A 12c flying in face of reason?
Discussion
Wind back exactly 4 years when I was looking for a 981 Spyder / GT4 but the overs were so high that a McLaren 12C was available for similar money. A Boxster or a McLaren????
Needless to say I took a big brave pill and bought an approved 12C with 2 years warranty.
I owned that car for over 2 years and 14k amazing miles. I still think the 12C coupe is the best looking McLaren (bar the 675LT & F1). They are rocket ship fast while remaining comfortable, spacious & usable. We did many trips to the Alps with lots of luggage all swallowed up no problem. And 30 mpg to boot, try that in an Italian competitor!
Buy with a warranty and expect some niggles but nothing serious. They are all fixed under warranty, in fact the £3,500 warranty (at the time) is all my 12C cost me to run apart from one £1,000 service and a set of tyres, £880. Almost all the other cars I have owned have ended up costing more than the McWarranty per year in repairs so you need to put that into perspective.
I sold my car on the spur of the moment and replaced with a 981 Spyder. They are completely different cars and I adore them both but they are not comparable. Of course the 12C is faster but the Spyder is more old school. Depends what you like?
I still have my 981 Spyder and its not going anywhere but the desire to own another McLaren never went away so I bought a 675LT Clubsport to go with my Spyder.
My advice would be get the colour & spec you want, buy from a dealer and negotiate as much warranty as possible. McLarens are easier to sell with a warranty (should you need to). Buying from Alistair Bolls is the only non-Mclaren route I would consider other than a private sale with warranty transfer from a trusted & known individual.
Any residual niggles should be sorted in the first year and after that, when you know the car, you can decide if you want to continue with the £5k pa McWarranty, Thorney's Warranty or self Warranty. Thorney probably knows more about the 12C than most McLaren dealers anyway.
I still can't call it between the 981 GT4 / Spyder & the 12C because they are 2 of my all time favourite cars. They are very, very different cars but both will satisfy you. But the 12C is so much faster, so much more comfortable and lets face it much more exotic, it's a supercar! A GT4 is not but it is a very fine sports car, possibly the best (other than a Lotus Exige but that's another discussion). Do you want a supercar or a sportscar? (there is no wrong answer).
Good luck with your search.
Needless to say I took a big brave pill and bought an approved 12C with 2 years warranty.
I owned that car for over 2 years and 14k amazing miles. I still think the 12C coupe is the best looking McLaren (bar the 675LT & F1). They are rocket ship fast while remaining comfortable, spacious & usable. We did many trips to the Alps with lots of luggage all swallowed up no problem. And 30 mpg to boot, try that in an Italian competitor!
Buy with a warranty and expect some niggles but nothing serious. They are all fixed under warranty, in fact the £3,500 warranty (at the time) is all my 12C cost me to run apart from one £1,000 service and a set of tyres, £880. Almost all the other cars I have owned have ended up costing more than the McWarranty per year in repairs so you need to put that into perspective.
I sold my car on the spur of the moment and replaced with a 981 Spyder. They are completely different cars and I adore them both but they are not comparable. Of course the 12C is faster but the Spyder is more old school. Depends what you like?
I still have my 981 Spyder and its not going anywhere but the desire to own another McLaren never went away so I bought a 675LT Clubsport to go with my Spyder.
My advice would be get the colour & spec you want, buy from a dealer and negotiate as much warranty as possible. McLarens are easier to sell with a warranty (should you need to). Buying from Alistair Bolls is the only non-Mclaren route I would consider other than a private sale with warranty transfer from a trusted & known individual.
Any residual niggles should be sorted in the first year and after that, when you know the car, you can decide if you want to continue with the £5k pa McWarranty, Thorney's Warranty or self Warranty. Thorney probably knows more about the 12C than most McLaren dealers anyway.
I still can't call it between the 981 GT4 / Spyder & the 12C because they are 2 of my all time favourite cars. They are very, very different cars but both will satisfy you. But the 12C is so much faster, so much more comfortable and lets face it much more exotic, it's a supercar! A GT4 is not but it is a very fine sports car, possibly the best (other than a Lotus Exige but that's another discussion). Do you want a supercar or a sportscar? (there is no wrong answer).
Good luck with your search.
Bispal said:
Buy with a warranty and expect some niggles but nothing serious. They are all fixed under warranty, in fact the £3,500 warranty (at the time) is all my 12C cost me to run apart from one £1,000 service and a set of tyres, £880. Almost all the other cars I have owned have ended up costing more than the McWarranty per year in repairs so you need to put that into perspective.
Thanks Bispal for the advice. Out of interest, did the GT4 actually cost more on repairs than the 3.5k the McLaren or are we talking more generally and mainly older cars?
981 spyder I’ve never seen in the flesh, but had been thinking they are nice balance between that feels special and rare to own but can slide under the radar relatively well. Does sound like you’ve had a great run of cars.
I only ruled out an exige on the basis that it was actually going to cost me more to own for a few years than a GT4, but absolutely fantastic machine and significant appeal in the lack of badge snobbery involved in owning a lotus / nicer sales reps to deal with.
On that note, how often did members of the public feel the need to mouth w**ker at you / refuse to let you in at junctions in the 12c compared with the GT4?
rootsandculture said:
On that note, how often did members of the public feel the need to mouth w**ker at you / refuse to let you in at junctions in the 12c compared with the GT4?
I've never had a GT4 - but my experience of 996 turbo says that Porsche are largely invisible these days and you're no more likely to get any more notice than a Ford Focus.My 650 gets a LOT of attention. It is in a whole different league to my Ferrari 360. People will literally wind their windows down while you're driving along, and last week I had to wait to get into it to let somebody take photos in a car park. But it's all very very positive - people absolutely love them. It was one of the aspects that made me hesitant about buying one, but once you get used to it, it's not so bad.
rootsandculture said:
Bispal said:
Buy with a warranty and expect some niggles but nothing serious. They are all fixed under warranty, in fact the £3,500 warranty (at the time) is all my 12C cost me to run apart from one £1,000 service and a set of tyres, £880. Almost all the other cars I have owned have ended up costing more than the McWarranty per year in repairs so you need to put that into perspective.
Thanks Bispal for the advice. Out of interest, did the GT4 actually cost more on repairs than the 3.5k the McLaren or are we talking more generally and mainly older cars?
981 spyder I’ve never seen in the flesh, but had been thinking they are nice balance between that feels special and rare to own but can slide under the radar relatively well. Does sound like you’ve had a great run of cars.
I only ruled out an exige on the basis that it was actually going to cost me more to own for a few years than a GT4, but absolutely fantastic machine and significant appeal in the lack of badge snobbery involved in owning a lotus / nicer sales reps to deal with.
On that note, how often did members of the public feel the need to mouth w**ker at you / refuse to let you in at junctions in the 12c compared with the GT4?
Never had any negativity towards any car I have had by the 'public' they love McLaren's and Lotus. They seem nonplussed about Porsche but the Spyder does get more attention than other Porsche's I have had. TBH the most attention I ever got with a car I owned was a 1985 BMW M635CSi, people went nuts over it. But it cost a fortune to keep on the road and broke every time I used it. After that my immaculate MK1 MX5 starts more conversations in petrol stations than my McLaren, Porsche or my Exige 430 CUP , go figure because I can't...!
I don't think a 350 Sport Exige will cost more to own than a GT4, you can get a nice Exige for £35 - £40k and there can't be much more depreciation left. I adore my 430 CUP its a real occasion and sounds fantastic. Whereas the GT4 / Spyder have an uncertain future with the new 718 variant and the reintroduction of the 6 cyl GTS. However only 220 x 981 Spyders in the UK and they are stunning cars. Can't go wrong with a 981. However as I said before a 12C 'is' a supercar and if you want a supercar experience the 12C is the best at that price by a country mile, they are utterly outstanding.
12pack said:
while the ladies are looking hard to figure out who's driving 
Then the look of disappointment when they realise it isn't someone famous or good looking, but is a balding and fat middle aged bloke in the drivers seat - that's my experience anyway.At no point have I experienced any poor behaviour - always the opposite. Macs are so rare to see, Joe Public mostly think the 720S is an F1 or P1 and that it cost at least £1M. Maybe as McLarens become more mainstream the perception will change.
Bispal said:
TBH the most attention I ever got with a car I owned was a 1985 BMW M635CSi, people went nuts over it. But it cost a fortune to keep on the road and broke every time I used it.
Out of interest was the M6 worth the money over a 635 csi for the engine? Always felt they were a bit under appreciated given the M1 motor relationship but never driven one. The equivalent with a Porsche badge would have a zero on the end these days.
rootsandculture said:
Bispal said:
TBH the most attention I ever got with a car I owned was a 1985 BMW M635CSi, people went nuts over it. But it cost a fortune to keep on the road and broke every time I used it.
Out of interest was the M6 worth the money over a 635 csi for the engine? Always felt they were a bit under appreciated given the M1 motor relationship but never driven one. The equivalent with a Porsche badge would have a zero on the end these days.
As far as I know they never raced the M635 which had a 24 valve head, they always used the standard 12 valve car but with a manual box. As is the case with period 4 valve cars they are a bit 'toppy' and the 2 valve cars have more low end grunt. I expect a well set up 12 valve car with a manual box and LSD might be the pick of the bunch if properly set up. In retrospect my M635 was probably a bit of a dog and the other car I considered at the time was a 944 S2 or turbo, which I still have a yearning for.... The 80's shark nose BMW's look amazing BUT the steering on all of them is truly appalling, I won't own another. I was almost tempted by an E12 M535i last year but the reliability & driving numbness of all my previous BMW's put me off.
An immaculate E28 M5 or even E34 M5 would be my pick now over the E24 M635. Even the door seals drove me mad, you will never get the door glass to seal properly! In fact the point of classics is the shape now so I would take an E28 535i or E30 325i over an M car. I will never ever buy any M car ever again...
I always read the comments on this forum. Been a Porsche man since 1992 and on number 16 ,had various models over the years .I have been fortunate to have owned a couple off Spyders a 987 I still have after 8years ,sold the 981 last year after 3 years of ownership ,in both case all it has cost me is service nothing else and to date depreciation free .
I have had a short drive in a 12c and 520 some time back loved both but could not get my head round the warranty and higher service costs and depreciation over the Porsche I know they are different cars but a 2year Porsche warranty is £1600 inc assist and a major service £670 every 2years
enjoy your cars and will continue to read your posts
I have had a short drive in a 12c and 520 some time back loved both but could not get my head round the warranty and higher service costs and depreciation over the Porsche I know they are different cars but a 2year Porsche warranty is £1600 inc assist and a major service £670 every 2years
enjoy your cars and will continue to read your posts
Edited by woodysnr on Wednesday 29th January 09:51
Bispal said:
I had a standard 635CSi too, this was within past 5 years so not 'back in the day'. Although I had lots of experience as a young passenger in both. My 635 was an auto and wasn't that quick. The M635 was quite fast and sounded amazing. However both cars had diabolical steering.
As far as I know they never raced the M635 which had a 24 valve head, they always used the standard 12 valve car but with a manual box. As is the case with period 4 valve cars they are a bit 'toppy' and the 2 valve cars have more low end grunt. I expect a well set up 12 valve car with a manual box and LSD might be the pick of the bunch if properly set up. In retrospect my M635 was probably a bit of a dog and the other car I considered at the time was a 944 S2 or turbo, which I still have a yearning for.... The 80's shark nose BMW's look amazing BUT the steering on all of them is truly appalling, I won't own another. I was almost tempted by an E12 M535i last year but the reliability & driving numbness of all my previous BMW's put me off.
An immaculate E28 M5 or even E34 M5 would be my pick now over the E24 M635. Even the door seals drove me mad, you will never get the door glass to seal properly! In fact the point of classics is the shape now so I would take an E28 535i or E30 325i over an M car. I will never ever buy any M car ever again...
Your car history is class from the sounds of it.As far as I know they never raced the M635 which had a 24 valve head, they always used the standard 12 valve car but with a manual box. As is the case with period 4 valve cars they are a bit 'toppy' and the 2 valve cars have more low end grunt. I expect a well set up 12 valve car with a manual box and LSD might be the pick of the bunch if properly set up. In retrospect my M635 was probably a bit of a dog and the other car I considered at the time was a 944 S2 or turbo, which I still have a yearning for.... The 80's shark nose BMW's look amazing BUT the steering on all of them is truly appalling, I won't own another. I was almost tempted by an E12 M535i last year but the reliability & driving numbness of all my previous BMW's put me off.
An immaculate E28 M5 or even E34 M5 would be my pick now over the E24 M635. Even the door seals drove me mad, you will never get the door glass to seal properly! In fact the point of classics is the shape now so I would take an E28 535i or E30 325i over an M car. I will never ever buy any M car ever again...
Actually quite excited to know now that the people you see driving around in, say, McLarens are also the people looking for door seals on a m635i on ebay.
At the risk of derailing the thread further, I thought that the m635i had essentially a tweaked version of the 24v engine they used in the M1. And I always thought that was quite cool given as they’re not crazy crazy money.
I’m into the e28’s but recently felt they're strong money when you put it up against the hotter end of the transaxle Porsche’s.
If you ever want to scratch the 944 turbo itch, let me know and you might be helping me on the way to 12c ownership!
rootsandculture said:
Your car history is class from the sounds of it.
Actually quite excited to know now that the people you see driving around in, say, McLarens are also the people looking for door seals on a m635i on ebay.
At the risk of derailing the thread further, I thought that the m635i had essentially a tweaked version of the 24v engine they used in the M1. And I always thought that was quite cool given as they’re not crazy crazy money.
I’m into the e28’s but recently felt they're strong money when you put it up against the hotter end of the transaxle Porsche’s.
If you ever want to scratch the 944 turbo itch, let me know and you might be helping me on the way to 12c ownership!
I had an E39 M5 in the early 2000's, that was a great car, so underrated. Rock solid build quality too.Actually quite excited to know now that the people you see driving around in, say, McLarens are also the people looking for door seals on a m635i on ebay.
At the risk of derailing the thread further, I thought that the m635i had essentially a tweaked version of the 24v engine they used in the M1. And I always thought that was quite cool given as they’re not crazy crazy money.
I’m into the e28’s but recently felt they're strong money when you put it up against the hotter end of the transaxle Porsche’s.
If you ever want to scratch the 944 turbo itch, let me know and you might be helping me on the way to 12c ownership!
To bring things full circle to McLaren there was a famous BMW advert for the E36 M3 Evo parked next to a McLaren F1 and it was generally accepted at the time the McLaren V12 was two E36 Evo engines stuck together (not sure of the veracity of this but the BMW advert certainly played that link up).
cgt2 said:
I had an E39 M5 in the early 2000's, that was a great car, so underrated. Rock solid build quality too.
To bring things full circle to McLaren there was a famous BMW advert for the E36 M3 Evo parked next to a McLaren F1 and it was generally accepted at the time the McLaren V12 was two E36 Evo engines stuck together (not sure of the veracity of this but the BMW advert certainly played that link up).
Ah yes. There’s a collecting cars podcast In which they touch on this. From memory they tested the v12 in an e39 m5, which if it l exists now is a bloody cool car.To bring things full circle to McLaren there was a famous BMW advert for the E36 M3 Evo parked next to a McLaren F1 and it was generally accepted at the time the McLaren V12 was two E36 Evo engines stuck together (not sure of the veracity of this but the BMW advert certainly played that link up).
Infact someone with more disposable income than me should really be putting the current McLaren V8 into an old m5 in homage.
Here’s a link, it’s episode 2
https://collectingcars.com/podcasts/
rootsandculture said:
Bispal said:
I had a standard 635CSi too, this was within past 5 years so not 'back in the day'. Although I had lots of experience as a young passenger in both. My 635 was an auto and wasn't that quick. The M635 was quite fast and sounded amazing. However both cars had diabolical steering.
As far as I know they never raced the M635 which had a 24 valve head, they always used the standard 12 valve car but with a manual box. As is the case with period 4 valve cars they are a bit 'toppy' and the 2 valve cars have more low end grunt. I expect a well set up 12 valve car with a manual box and LSD might be the pick of the bunch if properly set up. In retrospect my M635 was probably a bit of a dog and the other car I considered at the time was a 944 S2 or turbo, which I still have a yearning for.... The 80's shark nose BMW's look amazing BUT the steering on all of them is truly appalling, I won't own another. I was almost tempted by an E12 M535i last year but the reliability & driving numbness of all my previous BMW's put me off.
An immaculate E28 M5 or even E34 M5 would be my pick now over the E24 M635. Even the door seals drove me mad, you will never get the door glass to seal properly! In fact the point of classics is the shape now so I would take an E28 535i or E30 325i over an M car. I will never ever buy any M car ever again...
Your car history is class from the sounds of it.As far as I know they never raced the M635 which had a 24 valve head, they always used the standard 12 valve car but with a manual box. As is the case with period 4 valve cars they are a bit 'toppy' and the 2 valve cars have more low end grunt. I expect a well set up 12 valve car with a manual box and LSD might be the pick of the bunch if properly set up. In retrospect my M635 was probably a bit of a dog and the other car I considered at the time was a 944 S2 or turbo, which I still have a yearning for.... The 80's shark nose BMW's look amazing BUT the steering on all of them is truly appalling, I won't own another. I was almost tempted by an E12 M535i last year but the reliability & driving numbness of all my previous BMW's put me off.
An immaculate E28 M5 or even E34 M5 would be my pick now over the E24 M635. Even the door seals drove me mad, you will never get the door glass to seal properly! In fact the point of classics is the shape now so I would take an E28 535i or E30 325i over an M car. I will never ever buy any M car ever again...
Actually quite excited to know now that the people you see driving around in, say, McLarens are also the people looking for door seals on a m635i on ebay.
At the risk of derailing the thread further, I thought that the m635i had essentially a tweaked version of the 24v engine they used in the M1. And I always thought that was quite cool given as they’re not crazy crazy money.
I’m into the e28’s but recently felt they're strong money when you put it up against the hotter end of the transaxle Porsche’s.
If you ever want to scratch the 944 turbo itch, let me know and you might be helping me on the way to 12c ownership!
rootsandculture said:
cgt2 said:
I had an E39 M5 in the early 2000's, that was a great car, so underrated. Rock solid build quality too.
To bring things full circle to McLaren there was a famous BMW advert for the E36 M3 Evo parked next to a McLaren F1 and it was generally accepted at the time the McLaren V12 was two E36 Evo engines stuck together (not sure of the veracity of this but the BMW advert certainly played that link up).
Ah yes. There’s a collecting cars podcast In which they touch on this. From memory they tested the v12 in an e39 m5, which if it l exists now is a bloody cool car.To bring things full circle to McLaren there was a famous BMW advert for the E36 M3 Evo parked next to a McLaren F1 and it was generally accepted at the time the McLaren V12 was two E36 Evo engines stuck together (not sure of the veracity of this but the BMW advert certainly played that link up).
Infact someone with more disposable income than me should really be putting the current McLaren V8 into an old m5 in homage.
Here’s a link, it’s episode 2
https://collectingcars.com/podcasts/
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