600LT with clubsport pro, £125k...
Discussion
Since Surface Transforms have been mentioned, I can offer some first hand experience of these.
I have a modified 981GT4 which was originally fitted with PCCB's and Pagid RSC1 pads ... I drive the car quite hard (though it's over-serviced) and for context I would expect to see 1.19 on a fast day at Donington.
With the PCCB's trying to preserve them I would always do two cooling down laps and replace the pads at half worn ... after three or four trackdays. I then replaced the PCCB's with ST's and RSC1 pads and found that I could get around 10 trackdays to a set of pads with the same couple of cooling down laps.
After about 50 trackdays I noticed that pad wear was increasing and I had a little brake judder at first on track which cleared up once the discs warmed up ... so I arranged to have them skimmed and re-infused (a very high temperature process) ... and they came back like new with a note to say that at the current rate of wear i could expect another five or so skims before I would need a new set of discs (subject to no physical damage).
The cost was £2500 plus of course a new set of pads, and they are just fantastic giving me around 1.35g deceleration to the threshold of the abs.
There is a story from early testing that a driver succeeded in wearing the front pads down to the backing plates and thought he had destroyed the discs. Surface Transform returned them fettled with a message that the metal was easily skimmed off the harder disc material and not to worry !
I have a modified 981GT4 which was originally fitted with PCCB's and Pagid RSC1 pads ... I drive the car quite hard (though it's over-serviced) and for context I would expect to see 1.19 on a fast day at Donington.
With the PCCB's trying to preserve them I would always do two cooling down laps and replace the pads at half worn ... after three or four trackdays. I then replaced the PCCB's with ST's and RSC1 pads and found that I could get around 10 trackdays to a set of pads with the same couple of cooling down laps.
After about 50 trackdays I noticed that pad wear was increasing and I had a little brake judder at first on track which cleared up once the discs warmed up ... so I arranged to have them skimmed and re-infused (a very high temperature process) ... and they came back like new with a note to say that at the current rate of wear i could expect another five or so skims before I would need a new set of discs (subject to no physical damage).
The cost was £2500 plus of course a new set of pads, and they are just fantastic giving me around 1.35g deceleration to the threshold of the abs.
There is a story from early testing that a driver succeeded in wearing the front pads down to the backing plates and thought he had destroyed the discs. Surface Transform returned them fettled with a message that the metal was easily skimmed off the harder disc material and not to worry !
ChrisW. said:
Since Surface Transforms have been mentioned, I can offer some first hand experience of these.
I have a modified 981GT4 which was originally fitted with PCCB's and Pagid RSC1 pads ... I drive the car quite hard (though it's over-serviced) and for context I would expect to see 1.19 on a fast day at Donington.
With the PCCB's trying to preserve them I would always do two cooling down laps and replace the pads at half worn ... after three or four trackdays. I then replaced the PCCB's with ST's and RSC1 pads and found that I could get around 10 trackdays to a set of pads with the same couple of cooling down laps.
After about 50 trackdays I noticed that pad wear was increasing and I had a little brake judder at first on track which cleared up once the discs warmed up ... so I arranged to have them skimmed and re-infused (a very high temperature process) ... and they came back like new with a note to say that at the current rate of wear i could expect another five or so skims before I would need a new set of discs (subject to no physical damage).
The cost was £2500 plus of course a new set of pads, and they are just fantastic giving me around 1.35g deceleration to the threshold of the abs.
There is a story from early testing that a driver succeeded in wearing the front pads down to the backing plates and thought he had destroyed the discs. Surface Transform returned them fettled with a message that the metal was easily skimmed off the harder disc material and not to worry !
Really cool to hear actually, thank you! I am contemplating putting them on my Pista next year or the year after when it's got a few more miles on it and I get a little less precious about tracking the car (i.e - when I know I'm going to keep it a nice long while..)I have a modified 981GT4 which was originally fitted with PCCB's and Pagid RSC1 pads ... I drive the car quite hard (though it's over-serviced) and for context I would expect to see 1.19 on a fast day at Donington.
With the PCCB's trying to preserve them I would always do two cooling down laps and replace the pads at half worn ... after three or four trackdays. I then replaced the PCCB's with ST's and RSC1 pads and found that I could get around 10 trackdays to a set of pads with the same couple of cooling down laps.
After about 50 trackdays I noticed that pad wear was increasing and I had a little brake judder at first on track which cleared up once the discs warmed up ... so I arranged to have them skimmed and re-infused (a very high temperature process) ... and they came back like new with a note to say that at the current rate of wear i could expect another five or so skims before I would need a new set of discs (subject to no physical damage).
The cost was £2500 plus of course a new set of pads, and they are just fantastic giving me around 1.35g deceleration to the threshold of the abs.
There is a story from early testing that a driver succeeded in wearing the front pads down to the backing plates and thought he had destroyed the discs. Surface Transform returned them fettled with a message that the metal was easily skimmed off the harder disc material and not to worry !
Thanks 
It's interesting that RPM Technik who now fit Manthey upgrades to Porsche GT products had been told by Manthey (owned by Porsche 51%) ... that they "preferred" not to fit Surface Transforms to cars wearing Manthey insignia.
.... Then Tim Harvey demanded them, and now they supply Surface Transforms to be used "as you wish".
It's a shame the the Porsche extended warranties don't like Pagid RSC1 pads (standard on PCCB's) but with Surface Transform discs ... I wonder why ? I wonder if this might change ?
It's interesting that RPM Technik who now fit Manthey upgrades to Porsche GT products had been told by Manthey (owned by Porsche 51%) ... that they "preferred" not to fit Surface Transforms to cars wearing Manthey insignia.
.... Then Tim Harvey demanded them, and now they supply Surface Transforms to be used "as you wish".
It's a shame the the Porsche extended warranties don't like Pagid RSC1 pads (standard on PCCB's) but with Surface Transform discs ... I wonder why ? I wonder if this might change ?
ChrisW. said:
Thanks
It's interesting that RPM Technik who now fit Manthey upgrades to Porsche GT products had been told by Manthey (owned by Porsche 51%) ... that they "preferred" not to fit Surface Transforms to cars wearing Manthey insignia.
.... Then Tim Harvey demanded them, and now they supply Surface Transforms to be used "as you wish".
It's a shame the the Porsche extended warranties don't like Pagid RSC1 pads (standard on PCCB's) but with Surface Transform discs ... I wonder why ? I wonder if this might change ?
Yeah, I have no idea how Ferrari will take to the idea of me running different brakes/pads, but a bridge to cross when I get to it.It's interesting that RPM Technik who now fit Manthey upgrades to Porsche GT products had been told by Manthey (owned by Porsche 51%) ... that they "preferred" not to fit Surface Transforms to cars wearing Manthey insignia.
.... Then Tim Harvey demanded them, and now they supply Surface Transforms to be used "as you wish".
It's a shame the the Porsche extended warranties don't like Pagid RSC1 pads (standard on PCCB's) but with Surface Transform discs ... I wonder why ? I wonder if this might change ?
Gibbo205 said:
Not sure about other McLaren models, but the weakness on the 600 LT is the stock OE pads are made of chocolate, they stop insanely well but need great care, so 1-2 cool down laps, don't let sessions exceed 15 minutes ideally and don't drive too hard, stick to this mindset and a set of OE pads will still only last 2-3 days. Over drive and spend to much time out, you will easily destroy brakes in a day with stock pads.
The Pagid RSC1 pads are much better, they last at least twice as long, expect 4-6 track days, of course the disc will be fine.
The main issue is the stock pads wear fastest, it is always the front outer pad, but top side wears quicker which of course you cannot see, so once your down to 3-4mm visible material, the top side will be around 1-2mm and can crumble, resulting in a destroyed disc.
As such on McLaren models it is crucial to change out pads at 4-5mm material showing from bottom of calliper, what you can see with wheels on, if you remove wheels you will generally find the pad has worn quicker at top by 1-2mm. At this time swapping out to RSC1 pads is a great idea.
Done a few track days in my 600 LT Spider, having owned 458, GT3, Exige, Caterham etc and when it comes to actual ability the 600 LT is just in another league, it is also a lot of fun, though nothing beats a Caterham for fun on track.
Also keep a mega close eye on oil levels on track, my 600 LT uses little to no oil in road driving but on a track day it can easily gobble around 0.5l of oil so be sure to check oil every 1-2 sessions in garage on perfectly flat ground and ensure it is in the green, add 100-200ml at a time as the gauge is sensitive.
Absolutely track them, they are bloody epic, last time I was on track I was passing 992 GT3 RS's and 675 LT's, I am not the best driver but I do love Donington National and am quite smooth, managed a 1:12-1:13 lap time even in my hands, my GT3 and 458 were around 1:16, Exige 410 was 1:18 and Caterham 1:20, absolutely a professional would see sub 1:10 or someone with no mechanical sympathy but for me the 600 LT feels just so race car on track, but I can then drive home, roof down, wind in my hair and get nearly 40mpg in comfort. Easily the best track car and best road car combination I have ever owned.
Cheers Gibbo....I still have a McLaren itch to scratch and am certainly no stranger to pad taper that needed to be managed in my pccb equipped 997.1 GT3 The Pagid RSC1 pads are much better, they last at least twice as long, expect 4-6 track days, of course the disc will be fine.
The main issue is the stock pads wear fastest, it is always the front outer pad, but top side wears quicker which of course you cannot see, so once your down to 3-4mm visible material, the top side will be around 1-2mm and can crumble, resulting in a destroyed disc.
As such on McLaren models it is crucial to change out pads at 4-5mm material showing from bottom of calliper, what you can see with wheels on, if you remove wheels you will generally find the pad has worn quicker at top by 1-2mm. At this time swapping out to RSC1 pads is a great idea.
Done a few track days in my 600 LT Spider, having owned 458, GT3, Exige, Caterham etc and when it comes to actual ability the 600 LT is just in another league, it is also a lot of fun, though nothing beats a Caterham for fun on track.
Also keep a mega close eye on oil levels on track, my 600 LT uses little to no oil in road driving but on a track day it can easily gobble around 0.5l of oil so be sure to check oil every 1-2 sessions in garage on perfectly flat ground and ensure it is in the green, add 100-200ml at a time as the gauge is sensitive.
Absolutely track them, they are bloody epic, last time I was on track I was passing 992 GT3 RS's and 675 LT's, I am not the best driver but I do love Donington National and am quite smooth, managed a 1:12-1:13 lap time even in my hands, my GT3 and 458 were around 1:16, Exige 410 was 1:18 and Caterham 1:20, absolutely a professional would see sub 1:10 or someone with no mechanical sympathy but for me the 600 LT feels just so race car on track, but I can then drive home, roof down, wind in my hair and get nearly 40mpg in comfort. Easily the best track car and best road car combination I have ever owned.
Edited by Gibbo205 on Thursday 4th January 12:46
Far Cough said:
Cheers Gibbo....I still have a McLaren itch to scratch and am certainly no stranger to pad taper that needed to be managed in my pccb equipped 997.1 GT3
Yeah my 997.1 C2S on ceramics did similar.If you can get into an LT McLaren do so, I've had some nice cars but the 600 LT has blown me away for its on track feel and just that feeling of man and machine becoming one, you can tell its a light car just from how it drives, it feels no heavier than my Exige did on track and feels far lighter than the Porsches I have had, 987 Spyder, 997.1 C2S and 991.1 GT3, also tracked a 991.1 GT3 RS and a Lambo Huracan EVO RWD the 600 LT felt far superior to both.
In a way it feels like having a cheat code activated on track, but thankfully it is still huge fun and engaging, your just lapping at a fair rate of speed even in my none professional hands.
Grey_Area said:
If the Surface Transforms are £15k/set plus pads, what the hell are the McLarens....
Ebay and owners group are your friends, I got a pair of 600LT/720S front disc in new condition for like £1400. Seen a few full sets swap hands for 4-5k brand new, but if you buy direct from McLaren you will pay a lot more.Grey_Area said:
If the Surface Transforms are £15k/set plus pads, what the hell are the McLarens....
I don't think the McLaren's are more expensive. I was told by Guildford a few years back that if I needed discs / pads, it would be around £6-7k for my 650. (I didn't need them, but did have pads at one point).I think surface transforms are supposed to offer a number of advantages over OEM - but I've never been convinced that price is one of them.
Davyt said:
McLaren fitted new front discs and pads on my 600 due to a bad score on drivers side rotor, I’m sure they said the cost was about £7500,, all done before I picked up the car so free to me ,,
That’s not too bad was thinking pads and rotors would be over £10k directly with McLaren. Gibbo205 said:
Yeah my 997.1 C2S on ceramics did similar.
If you can get into an LT McLaren do so, I've had some nice cars but the 600 LT has blown me away for its on track feel and just that feeling of man and machine becoming one, you can tell its a light car just from how it drives, it feels no heavier than my Exige did on track and feels far lighter than the Porsches I have had, 987 Spyder, 997.1 C2S and 991.1 GT3, also tracked a 991.1 GT3 RS and a Lambo Huracan EVO RWD the 600 LT felt far superior to both.
In a way it feels like having a cheat code activated on track, but thankfully it is still huge fun and engaging, your just lapping at a fair rate of speed even in my none professional hands.
Stop it ! You are no good for my bank account If you can get into an LT McLaren do so, I've had some nice cars but the 600 LT has blown me away for its on track feel and just that feeling of man and machine becoming one, you can tell its a light car just from how it drives, it feels no heavier than my Exige did on track and feels far lighter than the Porsches I have had, 987 Spyder, 997.1 C2S and 991.1 GT3, also tracked a 991.1 GT3 RS and a Lambo Huracan EVO RWD the 600 LT felt far superior to both.
In a way it feels like having a cheat code activated on track, but thankfully it is still huge fun and engaging, your just lapping at a fair rate of speed even in my none professional hands.
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