Ecotricity to start charging for charging

[s1962a]

Frimley111R said:

Its self defeating tbh. Price too high and everyone goes elsewhere or charges at home. If we could fill up cars with petrol/diesel at home for a fraction of the cost of a service station I wonder how many service stations there would be by now?

What is the point of these chargers? To fuel you up so you can go on your way yes? Last time I used one there was a backlog of electric taxis waiting to charge up for free. With the £6 they are charging, maybe those taxi's won't need to hog these rapids anymore and if you need an emergency charge it can be there for you.

[lost in espace]

andrewrob said:

I'd not driven one before and then did 200 miles collecting mine on saturday, same car 24kw.
It was fully charged when I collected it so played it safe and drove in eco mode did about 65mph to the first stop which was 70 miles then did a rapid charge to 80% and did 40 miles at 70ish, then another rapid to 80% then onto home, although stopped at a local rapid to top it up so my wife could try the car out.

I got full battery temp bars but didn't go into the red

Thanks Andrew, gives me some confidence!

[andrewrob]

lost in espace said:

andrewrob said:

I'd not driven one before and then did 200 miles collecting mine on saturday, same car 24kw.
It was fully charged when I collected it so played it safe and drove in eco mode did about 65mph to the first stop which was 70 miles then did a rapid charge to 80% and did 40 miles at 70ish, then another rapid to 80% then onto home, although stopped at a local rapid to top it up so my wife could try the car out.

I got full battery temp bars but didn't go into the red

Thanks Andrew, gives me some confidence!

No worries, also if the charger(s) on your side of the motorway are broken you can normally go to the service bridge/road exit and explain and they'll let you onto the opposite carriageway's services.

[Welshbeef]

s1962a said:

What is the point of these chargers? To fuel you up so you can go on your way yes? Last time I used one there was a backlog of electric taxis waiting to charge up for free. With the £6 they are charging, maybe those taxi's won't need to hog these rapids anymore and if you need an emergency charge it can be there for you.

Actually the taxi point and youths with Zoe and boom boxes in the boot make a lot of sense ban them all.

[lost in espace]

On my way back, this Leaf is a bit of a step up from a Zoe feels bigger. Set off with 99 miles on the display, sounds optimistic. Eco mode, 60mph behind trucks and aircon on full, sounds exciting doesn't it.

Stopped at services just past Cardiff, charger was free of charge but an identical Leaf was using it. 77 miles remaining, thought I would press on. Shortly afterwards drops to 26 miles on the clock and I am starting to worry, pulled into Leigh Delamere and after some faffing got the rapid working with the new app/£6. 67 miles from the first charge, so total range will be approx 90 miles.

113 miles left, might get away with 2 charges as long as all the charging stations are working...

Final stop at Reading services, my last free rapid charge I suppose.

Edited by lost in espace on Tuesday 19th July 19:26

[shep1001]

IN51GHT said:

Pretty much all chargers are done now.

Bradistan to Manchester down the M62, both services were still free certainly until yesterday as one of our team has a plug in.

[Spunagain]

Just got an email from Ecotricity about their EV charging network price increases changes:

Ecotricity said:

The energy will be charged at 17p per unit, which is pretty much the rate that people pay at home and the cost of providing the service will be via a £3 connection fee for all sessions.

I am glad I am not with them, I pay 10.29p per kWh!

On top of the energy charge the connection fee is £3 per session.

Ecotricity said:

In our modelling this will typically lower the cost of charging for all makes and models as well as charge more proportionally for energy taken.

For this to work the bulk of users have to have charged for less that 22 minutes - really?

Here are my sums for a 50kW Chademo connection!

Ecotricity charge change	New	Old
Connection	£3.00	£6.00
Unit charge	0.17	0
Time	30	30
power/Kw	50	50
Total 30min charge	£7.25	£6.00
Increase	21%
Calculation to match old £6.
Time	21.18
Total 21 minute 10 second min charge	£6.00

I guess that's progress

[essayer]

It's better for me on the non-rapid charge ZOE .. £6.52 for 22kWh, around 1hr

You'd have to be bonkers to do a long motorway trip in a ZOE though!

[Heres Johnny]

Spunagain said:

For this to work the bulk of users have to have charged for less that 22 minutes - really?

Here are my sums for a 50kW Chademo connection!

Ecotricity charge change	New	Old
Connection	£3.00	£6.00
Unit charge	0.17	0
Time	30	30
power/Kw	50	50
Total 30min charge	£7.25	£6.00
Increase	21%
Calculation to match old £6.
Time	21.18
Total 21 minute 10 second min charge	£6.00

I guess that's progress

I agree its a rip con, but for some it works out better. If you wanted say 35kwh then the old way would have cost you £12, the new way £8.95.

What makes me smile is 17p per kw/h undercuts the Tesla 20p especially if you had ecotricity at home and didn't pay the £3, only Tesla have just (as in yesterday) reintroduced free unlimted supercharging unless you've got your eyes closed and don't buy a car with a referral code.

[anonymous-user]

Price going up from 30p / kWh to 39p / kWh in 30 days...

https://twitter.com/DaleVince/status/1169215541250...

[oop north]

Ecotricity have been claiming they are fixing the ccs problem for years (the below is dated May 2015) and yet it’s just the same today...

Edited by oop north on Monday 9th September 22:21

[Matthen]

JPJPJP said:

Price going up from 30p / kWh to 39p / kWh in 30 days...

https://twitter.com/DaleVince/status/1169215541250...

39p/kWh is ridiculous, by any stretch. It's costs 13p to buy a KW worth of unleaded. So a petrol car needs to be under 33% efficient for a motorway journey to be more cost effective in an electric car.

What are they on? Surely fast charging prices should be on the way down, not up?

[LasseV]

Matthen said:

39p/kWh is ridiculous, by any stretch. It's costs 13p to buy a KW worth of unleaded. So a petrol car needs to be under 33% efficient for a motorway journey to be more cost effective in an electric car.

What are they on? Surely fast charging prices should be on the way down, not up?

Why they would go down?

[Matthen]

LasseV said:

Why they would go down?

Competition? Increased utilisation?

[Teem50]

Matthen said:

39p/kWh is ridiculous, by any stretch. It's costs 13p to buy a KW worth of unleaded. So a petrol car needs to be under 33% efficient for a motorway journey to be more cost effective in an electric car.

And most modern cars have an overall thermal efficiency of around about 33%. Odd that.. Famously the current F1 engines run at a thermal efficiency of just over 50%. Nothing in a road car is that extreme though.

In any case it seems to me a mistake to conflate ecotricity "pumps" with petrol pumps as the usage is so different. All petrol comes from pumps; I'd bet the vast majority of ev charge comes from home chargers.

T

[Matthen]

Teem50 said:

Matthen said:

39p/kWh is ridiculous, by any stretch. It's costs 13p to buy a KW worth of unleaded. So a petrol car needs to be under 33% efficient for a motorway journey to be more cost effective in an electric car.

And most modern cars have an overall thermal efficiency of around about 33%. Odd that.. Famously the current F1 engines run at a thermal efficiency of just over 50%. Nothing in a road car is that extreme though.

In any case it seems to me a mistake to conflate ecotricity "pumps" with petrol pumps as the usage is so different. All petrol comes from pumps; I'd bet the vast majority of ev charge comes from home chargers.

T

I am sure you're right. But still, when the govt. start taxing it, it's going to be a hella expensive way to "fill up"

[gangzoom]

Matthen said:

Competition? Increased utilisation?

Greedy land owners in the UK means Rapid Charging prices will likely go up not down.

Tesla have pretty much stopped expanding the UK Supercharger network partly because they are essentially been held to ransom by land owners wanting to charge crazy amounts for running power cables across their land.

Ionity is facing the same problem, they promised lots 12 months ago, but in reality has only been able to build a couple of sites in the UK.

Shell/BP etc is actually well positioned, they have the physical sites in place from petrol stations but why would they promote cheaper than petrol electric chargers? It'll be like turkeys voting for Christmas, infact putting in expensive rapid chargers is a great way to scare consumers away from EVs whilst been seen to be doing the right thing.

That only leaves Ecotricity and their monopoly of motorway services rapid charging. Ecotricity know they hold the best hand by far, and can essentially do what they like. Like all cartels consumers never win, but instead are forced to pay what ever cost is set out.

[Heres Johnny]

gangzoom said:

Greedy land owners in the UK means Rapid Charging prices will likely go up not down.

Tesla have pretty much stopped expanding the UK Supercharger network partly because they are essentially been held to ransom by land owners wanting to charge crazy amounts for running power cables across their land.

Ionity is facing the same problem, they promised lots 12 months ago, but in reality has only been able to build a couple of sites in the UK.

Shell/BP etc is actually well positioned, they have the physical sites in place from petrol stations but why would they promote cheaper than petrol electric chargers? It'll be like turkeys voting for Christmas, infact putting in expensive rapid chargers is a great way to scare consumers away from EVs whilst been seen to be doing the right thing.

That only leaves Ecotricity and their monopoly of motorway services rapid charging. Ecotricity know they hold the best hand by far, and can essentially do what they like. Like all cartels consumers never win, but instead are forced to pay what ever cost is set out.

Instavolt don't seem to be having the same problems... 72 rapids installed in one month earlier in the year, about 350 across the country and are now rolling out 125kw chargers.

Don’t believe every excuse you read.

[Smiljan]

The Tesla excuse for not expanding the supercharger network is wearing a little thin now.

[gangzoom]

Heres Johnny said:

Instavolt don't seem to be having the same problems... 72 rapids installed in one month earlier in the year, about 350 across the country and are now rolling out 125kw chargers.

Don’t believe every excuse you read.

And where are they locationwise??

I don't mind stopping at a service station for a rapid charge as is enroute, taking a 5-10 minute detour off the M ways is not what most people want to do. By the time you factor in return route on to the Mway thats a nearly 20 minutes wasted just driving to a charger.

Motorway services are the ideal and logical places for rapids, and on that front Ecotricity has pretty much total monopoly.