situation
I promise to comply and avoid anything outside discussion by reporting snipes
ETA:Ooops wrong smiley for this site
Edited by spend on Monday 22 December 17:59
Mattt said:
BigLepton said:
haven't bothered to fill in their profiles
I took all my real info off after people started to try to discredit others by what they drove, or tried to dig up personal information.It's a shame it has gone like that now, it used to be a nice feature of the site when used properly.
I find those who fill their profiles in are more likely to be the ones you see at PH meets or trackdays. Makes them a bit more geniune in my eyes (whether that be actually true or not).
Who cares whether they drive a Clio 1.2 or an F40.
I used to have a full profile with car pics etc.
No more.
Do not feed the trolls...with any information they can get too easily.
Regular members know all about me through my posts and through real-world meets and discussions. That's the way I want to keep it. Trolls would get bored sifting through that lot.
No more.
Do not feed the trolls...with any information they can get too easily.
Regular members know all about me through my posts and through real-world meets and discussions. That's the way I want to keep it. Trolls would get bored sifting through that lot.
There do appear to be many more zero-content argumentative postings now, not dissimilar to the arguments you get on YouTube. Whilst a few dozen hormonal teenagers might not be able to influence an entire forum, several million of them influence other forums, which in turn influence general forum culture.
Mr Will said:
GreenV8S said:
What I'd like to see is the ability to rate an individual post so that the site admins can see who is consistently stirring up ill feeling. I quite often see posts that are utterly unhelpful and confrontational. If the mods were involved in every single one of these posts the workload would be huge. But with millions of people to flag the trouble makers up, they could focus on the worst 'scorers', the people who are consistently detracting from the discussions, and deal with them. And sometimes I see posts that I want to applaud and it would be nice to be able to do that without diverting the thread they're in. It's a feature that I think would only be used rarely but would give the site admins a way to find out who their best and worst users are and encourage/discourage accordingly.
I believe Ted tried this at some point in the past and it was not deemed a success.It is a nice idea, but I can see backslapping cliques forming where the idiots rate the other idiots well, reducing the usefulness of any scores.
For the time being just hit the report button and the mods will take a look. The won't necessarily take action every time, but if the same name starts popping up regularly then they will definitely have a word.
A lot of it is 'keyboard warrior syndrome' and bravado and also oneupmanship (i.e. people see someone get away with using an offensive tone in jest and then use it themselves in anger).
What makes me laugh most (though it's not really funny) is how quickly some people reach for the swear/anger button and the level to which they take it, simply because they feel safe at home behind their keyboard. Many comments would receive a swift crack to the bridge of the nose in response if delivered in real life!
Unfortunately, PH is as much of a 'get-together' type community as it is online community, so these people do themselves no favours.
What makes me laugh most (though it's not really funny) is how quickly some people reach for the swear/anger button and the level to which they take it, simply because they feel safe at home behind their keyboard. Many comments would receive a swift crack to the bridge of the nose in response if delivered in real life!
Unfortunately, PH is as much of a 'get-together' type community as it is online community, so these people do themselves no favours.
GreenV8S said:
Mr Will said:
For the time being just hit the report button and the mods will take a look. The won't necessarily take action every time, but if the same name starts popping up regularly then they will definitely have a word.
...I certainly don't want to waste the mods' time by saying "this poster is an argumentative idiot" every time I see that because I would expect the mods to get fed up with me sharpish. I think the scale of the problem makes it impractical for the mods to be involved in locating the trouble makers; they should only be required to deal with the worst offenders once they've been flagged up.I think the comment above about "old-timer apathy" may be part of it, although I'd also suggest that the bolshy newcomers nowadays are a lot more persistent and troublesome than they used to be...which on reflection may also be down to the fact that where in the past 2 or 3 regulars would all pitch-in and tell them to back off / put them down, more often than not now it's one-on-one...which may be down to apathy or maybe just the huge size of PH now!
Either way, we do need to make this work ourselves, and reporting the worst offenders is probably one of the best tools us non-mods have. Either that or (as EmmaP, AliKat and some of the other girls managed recently, and quite spectacularly so) get some of your mates to join in and take the piss out of the muppets!!!
havoc said:
I don't think the mods would get fed up with you...I'd imagine they're getting as frustrated with the direction this place is taking as you are (and I am!).
ABSOLUTELY 
As mentioned earlier - it's impossible to read all of the thousands of daily posts. If you're unhappy with something that's been posted, then do report it.
The mods have been given some new tools - one of which I used tonight for the 1st time - to cut down on the complete and utter crap and drivel posted on P&P.
Yes - I get as fed up about it all, as with everyone else - but I do firmly believe that we'll knock a percentage of these on the head over the coming weeks/months
Of course the argument will always come down to what's a discussion/debate/argument/inflamatory/troll/wind-up post. It will never be 100% right - as we all interpret posts in different ways - but I firmly believe we're getting there
As a lot of people know - I'm usually pretty intolerant for a lot of the crap posted on here - and you'd not believe the aggro and grief both via the forums and via emails. On the other side - I have only ever once got a 'positive' response from someone for 'doing the right thing'.
Do we have up with all this personal abuse? No. Is it acceptable? No. Do we let these morons take over PH? Over my dead body.
K
Yes, there are more of these idiots appearing but I notice the mods are quicker to get rid of them. I expect loads of binning and banning goes on behind the scenes. I think we'll see a huge improvement in the P and P over the next few months with all the great changes those in charge have made recently.
Pistonheads isn't just the P and P. Many of the other forums are as good as they have ever been. Indeed many of the quieter forums have really benefited from the increase in numbers.
Remember Stuart, Garlick, Mr. Will all the mods etc really want the place to work and are doing huge amounts to make it a success.
I think things are on the up.
Pistonheads isn't just the P and P. Many of the other forums are as good as they have ever been. Indeed many of the quieter forums have really benefited from the increase in numbers.
Remember Stuart, Garlick, Mr. Will all the mods etc really want the place to work and are doing huge amounts to make it a success.
I think things are on the up.
Has anyone considered that perhaps the level of personal insults is on the up because there are some people who really do deserve it? And not just newbie trolls, either.
If you post something obnoxious or ridicule another member's choice of car/bike/rock band/snack/beverage in a nasty way I think you can expect a few rather personal remarks to be made.
To be honest I view it as a good thing if it hounds out the idiots. The people whose anonymity leads them to think they can say anything they like, however unpleasant.
Personally I prefer not to descend to that. But I can't condemn the people who do.
If you post something obnoxious or ridicule another member's choice of car/bike/rock band/snack/beverage in a nasty way I think you can expect a few rather personal remarks to be made.
To be honest I view it as a good thing if it hounds out the idiots. The people whose anonymity leads them to think they can say anything they like, however unpleasant.
Personally I prefer not to descend to that. But I can't condemn the people who do.
Is this a 5 minute argument, or the full half hour?
But seriously:-
I joined Pistonheads when I gave up my company car and bought a couple of cars for myself. Initially I wanted to join to discuss problems with the cars and seek advice. It also gave me the opportunity to get to meet people with similar cars etc.
Then I strayed onto P&P, General gassing and SP&L.......... These forums can be good fun, informative and entertaining. I thought that this was the original intention for P&P? It's better to have an area for 'letting off steam' away from the serious forums, it's just human nature to want to have a bit of fun.
I have however noticed recently (and I've been a member for less tha a year) that there do seem to be a few people who take things a little to far, and some of them are straying into the 'serious' areas!
There has always been a lot of light-hearted ribbing on P&P, but these days there tend to be too many people who go directly for the throat! This is not big, clever or funny and has put quite a few people off pistonheads. Self moderation works quite well normally, but the new breed of 'go for it' posters just see the self moderators as the enemy who must be beaten at all costs!
Use the report button, the mod's will decide if a post or poster should be moved or deleted, at least you can make their jobs a little easier by bringing unwanted stuff to their attention!
But seriously:-
I joined Pistonheads when I gave up my company car and bought a couple of cars for myself. Initially I wanted to join to discuss problems with the cars and seek advice. It also gave me the opportunity to get to meet people with similar cars etc.
Then I strayed onto P&P, General gassing and SP&L.......... These forums can be good fun, informative and entertaining. I thought that this was the original intention for P&P? It's better to have an area for 'letting off steam' away from the serious forums, it's just human nature to want to have a bit of fun.
I have however noticed recently (and I've been a member for less tha a year) that there do seem to be a few people who take things a little to far, and some of them are straying into the 'serious' areas!
There has always been a lot of light-hearted ribbing on P&P, but these days there tend to be too many people who go directly for the throat! This is not big, clever or funny and has put quite a few people off pistonheads. Self moderation works quite well normally, but the new breed of 'go for it' posters just see the self moderators as the enemy who must be beaten at all costs!
Use the report button, the mod's will decide if a post or poster should be moved or deleted, at least you can make their jobs a little easier by bringing unwanted stuff to their attention!
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