Living with a McLaren 650s Spider as an (almost) daily
Discussion
I remember the OP thread 458 or 650s. In his shoes all IMO of course the correct move would have been to sell all 4 cars inc 360 and buy a 458 italia/Spyder. I know its hard to sell 360 having just had engine rebuilt and rawness etc but 458 would have done everything without the hassle of emails to dealers etc etc. Life too short to be a development driver for Mcl.
Desert Dragon said:
I remember the OP thread 458 or 650s. In his shoes all IMO of course the correct move would have been to sell all 4 cars inc 360 and buy a 458 italia/Spyder. I know its hard to sell 360 having just had engine rebuilt and rawness etc but 458 would have done everything without the hassle of emails to dealers etc etc. Life too short to be a development driver for Mcl.
We all have different opinions - but when I thought about it, I really wasn't tempted to go the 458 route. Even if I decide I don't like the 650, I won't go the 458 route any time soon.A lot of 'issues' I've had are simply getting familiar with the car. The audio issue was user error. The error message was a concern, but it's a warrantied car and I've really not lost any sleep over it.
The steering issue I felt I had at the same time doesn't seem to be related to that - I use full lock reversing out of my driveway and the front end does feel a bit odd when reversing slowly on full lock. Might be a fault I guess, and I will question it when I'm next at McLaren - however it's not the only car I've had that feels odd reversing on full lock. My Alfa and 911 turbo felt similar.
davek_964 said:
Desert Dragon said:
I remember the OP thread 458 or 650s. In his shoes all IMO of course the correct move would have been to sell all 4 cars inc 360 and buy a 458 italia/Spyder. I know its hard to sell 360 having just had engine rebuilt and rawness etc but 458 would have done everything without the hassle of emails to dealers etc etc. Life too short to be a development driver for Mcl.
We all have different opinions - but when I thought about it, I really wasn't tempted to go the 458 route. Even if I decide I don't like the 650, I won't go the 458 route any time soon.A lot of 'issues' I've had are simply getting familiar with the car. The audio issue was user error. The error message was a concern, but it's a warrantied car and I've really not lost any sleep over it.
The steering issue I felt I had at the same time doesn't seem to be related to that - I use full lock reversing out of my driveway and the front end does feel a bit odd when reversing slowly on full lock. Might be a fault I guess, and I will question it when I'm next at McLaren - however it's not the only car I've had that feels odd reversing on full lock. My Alfa and 911 turbo felt similar.
Edited by Desert Dragon on Sunday 1st September 10:53
I’m with OP on this. Back to back in my old V12 Vantage, I found the 458 incredibly twitchy and unsettled - what I’m calling “bad” raw. I guess in the old days, one would say, “yeah but it’s meant to be driven on track” or some other such excuse.
I had decided I didn’t need more than my V12 V and was heading home from the test drive, when I pulled into the McL dealer next door on a whim. The 650 is light years ahead of a 458.
I had decided I didn’t need more than my V12 V and was heading home from the test drive, when I pulled into the McL dealer next door on a whim. The 650 is light years ahead of a 458.
It's not that I think the 458 would be a bad car. I'm sure it's a much (much) better version of my 360. Originally, that's the car I was intending to replace.
However, I still think the 360 is great at what I use it for - and good enough that I have no reason to spend £100k more to replace it with a 458.
I like that the McLaren is a useable daily. The 360 is pretty single purpose for me and I think the 458 would be similar. Being able to stick the McLaren in Auto / Normal and trundle through town in comfort is a big plus for me.
It clearly is also pretty special out of town. I haven't had it long enough to know whether it will replace the 360 yet. My gut feeling is still no - but that may change.
However, I still think the 360 is great at what I use it for - and good enough that I have no reason to spend £100k more to replace it with a 458.
I like that the McLaren is a useable daily. The 360 is pretty single purpose for me and I think the 458 would be similar. Being able to stick the McLaren in Auto / Normal and trundle through town in comfort is a big plus for me.
It clearly is also pretty special out of town. I haven't had it long enough to know whether it will replace the 360 yet. My gut feeling is still no - but that may change.
My 996 turbo lived outside for over 5 years, and my Aston for 4. Neither had and particular issues - Aston dash leather suffered slightly from the summer last year in one corner, but that was it. Not near any trees.
I'm not really expecting any particular issues from storing it outside. It's going to be a semi daily car anyway so at least 5 days a week would be outside at work.
I'm not really expecting any particular issues from storing it outside. It's going to be a semi daily car anyway so at least 5 days a week would be outside at work.
The 458 is going to have a wake up in the next year regards to values...it has already started happening.
The car guys latest youtube effort is all about how they lost £70k in a year on their 488.
The 458 can only cling onto the N/A issue until the free servicing and warranty deals are over and the appeal of a 9yr old very technical car with very expensive potential bills shall wear thin if its newer quicker brother is as cheap or cheaper and a 650 which is about 2 generations ahead of it are about £50k cheaper for the spider equivalent.
I would say that McLaren getting a name for 'poor reliability' is down to people posting problems they have encountered and others not feeling the need to post when theirs have been perfectly reliable....there is such no thread 'my ultra reliable mclaren' listed on pistonheads.....and after near 5months i could certainly start that thread if i wanted to, but it would only attract clowns like Andrew with really funny smart assed posts.
There is some total belter youtube blogger whom had a 720s for about 6 weeks at launch 2 years ago that he still to this day goes on and on about how unreliable it was, how much he lost on it and how McLaren are a disgrace...facts are that he lost around £5k and one of the 6 issues he had is that 'he' lost a 'set of keys...these guys need to have an agenda as they require viewings to generate income.
Its a bit depressing that people jump onto a post about a 'steering' warning upon startup that reset after stopping and starting the car which reset a most likely overly sensitive sensor, or that now i mentioned a temperamental airbrake issue has now been been mentioned as a 'brake' issue; its a supplemental brake as the near 400mm ceramic discs can deal with most braking required.
I admire Mac owners posting real life issues as they are helpful for other owners / potential owners... the problem is when others misconstrue these posts to satisfy the 'unreliable mclaren' agendas.
The car guys latest youtube effort is all about how they lost £70k in a year on their 488.
The 458 can only cling onto the N/A issue until the free servicing and warranty deals are over and the appeal of a 9yr old very technical car with very expensive potential bills shall wear thin if its newer quicker brother is as cheap or cheaper and a 650 which is about 2 generations ahead of it are about £50k cheaper for the spider equivalent.
I would say that McLaren getting a name for 'poor reliability' is down to people posting problems they have encountered and others not feeling the need to post when theirs have been perfectly reliable....there is such no thread 'my ultra reliable mclaren' listed on pistonheads.....and after near 5months i could certainly start that thread if i wanted to, but it would only attract clowns like Andrew with really funny smart assed posts.
There is some total belter youtube blogger whom had a 720s for about 6 weeks at launch 2 years ago that he still to this day goes on and on about how unreliable it was, how much he lost on it and how McLaren are a disgrace...facts are that he lost around £5k and one of the 6 issues he had is that 'he' lost a 'set of keys...these guys need to have an agenda as they require viewings to generate income.
Its a bit depressing that people jump onto a post about a 'steering' warning upon startup that reset after stopping and starting the car which reset a most likely overly sensitive sensor, or that now i mentioned a temperamental airbrake issue has now been been mentioned as a 'brake' issue; its a supplemental brake as the near 400mm ceramic discs can deal with most braking required.
I admire Mac owners posting real life issues as they are helpful for other owners / potential owners... the problem is when others misconstrue these posts to satisfy the 'unreliable mclaren' agendas.
Sorry i disagree, not with your Ferrari 458 comment but with the McLaren one.
They have a reputation for unreliability for two reasons.
1. They have “realisability issues”. Let’s not bury heads in sand here, every car manufacturer has realisability issues, but McLaren seem to be faring worse than some others at the moment. Corrosion on panels? They all do that sir. We all have friends/relatives who’ve had problematic McLarens. It’s why keeping the warranty going seems a common recommendation.
2. The warranty. Where are we now on the cost of this £3.5-5k per annum (from McLaren)? That’s expensive. For contrast extending a warranty on an Aston Martin V12 Vantage is about £1,600, albeit many don’t bother because the cars are reliable (don’t get me started on the new Vantage, those have McLaren-like issues at the moment). The warranty is expensive because the underwriting company is paying out a lot of money.....
There’s no need to be in denial about reliability, it’s not someone challenging your masculinity! The cars are clearly great. Everyone I know says so, even if they also bemoan reliability. I’d love to get one. It’s one of the reasons that I’m following Davek994s move from a Vantage to a 650, his thread in the Aston Forum was great on the latter.
So I’m really looking forward to hearing how he gets on over the next 12 months - highs and lows
They have a reputation for unreliability for two reasons.
1. They have “realisability issues”. Let’s not bury heads in sand here, every car manufacturer has realisability issues, but McLaren seem to be faring worse than some others at the moment. Corrosion on panels? They all do that sir. We all have friends/relatives who’ve had problematic McLarens. It’s why keeping the warranty going seems a common recommendation.
2. The warranty. Where are we now on the cost of this £3.5-5k per annum (from McLaren)? That’s expensive. For contrast extending a warranty on an Aston Martin V12 Vantage is about £1,600, albeit many don’t bother because the cars are reliable (don’t get me started on the new Vantage, those have McLaren-like issues at the moment). The warranty is expensive because the underwriting company is paying out a lot of money.....
There’s no need to be in denial about reliability, it’s not someone challenging your masculinity! The cars are clearly great. Everyone I know says so, even if they also bemoan reliability. I’d love to get one. It’s one of the reasons that I’m following Davek994s move from a Vantage to a 650, his thread in the Aston Forum was great on the latter.
So I’m really looking forward to hearing how he gets on over the next 12 months - highs and lows
355spiderguy said:
The 458 is going to have a wake up in the next year regards to values...it has already started happening.
The car guys latest youtube effort is all about how they lost £70k in a year on their 488.
The 458 can only cling onto the N/A issue until the free servicing and warranty deals are over and the appeal of a 9yr old very technical car with very expensive potential bills shall wear thin if its newer quicker brother is as cheap or cheaper and a 650 which is about 2 generations ahead of it are about £50k cheaper for the spider equivalent.
I would say that McLaren getting a name for 'poor reliability' is down to people posting problems they have encountered and others not feeling the need to post when theirs have been perfectly reliable....there is such no thread 'my ultra reliable mclaren' listed on pistonheads.....and after near 5months i could certainly start that thread if i wanted to, but it would only attract clowns like Andrew with really funny smart assed posts.
There is some total belter youtube blogger whom had a 720s for about 6 weeks at launch 2 years ago that he still to this day goes on and on about how unreliable it was, how much he lost on it and how McLaren are a disgrace...facts are that he lost around £5k and one of the 6 issues he had is that 'he' lost a 'set of keys...these guys need to have an agenda as they require viewings to generate income.
Its a bit depressing that people jump onto a post about a 'steering' warning upon startup that reset after stopping and starting the car which reset a most likely overly sensitive sensor, or that now i mentioned a temperamental airbrake issue has now been been mentioned as a 'brake' issue; its a supplemental brake as the near 400mm ceramic discs can deal with most braking required.
I admire Mac owners posting real life issues as they are helpful for other owners / potential owners... the problem is when others misconstrue these posts to satisfy the 'unreliable mclaren' agendas.
It’s why the majority of McLaren ownership experience and advice is shared behind a closed FB Group without fear of being hijacked / derailed. The car guys latest youtube effort is all about how they lost £70k in a year on their 488.
The 458 can only cling onto the N/A issue until the free servicing and warranty deals are over and the appeal of a 9yr old very technical car with very expensive potential bills shall wear thin if its newer quicker brother is as cheap or cheaper and a 650 which is about 2 generations ahead of it are about £50k cheaper for the spider equivalent.
I would say that McLaren getting a name for 'poor reliability' is down to people posting problems they have encountered and others not feeling the need to post when theirs have been perfectly reliable....there is such no thread 'my ultra reliable mclaren' listed on pistonheads.....and after near 5months i could certainly start that thread if i wanted to, but it would only attract clowns like Andrew with really funny smart assed posts.
There is some total belter youtube blogger whom had a 720s for about 6 weeks at launch 2 years ago that he still to this day goes on and on about how unreliable it was, how much he lost on it and how McLaren are a disgrace...facts are that he lost around £5k and one of the 6 issues he had is that 'he' lost a 'set of keys...these guys need to have an agenda as they require viewings to generate income.
Its a bit depressing that people jump onto a post about a 'steering' warning upon startup that reset after stopping and starting the car which reset a most likely overly sensitive sensor, or that now i mentioned a temperamental airbrake issue has now been been mentioned as a 'brake' issue; its a supplemental brake as the near 400mm ceramic discs can deal with most braking required.
I admire Mac owners posting real life issues as they are helpful for other owners / potential owners... the problem is when others misconstrue these posts to satisfy the 'unreliable mclaren' agendas.
See, for the most, this thread has been very positive.
The car in question sat for around 4 months or so (i think) on a forecourt, and now it has been rudely awakened from its slumber and getting used more or less as a daily.
After that, of course the occasional sensor shall send out a false signal on start up, which usually vanishes after the ' Japanese reset' of taking key out, lock, open and restarting, and there shall be user error also as a new owner gets used to how things work.
So far, any issues or queries have been posted and generally followed up with a helpful post from a current or past owner offering a suggestion or a soloution; that's exactly what this site should be about.
On a footnote, the spaces in my heated garage are taken up by other stuff; since April the car has sat outside in the sun and the rain, gets used in the rain and at no point have i ever left it on trickle charge...just like every modern car it still works fine and takes it all in its stride...i wouldn't of even considered that in previous Ferraris...
Biggest brucie bonus is that the Volcano Orange never looks dirty...
The car in question sat for around 4 months or so (i think) on a forecourt, and now it has been rudely awakened from its slumber and getting used more or less as a daily.
After that, of course the occasional sensor shall send out a false signal on start up, which usually vanishes after the ' Japanese reset' of taking key out, lock, open and restarting, and there shall be user error also as a new owner gets used to how things work.
So far, any issues or queries have been posted and generally followed up with a helpful post from a current or past owner offering a suggestion or a soloution; that's exactly what this site should be about.
On a footnote, the spaces in my heated garage are taken up by other stuff; since April the car has sat outside in the sun and the rain, gets used in the rain and at no point have i ever left it on trickle charge...just like every modern car it still works fine and takes it all in its stride...i wouldn't of even considered that in previous Ferraris...
Biggest brucie bonus is that the Volcano Orange never looks dirty...
Today was not a great day
- first a warning light came on on the Scuderia (could be anything from a faulty sensor to the cats being on their way out)
- then the Nav screen on the FF decided that vertical lines look much better than actual content (I suspect it is f...cked)
On both of those I suspect the warranty will not be of any use (unconfirmed for now)
So in summary - not only McLarens have issues
- first a warning light came on on the Scuderia (could be anything from a faulty sensor to the cats being on their way out)
- then the Nav screen on the FF decided that vertical lines look much better than actual content (I suspect it is f...cked)
On both of those I suspect the warranty will not be of any use (unconfirmed for now)
So in summary - not only McLarens have issues
MDL111 said:
Today was not a great day
- first a warning light came on on the Scuderia (could be anything from a faulty sensor to the cats being on their way out)
- then the Nav screen on the FF decided that vertical lines look much better than actual content (I suspect it is f...cked)
On both of those I suspect the warranty will not be of any use (unconfirmed for now)
So in summary - not only McLarens have issues
Mate you have an FF and a Scuderia two of the most amazing cars on the planet. First world problems. - first a warning light came on on the Scuderia (could be anything from a faulty sensor to the cats being on their way out)
- then the Nav screen on the FF decided that vertical lines look much better than actual content (I suspect it is f...cked)
On both of those I suspect the warranty will not be of any use (unconfirmed for now)
So in summary - not only McLarens have issues
If dealer won’t pick up as good will fix (they should) try and buy new screen unit via salvage!
RobDown said:
Sorry i disagree, not with your Ferrari 458 comment but with the McLaren one.
They have a reputation for unreliability for two reasons.
1. They have “realisability issues”. Let’s not bury heads in sand here, every car manufacturer has realisability issues, but McLaren seem to be faring worse than some others at the moment. Corrosion on panels? They all do that sir. We all have friends/relatives who’ve had problematic McLarens. It’s why keeping the warranty going seems a common recommendation.
2. The warranty. Where are we now on the cost of this £3.5-5k per annum (from McLaren)? That’s expensive. For contrast extending a warranty on an Aston Martin V12 Vantage is about £1,600, albeit many don’t bother because the cars are reliable (don’t get me started on the new Vantage, those have McLaren-like issues at the moment). The warranty is expensive because the underwriting company is paying out a lot of money.....
There’s no need to be in denial about reliability, it’s not someone challenging your masculinity! The cars are clearly great. Everyone I know says so, even if they also bemoan reliability. I’d love to get one. It’s one of the reasons that I’m following Davek994s move from a Vantage to a 650, his thread in the Aston Forum was great on the latter.
So I’m really looking forward to hearing how he gets on over the next 12 months - highs and lows
+1They have a reputation for unreliability for two reasons.
1. They have “realisability issues”. Let’s not bury heads in sand here, every car manufacturer has realisability issues, but McLaren seem to be faring worse than some others at the moment. Corrosion on panels? They all do that sir. We all have friends/relatives who’ve had problematic McLarens. It’s why keeping the warranty going seems a common recommendation.
2. The warranty. Where are we now on the cost of this £3.5-5k per annum (from McLaren)? That’s expensive. For contrast extending a warranty on an Aston Martin V12 Vantage is about £1,600, albeit many don’t bother because the cars are reliable (don’t get me started on the new Vantage, those have McLaren-like issues at the moment). The warranty is expensive because the underwriting company is paying out a lot of money.....
There’s no need to be in denial about reliability, it’s not someone challenging your masculinity! The cars are clearly great. Everyone I know says so, even if they also bemoan reliability. I’d love to get one. It’s one of the reasons that I’m following Davek994s move from a Vantage to a 650, his thread in the Aston Forum was great on the latter.
So I’m really looking forward to hearing how he gets on over the next 12 months - highs and lows
IMI A said:
MDL111 said:
Today was not a great day
- first a warning light came on on the Scuderia (could be anything from a faulty sensor to the cats being on their way out)
- then the Nav screen on the FF decided that vertical lines look much better than actual content (I suspect it is f...cked)
On both of those I suspect the warranty will not be of any use (unconfirmed for now)
So in summary - not only McLarens have issues
Mate you have an FF and a Scuderia two of the most amazing cars on the planet. First world problems. - first a warning light came on on the Scuderia (could be anything from a faulty sensor to the cats being on their way out)
- then the Nav screen on the FF decided that vertical lines look much better than actual content (I suspect it is f...cked)
On both of those I suspect the warranty will not be of any use (unconfirmed for now)
So in summary - not only McLarens have issues
If dealer won’t pick up as good will fix (they should) try and buy new screen unit via salvage!
A Ferrari owner very considerately posts in sympathy as he also develops two ( in my experience ) potentially very expensive to rectify issues, and the first post thereafter dismisses the issues as they are 'amazing' cars and its a first world problem.
There is no 'denial' about problems or reliability on the McLaren forum and certainly no challenge on masculinity for whatever that means.
Indeed more share on here than any other 'supercar' forum and that is exactly what this thread was all about..the collection of a 650 spider and any issues uncovered by using it as a daily.
The big difference is that any posts about a problem on the Ferrari or Lambo forums is met with the same positive help without the need for others to feel the need to jump in and talk the brands down...constantly.
Lets just enjoy the thread and continue with helpful posts.
There have been quite a few comments on the thread, so thought I'd give an update now I've owned the car just over a week.
Reversing sensors seem to be working reliably - so I'm assuming that I just didn't hear them on the first day. It's fair to say that they are a bit crap - much quieter than the front ones, and you really do need to make sure you're listening very carefully.
I have been driving like Miss Daisy since I last filled up - I admit that I've put my foot down very briefly a couple of times, but it really was very rare and very brief. Even so, after 150 miles I'm down to about 1/4 tank and an estimated 50 mile range - on long runs I can believe I might see a decent tank range, but in my normal use I'm doubting I'll ever see 200 miles from a tank (trip says I've managed 16.8 mpg). A bit annoying - I don't care so much about mpg, but do prefer a decent tank range.
The dashcam (Nextbase) was not working reliably. It gets power - but it seems to go into some kind of mode where it thinks it's plugged into a computer. I have two, and they are both doing the same - so I've used the lighter socket instead. I've managed to route the cable so it's mostly out of sight which is good enough. In fact, I think I found an earth - there is a plastic cover at the end of the dash - under there is a bolt which looks like it would be an earth - which means I could wire the dash cam into the fuse box after all. I may do that at some point in the future.
The error I had has not occurred again, and the car has been pretty much fault free. It does have an annoying creak from the dashboard area - only tend to notice it with the roof up - which is particularly annoying because it was noticed on the second test drive and was supposed to be sorted, but I suspect it wasn't looked at. At some point, it will need to be sorted - it's surprisingly annoying.
DAB where I live is poor - even Radio 2 which I'd expect to be national. Works fine 5 miles down the road, but struggles to keep the signal around Camberley.
It seems the car has a more serious problem that I was unaware of when I bought it - it........ doesn't have a vanity mirror on the passenger sun visor. This is apparently a major problem - I really don't understand why. For one thing, the Alfa didn't have one either. The g/f called McLaren to see if it was an option - on some cars, it is possible but not the 650 apparently.
Apparently, there are stick on mirrors - however, nobody is sticking anything on the interior of my car.
I did check the oil level again a couple of times and it's fine.
Overall, I'm still happy with the car. I would like the wheels sorted - I'm expecting a call from McLaren tomorrow about that.
Given many of the comments on the McLaren forum, I guess the car is worth about £1.50 now that I've owned it for 9 days and I'm lucky it hasn't left me stranded at the side of the road at least once. I had last week and this week off work, so it's still not really being used "normally" - will be interesting to see how it feels when it is. So far, I think it is a very good replacement for the Aston / Alfa - albeit a rather expensive one.
Reversing sensors seem to be working reliably - so I'm assuming that I just didn't hear them on the first day. It's fair to say that they are a bit crap - much quieter than the front ones, and you really do need to make sure you're listening very carefully.
I have been driving like Miss Daisy since I last filled up - I admit that I've put my foot down very briefly a couple of times, but it really was very rare and very brief. Even so, after 150 miles I'm down to about 1/4 tank and an estimated 50 mile range - on long runs I can believe I might see a decent tank range, but in my normal use I'm doubting I'll ever see 200 miles from a tank (trip says I've managed 16.8 mpg). A bit annoying - I don't care so much about mpg, but do prefer a decent tank range.
The dashcam (Nextbase) was not working reliably. It gets power - but it seems to go into some kind of mode where it thinks it's plugged into a computer. I have two, and they are both doing the same - so I've used the lighter socket instead. I've managed to route the cable so it's mostly out of sight which is good enough. In fact, I think I found an earth - there is a plastic cover at the end of the dash - under there is a bolt which looks like it would be an earth - which means I could wire the dash cam into the fuse box after all. I may do that at some point in the future.
The error I had has not occurred again, and the car has been pretty much fault free. It does have an annoying creak from the dashboard area - only tend to notice it with the roof up - which is particularly annoying because it was noticed on the second test drive and was supposed to be sorted, but I suspect it wasn't looked at. At some point, it will need to be sorted - it's surprisingly annoying.
DAB where I live is poor - even Radio 2 which I'd expect to be national. Works fine 5 miles down the road, but struggles to keep the signal around Camberley.
It seems the car has a more serious problem that I was unaware of when I bought it - it........ doesn't have a vanity mirror on the passenger sun visor. This is apparently a major problem - I really don't understand why. For one thing, the Alfa didn't have one either. The g/f called McLaren to see if it was an option - on some cars, it is possible but not the 650 apparently.
Apparently, there are stick on mirrors - however, nobody is sticking anything on the interior of my car.
I did check the oil level again a couple of times and it's fine.
Overall, I'm still happy with the car. I would like the wheels sorted - I'm expecting a call from McLaren tomorrow about that.
Given many of the comments on the McLaren forum, I guess the car is worth about £1.50 now that I've owned it for 9 days and I'm lucky it hasn't left me stranded at the side of the road at least once. I had last week and this week off work, so it's still not really being used "normally" - will be interesting to see how it feels when it is. So far, I think it is a very good replacement for the Aston / Alfa - albeit a rather expensive one.
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