I like feisty cars, will I enjoy a 12c...?
Discussion
Bispal said:
You are so wrong, that's just not the case. I love looking at Ferrari's & Lambo's and I go to many, many car events and organise them too. From what I see people go totally nuts over McLarens, more than any other marque only Pagani & Koenigsegg get more attention.
I agree with you a few old gents with beards and slippers may congregate around the Ferrari and lambo's but the new kids on the block with money head straight for McLaren.My neighbours are used to seeing a multitude of supercars outside my house, it rarely raises an eyebrow but as soon as I got a McLaren they all suddenly became my best friend. Constantly waving and talking to me. Making excuses to stop and talk to me on the driveway.
Ok my kids are too young to be buyers yet but when I discuss potential future purchases with them they don't share the passion and loyalty to the old school makes that some of us older codgers do.
Todays kids love McLarens and they will be tomorrows purchasers
notax said:
Thanks for the replies. I am quite happy with flappy paddles (as in the SLS) so that wouldn't be an issue for me. In fact one thing I liked about the 12C is that you can change up and down on the same paddle, as I do in my rally car. I like my supercars to be topless so that's the 599 out for me.
I have always liked over engined RWD cars with an unruly character, so the SLS was right up my street. I do wonder whether I should make a change and hiring a 12C may be a good idea. It is ironic - when the 12C came out I thought it was a bit of a pig, but as time has gone on I now really think they look stunning. Shows the designers know far more than I do! I should really be focussing on the driving side (in which case the SLS is best suited to me) but the look of the 12C has grown on me so much that I'm very torn. I have two specific cars in mind, one an SLS roadster, the other a 12c Spider and there is really nothing to choose between them in price, age or mileage. Both should be reliable and both have a good chance of appreciating in my view. I guess the choice is a nice problem to have!
Have any of you swapped a V12V or similar for a 12C? What are your thoughts?
I don't know the SLS but I do know the 6.2 V8 in the old C63 507, and having owned a 12C for two years, the two could not really be more different in terms of that kind of 'fun' on the road. The 12C will break mechanical grip if you turn everything off BUT it is always fighting you to get it back and is not that progressive or controllable. At speed you also have a lot of downforce, and if on a track and going fast enough to overcome both, you'll be going seriously fast. Compare with the C63 where you can put the back out with a dab of right foot and even an amateur like me can control it, and it's all at manageable speeds for the road. No idea if you can get to test drive the 12C in the way that you will want to use it (seems doubtful!) but your original description doesn't really match my experience of the car. Best of luck!I have always liked over engined RWD cars with an unruly character, so the SLS was right up my street. I do wonder whether I should make a change and hiring a 12C may be a good idea. It is ironic - when the 12C came out I thought it was a bit of a pig, but as time has gone on I now really think they look stunning. Shows the designers know far more than I do! I should really be focussing on the driving side (in which case the SLS is best suited to me) but the look of the 12C has grown on me so much that I'm very torn. I have two specific cars in mind, one an SLS roadster, the other a 12c Spider and there is really nothing to choose between them in price, age or mileage. Both should be reliable and both have a good chance of appreciating in my view. I guess the choice is a nice problem to have!
Have any of you swapped a V12V or similar for a 12C? What are your thoughts?
I think it can depend upon what tyres you run. As has been said before, on the road the car is ridiculously fast and you wont be able to go fast enough to go power sliding around...plus the stability control will interfere too much.
On a track with standard P Zeros and set to race it slips and slides and drift all you like if you push it...it is a fantastic thing and supremely fast. If you really want to go drifting though, buy something Japanese!
On a track with standard P Zeros and set to race it slips and slides and drift all you like if you push it...it is a fantastic thing and supremely fast. If you really want to go drifting though, buy something Japanese!
wickhamaj said:
I don't know the SLS but I do know the 6.2 V8 in the old C63 507, and having owned a 12C for two years, the two could not really be more different in terms of that kind of 'fun' on the road. The 12C will break mechanical grip if you turn everything off BUT it is always fighting you to get it back and is not that progressive or controllable. At speed you also have a lot of downforce, and if on a track and going fast enough to overcome both, you'll be going seriously fast. Compare with the C63 where you can put the back out with a dab of right foot and even an amateur like me can control it, and it's all at manageable speeds for the road. No idea if you can get to test drive the 12C in the way that you will want to use it (seems doubtful!) but your original description doesn't really match my experience of the car. Best of luck!
Funnily enough, I also own a C63. The SLS is similar but much more extreme, the SLS party trick was lighting up its tyres at 110mph! I think that there is no doubt I would enjoy the drive more in the SLS, but I have owned one before and much prefer the looks of the 12c....CTE said:
I think it can depend upon what tyres you run. As has been said before, on the road the car is ridiculously fast and you wont be able to go fast enough to go power sliding around...plus the stability control will interfere too much.
On a track with standard P Zeros and set to race it slips and slides and drift all you like if you push it...it is a fantastic thing and supremely fast. If you really want to go drifting though, buy something Japanese!
I agree that tyres make a huge difference - I have owned two Z3Ms, the first, fitted with legal but old Pirellis was the best drift car I have ever driven...just like a Mk2 Escort but with triple the power. I then bought another, fitted with cheap new tyres and it ruined it for me by gripping like poo to a blanket! I wouldn't drive the SLS or 12c on track - I have another beastie for that, so I am purely looking for a road car...On a track with standard P Zeros and set to race it slips and slides and drift all you like if you push it...it is a fantastic thing and supremely fast. If you really want to go drifting though, buy something Japanese!
baronbennyt said:
The comments about the 12C on this thread have been absolutely spot on. I sold my Aston Martin Vantage V12S (below) for an early 12C (also below) and couldn't be happier with the change. The Aston had a wonderfully strong and characterful engine and hugely powerful brakes but the 12 just leaves it for dead in every other area, with the exception of the infotainment where both are equally shocking! I'm a big track day fan and expect the 12C will be far better suited to this in its free time than the Aston ever was.
By the sounds of it you are looking for something a bit "dirty" (in a good way), i.e. bold looks, big torquey engine and little traction, in which case I think the AMG SLS is the car for you
I've never been a 12c fan, but your car looks stunning!!! congrats on the great spec! By the sounds of it you are looking for something a bit "dirty" (in a good way), i.e. bold looks, big torquey engine and little traction, in which case I think the AMG SLS is the car for you
How you finding it?
btchudson said:
I've never been a 12c fan, but your car looks stunning!!! congrats on the great spec!
How you finding it?
Thanks! I was never a 12C fan either but I was looking for a replacement for the Aston and saw this car on McLaren's pre-owned website and...it was love at first sight! Couldn't be happier with her How you finding it?
I like a feisty car and had a V12V previously, I loved the engine on the V12V but it felt a bit vague to me until I put an aggressive geo on it and then it came alive.
The 12c can be lively for sure, they will light up the wheels at much higher speeds than most things. Get a more aggressive geo and Im sure you will be happy.
The 12c can be lively for sure, they will light up the wheels at much higher speeds than most things. Get a more aggressive geo and Im sure you will be happy.
Bispal said:
I know someone who is selling the 12C ex. Geneva show car in Volcano Red with mega carbon.
Its a coupe 1st Reg in Sept 13 on a 63 plate, ex Geneva Show Car, carbon everywhere, splitter, diffuser, seats, interior, engine bay & covers, vanes, sills, wheel arches,mirrors, plus Iris2, sports exhaust,11400 miles, serviced in September, just out of Manchester after a couple of bits sorted and health check. Brand new 12 month warranty on it, so a straight forward transfer to the new owner. 2 owners in total.
Do you mind saying: who is selling this car? I have not seen it anywhere.Its a coupe 1st Reg in Sept 13 on a 63 plate, ex Geneva Show Car, carbon everywhere, splitter, diffuser, seats, interior, engine bay & covers, vanes, sills, wheel arches,mirrors, plus Iris2, sports exhaust,11400 miles, serviced in September, just out of Manchester after a couple of bits sorted and health check. Brand new 12 month warranty on it, so a straight forward transfer to the new owner. 2 owners in total.
I went from a V12V to a 12C and they could not be more different.
V12V, awesome sound, huge torque and raw. Analogue
12C, too quiet, but oh my everything else is insane. It has one purpose, to go fast and it does that remarkably well. I could go on about the suspension, etc etc but it just is the whole package IF you want fast. It is Digital.
If you want drama, go for the SLS as the 12C does not give you drama, just relentless pace. It is mind bending fast and it does not feel like it, unlike the Aston that could sound fast at 50MPH.
Seriously no-one crowds around a McLaren, hahahahahahaha I can't go to a petrol station without someone sitting in it having their picture taken or coming over to chat. An Aston gets plenty of attention, but the McLaren gets more and all positive. I went with a bunch of Astons through France and when the McLaren pulled up it gets all of the attention. It is just a shame that when I pass them and they wind their window down, I know they will be disappointed against the old V12V.
V12V, awesome sound, huge torque and raw. Analogue
12C, too quiet, but oh my everything else is insane. It has one purpose, to go fast and it does that remarkably well. I could go on about the suspension, etc etc but it just is the whole package IF you want fast. It is Digital.
If you want drama, go for the SLS as the 12C does not give you drama, just relentless pace. It is mind bending fast and it does not feel like it, unlike the Aston that could sound fast at 50MPH.
Seriously no-one crowds around a McLaren, hahahahahahaha I can't go to a petrol station without someone sitting in it having their picture taken or coming over to chat. An Aston gets plenty of attention, but the McLaren gets more and all positive. I went with a bunch of Astons through France and when the McLaren pulled up it gets all of the attention. It is just a shame that when I pass them and they wind their window down, I know they will be disappointed against the old V12V.
Cockernee said:
I went from a V12V to a 12C and they could not be more different.
V12V, awesome sound, huge torque and raw. Analogue
12C, too quiet, but oh my everything else is insane. It has one purpose, to go fast and it does that remarkably well. I could go on about the suspension, etc etc but it just is the whole package IF you want fast. It is Digital.
If you want drama, go for the SLS as the 12C does not give you drama, just relentless pace. It is mind bending fast and it does not feel like it, unlike the Aston that could sound fast at 50MPH.
Seriously no-one crowds around a McLaren, hahahahahahaha I can't go to a petrol station without someone sitting in it having their picture taken or coming over to chat. An Aston gets plenty of attention, but the McLaren gets more and all positive. I went with a bunch of Astons through France and when the McLaren pulled up it gets all of the attention. It is just a shame that when I pass them and they wind their window down, I know they will be disappointed against the old V12V.
Snap ^V12V, awesome sound, huge torque and raw. Analogue
12C, too quiet, but oh my everything else is insane. It has one purpose, to go fast and it does that remarkably well. I could go on about the suspension, etc etc but it just is the whole package IF you want fast. It is Digital.
If you want drama, go for the SLS as the 12C does not give you drama, just relentless pace. It is mind bending fast and it does not feel like it, unlike the Aston that could sound fast at 50MPH.
Seriously no-one crowds around a McLaren, hahahahahahaha I can't go to a petrol station without someone sitting in it having their picture taken or coming over to chat. An Aston gets plenty of attention, but the McLaren gets more and all positive. I went with a bunch of Astons through France and when the McLaren pulled up it gets all of the attention. It is just a shame that when I pass them and they wind their window down, I know they will be disappointed against the old V12V.
Cockernee said:
I went from a V12V to a 12C and they could not be more different.
V12V, awesome sound, huge torque and raw. Analogue
12C, too quiet, but oh my everything else is insane. It has one purpose, to go fast and it does that remarkably well. I could go on about the suspension, etc etc but it just is the whole package IF you want fast. It is Digital.
If you want drama, go for the SLS as the 12C does not give you drama, just relentless pace. It is mind bending fast and it does not feel like it, unlike the Aston that could sound fast at 50MPH.
Seriously no-one crowds around a McLaren, hahahahahahaha I can't go to a petrol station without someone sitting in it having their picture taken or coming over to chat. An Aston gets plenty of attention, but the McLaren gets more and all positive. I went with a bunch of Astons through France and when the McLaren pulled up it gets all of the attention. It is just a shame that when I pass them and they wind their window down, I know they will be disappointed against the old V12V.
Have you got the OEM sports exhaust ?V12V, awesome sound, huge torque and raw. Analogue
12C, too quiet, but oh my everything else is insane. It has one purpose, to go fast and it does that remarkably well. I could go on about the suspension, etc etc but it just is the whole package IF you want fast. It is Digital.
If you want drama, go for the SLS as the 12C does not give you drama, just relentless pace. It is mind bending fast and it does not feel like it, unlike the Aston that could sound fast at 50MPH.
Seriously no-one crowds around a McLaren, hahahahahahaha I can't go to a petrol station without someone sitting in it having their picture taken or coming over to chat. An Aston gets plenty of attention, but the McLaren gets more and all positive. I went with a bunch of Astons through France and when the McLaren pulled up it gets all of the attention. It is just a shame that when I pass them and they wind their window down, I know they will be disappointed against the old V12V.
I know the 650S is a lot louder and has a more lively sound than the equivalent 12C and I'm not sure I would want it any louder.
It pops and bangs and screams at high revs without being obtrusive or droning in the cabin. Sounds its best with roof up and rear window down.
Apparently they sound better with the more miles you put on them so good reason to maybe drive it more !
Well, I'm pleased to let you know that I will soon be the proud owner of the more expensive of the two Volcano red 12c Spiders that Alastair Bols is selling. I went to meet both Alastair and the car today and was suitably impressed by both! It is some time since I last drove a 12c and it was good to be able to stretch its legs a little. It is certainly a very different experience to my other cars... and completely different to the SLS roadster I came very, very close to buying for a second time. Without a doubt, the SLS is the more challenging drive and although 0.5 secs behind the 12c to 60, the added drama disguises this. In the SLS I feel my life was more at risk (giving my enthusiastic driving style) whereas in the 12c my licence will be!
The 12c appearance has really grown on me over time and I'm looking forward to learning the car's traits. As mentioned earlier in the thread, I do like to feel cars moving around, changing attitude and sliding where appropriate and whereas the SLS did all this to the extreme, I need to see if it is possible to make the 12c dance at half sensible speeds. Having seen Tiff and Jason's attempts at drifting an early 12c coupe on Fifth Gear I realise that I may lack the necessary talent and space on the road, but I'm hoping the later cars have a more forgiving set up. Alastair mentioned that he had heard that the basic concept with the set up is that 'normal' equals understeer, 'sport' to neutral handling and 'track' to a tendency to oversteer. Any thoughts or experience appreciated...
The 12c appearance has really grown on me over time and I'm looking forward to learning the car's traits. As mentioned earlier in the thread, I do like to feel cars moving around, changing attitude and sliding where appropriate and whereas the SLS did all this to the extreme, I need to see if it is possible to make the 12c dance at half sensible speeds. Having seen Tiff and Jason's attempts at drifting an early 12c coupe on Fifth Gear I realise that I may lack the necessary talent and space on the road, but I'm hoping the later cars have a more forgiving set up. Alastair mentioned that he had heard that the basic concept with the set up is that 'normal' equals understeer, 'sport' to neutral handling and 'track' to a tendency to oversteer. Any thoughts or experience appreciated...
notax said:
As mentioned earlier in the thread, I do like to feel cars moving around, changing attitude and sliding where appropriate and whereas the SLS did all this to the extreme, I need to see if it is possible to make the 12c dance at half sensible speeds. Having seen Tiff and Jason's attempts at drifting an early 12c coupe on Fifth Gear I realise that I may lack the necessary talent and space on the road, but I'm hoping the later cars have a more forgiving set up. Alastair mentioned that he had heard that the basic concept with the set up is that 'normal' equals understeer, 'sport' to neutral handling and 'track' to a tendency to oversteer. Any thoughts or experience appreciated...
Er... Nope re the handling modes. That just isn't the case. Normal means very little slip allowed by the esc, sport means more and track allows enough slip in the rear for you to be quick on track. the car will not tend to oversteer in track mode. The car has masses of grip especially at normal road speds, i am afraid to say this but I'm not sure the 12c is necessarily the car if you want to feel the car moving around and sliding on the road. A 458 probably would be much more the car for that. The 12c is a brilliant car in many ways but probably not at that kind of driving it has to be admitted.Not to say the 12c can't be driven sideways but I think it's quite tricky as the electronic systems are not calibrated for that kind of thing (unlike say the 570) and the car was really designed to run with it's electronics. It absolutely does not behave like the 5th gear hatchetjob suggested but equally you need to be quite confident in your driving imo to fully disable the esc (it's a massive faff to boot) and to keep the boost high enough for the car to be consistent. One of Mclaren's test drivers showed me that it is possible when on a lap os Spa being fully sideways pretty much all the way through pouhon at 100mph so it clearly can be done.
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