Current real world running costs? 12C

[Davyt]

cgt2 said:

Tom Hartley car at 19k miles looks cheap though hardly any info on the ad.

Bit more info if you go on website, worth a call if your interested though ,,

[murphyaj]

stuart100 said:

isaldiri said:

ChrisW. said:

A well chosen £80k 12C shouldn't have so much further to fall ??

A lot of people said that at £100k.... Now people are saying the same at £80k. Worth bearing that in mind perhaps.

It's now £60k...

There are 5 years and 8 months between these messages. 20k in almost 6 years isn't horrific, given that the whole market has taken a downturn in the last year.

I checked my own personal pricing database. Back in May 2019, the earliest data I have, the cheapest 12C coupe could be had for £72500. Now, just under 5 years later, it's £65000. A little over 10% drop for the bottom of the market in 5 years is hardly dropping like a stone.

[macdeb]

Davyt said:

Your car must be exceptional to be offered more than what you paid 3 years ago, not the norm for sure as prices have dropped some,,,

It is. It had every single option box ticked when new, every single thing available and has some more added since in my ownership (soft close, extended carbon paddles). Apparently Alistair Bols was with the guy when he specced it. Was £238k new.
It's what I meant when saying there are substantial difference in cars condition for sale and their prices reflect that. Sure, I could've got one cheaper, but didn't want 'cheap'. iyswim.

Edited by macdeb on Wednesday 14th February 21:25

[b8575]

murphyaj said:

There are 5 years and 8 months between these messages. 20k in almost 6 years isn't horrific, given that the whole market has taken a downturn in the last year.

I checked my own personal pricing database. Back in May 2019, the earliest data I have, the cheapest 12C coupe could be had for £72500. Now, just under 5 years later, it's £65000. A little over 10% drop for the bottom of the market in 5 years is hardly dropping like a stone.

That’s not bad. I guess, though, that the couple of 12Cs that sold recently on collecting cars for £52K and £47K (plus fees), might be a better reflection of the bottom of the market. I’ve been watching for a while and there are a lot of cars on AT that have been for sale for ages. The higher priced ones are all at one dealer

[samoht]

cgt2 said:

Tom Hartley car at 19k miles looks cheap though hardly any info on the ad.

Some dealers prefer to give information about their cars over the phone, as then there's no record ...

I would personally avoid a dealer whose reputation is so bad, their entire PH feature had to be pulled as the comments section was so negative.

[cgt2]

samoht said:

Some dealers prefer to give information about their cars over the phone, as then there's no record ...

I would personally avoid a dealer whose reputation is so bad, their entire PH feature had to be pulled as the comments section was so negative.

No recent dealings but I did deal with Tom in 1999. Was absolutely fine.

[coolchris]

I was following that car that sold for 52k on collecting cars .Only issue was the seller didn't reply to any questions on the site that people asked which seemed odd as he/she must have been keeping an eye on progress. Pus virtually no miles covered in last couple of years and 9 owners.But for 52k even if one had to spend a few k to get car tip top still a bargain buy.

[Streetbeat]

macdeb said:

It's what I meant when saying there are substantial difference in cars condition for sale and their prices reflect that.

Edited by macdeb on Wednesday 14th February 21:25

I dont venture onto the other supercar marques pages on here much so dont know if their is similar conversations re spec/price over there, but this topic is discussed to death with pretty much every single Mclaren model.

You've summed it up well, why anyone would think they can get a base spec/colour no options ticked "whatever model" to an mso option paint and loads of carbon which likely cost £20k-£30k more is beyond me.

[Davyt]

Well you can if it’s mileage is perceived as high, look at the the 600LT Hamilton have in, fantastic spec, MSO paint ( bit of a dull choice imo ) but on a 70 plate with 26K miles it’s marked down at £135K ,, absolute bargain really,,

[Streetbeat]

Im not sure it is to be honest, as you say the colour isnt exactly inspiring and above "average" miles.

The romans vega blue one with half the miles is a much better buy at £5k more and the one that sold shortly after New Year with the possible worn discs and clubsport pro pack at £125k a steal even with a new set of discs/pads. Only in my opinion of course.

[Davyt]

Yeah think the Romans car is now sold, think it’s an ex 7 day performance winners car, obvs trying to get more than cash offered,, that Clubsport pro was a good car for the money, even if you factored in new discs and pads,, Hamilton car is still very cheap imo, as the other cars mentioned were a year - 18 months older,,

[Streetbeat]

Theres really not a lot of choice at the moment, which is strange as you would think that would push the prices up.

If the Romans one is sold the only other one that would take my fancy is the grey one at Leeds, but i just couldnt pay nearly £160k for one, despite its age/condition/spec, but it is a lovely example.

The 720s market is similar apart from there being quite a few for sale, maybe 2 or 3 cars tops that i would go for, depending on budget.

Seems like the market is a bit in limbo at the moment.

[Davyt]

I bought 12 months ago, seem to remember there being approx 30 cars on AT ( 600LT) if you look today and exclude the 2 sold there’s 12, prices not really so different to then when you factor in they’re a year older, more miles etc etc,,

Streetbeat said:

Theres really not a lot of choice at the moment, which is strange as you would think that would push the prices up.

If the Romans one is sold the only other one that would take my fancy is the grey one at Leeds, but i just couldnt pay nearly £160k for one, despite its age/condition/spec, but it is a lovely example.

The 720s market is similar apart from there being quite a few for sale, maybe 2 or 3 cars tops that i would go for, depending on budget.

Seems like the market is a bit in limbo at the moment.

[Bispal]

I have all the data on when I owned my 12C.

it was a very early 2011 car, chassis no.80.

I owned it for 3 years from early 2016 till late 2018, in which time I did 14k miles.

Depreciation was £10k and i spent £6k on warranties. Apart from servicing and tyres I spent nothing else. The warranty is so comprehensive it covered everything.

I always assume fuel / insurance / road tax same or thereabouts with any other car. So depreciation / warranty / abnormals cost me £1.14p per mile.

Services were £900 and MPG averaged 26mpg over 14k miles (33mpg on m-way). insurance was £600pa. So I don't count those as broadly similar to my Audi S5 and most sports cars.

To compare to other cars I've owned:-
981 Spyder - £1.56ppm / Ferrari F355 - £2.13ppm / Audi S5 - 56ppm / e39M5 - 53ppm.

If I had kept the 12C and done 3k miles per year (what I do in my 675LT) it would now be on 34k. It was very nicely specced with lots of internal & external CF so I would like to think it would be worth £65K

I would not have warrantied it and instead used V engineering with a £2k pa slush fund.

So costs would probably have been £2.20ppm for 8 years and 30k miles. So I think I sold at the right time....

I'm pretty sure if you bought now at £65k costs would be similar to £1.14 ppm

[cgt2]

The car with gold wheels which looks mint but has 50,000 miles has dropped under £60k. I think it's been for sale since last spring.

[murphyaj]

b8575 said:

That’s not bad. I guess, though, that the couple of 12Cs that sold recently on collecting cars for £52K and £47K (plus fees), might be a better reflection of the bottom of the market. I’ve been watching for a while and there are a lot of cars on AT that have been for sale for ages. The higher priced ones are all at one dealer

It's a fair point.
Frankly looking at a few ads at the bottom of the market and using that to judge what a car is worth is fraught with difficulties. Case in point, there is a 12C Spider on sale for £69995 right now, which is a pretty tempting price so I went to see it. The car is in a right state, I won't go into detail but you can read my thoughts here: https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Someone could look at that ad and conclude that 12C Spider prices have dropped to £70k, because you can buy one for that, but they would be wrong. The cheapest 12C spider that may actually be worth buying is £86000.