What MPG without charging - BMW 330e
Discussion
Anybody run their 330e and not bothered to charge it for a while, if you have what MPG will it deliver?
Will be chopping my 5 series in early next year and whilst I am not I die hard BMW fan, the 330e is the most tax efficient on paper. Our company policy on PHEV & hybrids is they only pay fuel based on the HMRC milage rate for the equivalent size petrol engined vehicle. I do about 30k/yr, won't have time to dick about charging it up in the day (which the company won't cover as I believe you have to pay for leech now at services) and it would be a faff to charge up at home as I would have to shuffle our cars about to get close to a power supply as I only have 2 off road spaces & 3 cars.
I guess I have 3 options:
1) F*ck the tax and just get whatever diesel car I want. Plenty of choice but the tax is £250/mnth+ on most of the cars I like & its only going up (keep the car for 3 years). Money is not an issue but being tight & northern I like too save a quid or two where I can.
2) Go for a hybrid - I really like the new Prius Excel, cheap as anything with all the toys as std compared to an equivalent spec BMW/Merc, drops me 2 car grades so I get cash back every month & it should be efficient enough that I am not topping up the fuel out of my own pocket each month
3) Get the BMW PHEV and accept I will have to use some of my tax savings each month to contribute to the shortfall on my fuel bill each month.
I really like the idea of the Prius but the mere suggestion that was what I was considering has resulted in a barrage of abuse from my work colleagues with jokes about taxis. I lent my car to the lab monkeys this week and when I got it back they had kitted it out with a beaded seat cover, steering wheel cover, roof sign topped off with a CD hung off rear view mirror.
If having driven the Prius & I don't like it, I need a 'plan B' that is looking like the PHEV BMW 3 series but I don't want to end up more out of pocket than just sucking up the higher tax bill of a diesel car that the company will cover all my company fuel spend.
It's all irrelevant from April 2017 if the government gets it's way...
https://www.ft.com/content/702b2a9a-6dc7-11e6-9ac1...
https://www.ft.com/content/702b2a9a-6dc7-11e6-9ac1...
shep1001 said:
I really like the idea of the Prius but the mere suggestion that was what I was considering has resulted in a barrage of abuse from my work colleagues with jokes about taxis. I lent my car to the lab monkeys this week and when I got it back they had kitted it out with a beaded seat cover, steering wheel cover, roof sign topped off with a CD hung off rear view mirror.
You're going to let what colleagues think of your car dictate your choice? Choose a car that suits your needs, not theirs. raspy said:
You're going to let what colleagues think of your car dictate your choice? Choose a car that suits your needs, not theirs.
Nah - b
ks to them I will get what I want regardless. Being northern & tight I don't like wasting money money but equally I don't want to end up making a mistake I will regret for 3 years 
Hi all. Just bumping this thread.
I'm considering a 330e or the soon to be 530e but want to know the worst case scenario in terms of MPG without ever plugging the car in.
I know that I'm too lazy to plug the car in each night and I do a lot of motorway mileage. My company only reimburse the HMRC recommended rate which for this car would be 14 ppm which equates to 37mpg.
Am I likely to easily recover this expense without charging the car? At the moment, I have a C220d which easily gets me 50+mpg and I do drive with a reasonably heavy foot but recover 13ppm (roughly 42mpg) so always always break even.
Any advice appreciated. I just want to make sure that I break even on every business journey.
I'm considering a 330e or the soon to be 530e but want to know the worst case scenario in terms of MPG without ever plugging the car in.
I know that I'm too lazy to plug the car in each night and I do a lot of motorway mileage. My company only reimburse the HMRC recommended rate which for this car would be 14 ppm which equates to 37mpg.
Am I likely to easily recover this expense without charging the car? At the moment, I have a C220d which easily gets me 50+mpg and I do drive with a reasonably heavy foot but recover 13ppm (roughly 42mpg) so always always break even.
Any advice appreciated. I just want to make sure that I break even on every business journey.
AER said:
Why are you worried about MPG when any delta probably represents less than a squillionth of the depreciation cost of running such a vehicle...?
Why don't you answer the question?If you lose 2p per mile as a company car owner and drive 15k miles on company business a year, that's a £300 loss. If you make 2p per mile which some cars can help do, that's a £300 gain, £600 in total per year, £50 a month.. The car may cost about £300-£400 a month for a company car driver. It's hardly negligible in context.
Edited by JonV8V on Tuesday 3rd January 08:39
Thanks all for your responses.
AER: It's a company car so wouldn't need to worry about depreciation. I think most sold are leased or company so doubt many are concerned with depreciation.
JonV8V: That is useful way to break it down and I will bear in mind.
Trabi601: thank you for your comment. This would be the perfect machine if it was 2001cc. I could reclaim 21ppm and only have to make 25mpg!!! Could almost drive it like I stole it and break even. That's why a lot of people on my fleet go for a Lexus IS with a 2.5l engine. You say 36-38mpg is tough in this car. What MPG are you achieving and what is your driving style and charging behaviour?
Chris: thanks for the feedback. Just out of interest, what's the worse MPG you got out of it on say a 30plus mile journey.
Thank you all again for your comments.
AER: It's a company car so wouldn't need to worry about depreciation. I think most sold are leased or company so doubt many are concerned with depreciation.
JonV8V: That is useful way to break it down and I will bear in mind.
Trabi601: thank you for your comment. This would be the perfect machine if it was 2001cc. I could reclaim 21ppm and only have to make 25mpg!!! Could almost drive it like I stole it and break even. That's why a lot of people on my fleet go for a Lexus IS with a 2.5l engine. You say 36-38mpg is tough in this car. What MPG are you achieving and what is your driving style and charging behaviour?
Chris: thanks for the feedback. Just out of interest, what's the worse MPG you got out of it on say a 30plus mile journey.
Thank you all again for your comments.
Duffman786 said:
Trabi601: thank you for your comment. This would be the perfect machine if it was 2001cc. I could reclaim 21ppm and only have to make 25mpg!!! Could almost drive it like I stole it and break even. That's why a lot of people on my fleet go for a Lexus IS with a 2.5l engine. You say 36-38mpg is tough in this car. What MPG are you achieving and what is your driving style and charging behaviour?
Sadly, I don't get the option for a 330e - all our BMW choices are diesel or non-hybrid petrol.However - I'm only managing low 40s in a 520d and my father in law is getting low 30s out of his 330i.
The hybrid drive can only recover so much energy - and if you're not plugging it in, you're running on whatever it can recover under coasting and braking.
Ideally, you'd want a 48 hour test drive, run the electric down, and drive a couple of normal days in it to get a definitive answer.
Put it this way, I had a Mk2 Prius and couldn't break 40mpg average in it.
The Beaver King said:
Two of the worst culprits for poor mpg with a PHEV; not charging it and lots of motorway miles.
Do not do it...
As a combination, I'd agree.Do not do it...
But if you charge and do motorway miles it's not too bad. On a 190 mile round trip in my 330e, starting fully charged, including a fun stint on the m4/a4 or m40/a40 into central london and back out I'll average 50mpg.
caseys said:
The Beaver King said:
Two of the worst culprits for poor mpg with a PHEV; not charging it and lots of motorway miles.
Do not do it...
As a combination, I'd agree.Do not do it...
But if you charge and do motorway miles it's not too bad. On a 190 mile round trip in my 330e, starting fully charged, including a fun stint on the m4/a4 or m40/a40 into central london and back out I'll average 50mpg.
Basically, I work from home so 90% of journeys are business (c20k per annum). As long as I can recover my fuel, I'll be happy.
Duffman786 said:
Chris: thanks for the feedback. Just out of interest, what's the worse MPG you got out of it on say a 30plus mile journey.
Good question. I don't know off the top of my head, I would guess somewhere around 35mpg. But that would be a completely uncharged longish motorway trip, with most of it cruising at 80-85 rather than 70.Might be worth working out your 'break even' point vs a diesel taking into account the BIK savings? Presumably that should give you plenty more wriggle room. It should never do any worse than a 330i ultimately and the BIK savings should cover that, plus the bonus of not being sat in a dreadful dag dag tractor mobile.
Duffman786 said:
That to me is a good deal. Would it be safe to say you would achieve no less than 40mpg on the same journey if you started with no charge and thus 14ppm (HMRC rate) would cover the journey?
Basically, I work from home so 90% of journeys are business (c20k per annum). As long as I can recover my fuel, I'll be happy.
With a light foot and without a boot full of stuff yes - as I've had to do it myself. That though involved sticking it on cruise for 70mph or 50mph through the average cams on the M3.Basically, I work from home so 90% of journeys are business (c20k per annum). As long as I can recover my fuel, I'll be happy.
Ditto like you, I only get the HMRC rates and so on my test drive of it I ensured I wouldn't be out of pocket for business miles. I also roughly am in the same situation as you, wfh or am in the city or with customers.
Don't forget also that you can apply for a gov grant of £500 towards a home charger - so total install costs are < £195 after the grant. If you have space to park the car off the road it's I think a no-brainer.
Looking at my stats on BMW connect, I have done 2400 miles, 519 (21.6%) of them on purely electric and I am averaging 47mpg over that 2400 miles. I've owned the car for about 5-6 weeks.
I've done some fag packet maths for you;
Somebody might need to double check my working, but it looks like it is fairly negligible over the year (unless you're a 40% taxer). The 330e will erode the money you get back for business miles, but it is pulled back by the BiK saving. Obviously this is even better if you're on 40-45% tax band.
I suppose it really comes down to what you want in a car.
Really big disclaimer coming up though; the BiK rates are going up for PHEV cars over the next few years and at a rate that approximately double the rise on diesels. Bear this in mind as the BiK increase could very well tip a diesel back in you favour and even make the 330e more expensive to run over the next 3 years.
| Measure | BMW 320d | BMW 330e |
|---|---|---|
| BiK p/y @20% | £1,431 | £615 |
| BiK p/y @40% | £2,863 | £1,230 |
| Fuel cost @20k miles | £2,109 @ 50mpg | £2,961 @ 35mpg |
| HMRC miles 16ppm for 15k miles | £2,400 | £2,400 |
| Fuel cost private @5k miles | £518 @ 50mpg | £740 @ 35mpg |
| Total difference for 20k miles | + £808 | + £179 |
| including BiK saving | £808 (none) | £995 (+£816) |
Somebody might need to double check my working, but it looks like it is fairly negligible over the year (unless you're a 40% taxer). The 330e will erode the money you get back for business miles, but it is pulled back by the BiK saving. Obviously this is even better if you're on 40-45% tax band.
I suppose it really comes down to what you want in a car.
Really big disclaimer coming up though; the BiK rates are going up for PHEV cars over the next few years and at a rate that approximately double the rise on diesels. Bear this in mind as the BiK increase could very well tip a diesel back in you favour and even make the 330e more expensive to run over the next 3 years.
The Beaver King said:
I've done some fag packet maths for you;
Somebody might need to double check my working, but it looks like it is fairly negligible over the year (unless you're a 40% taxer). The 330e will erode the money you get back for business miles, but it is pulled back by the BiK saving. Obviously this is even better if you're on 40-45% tax band.
I suppose it really comes down to what you want in a car.
The 320d will do 50mpg around town and around 65mpg on the motorway. So you would find the 320d for business use a bit cheaper than you have shown.
Really big disclaimer coming up though; the BiK rates are going up for PHEV cars over the next few years and at a rate that approximately double the rise on diesels. Bear this in mind as the BiK increase could very well tip a diesel back in you favour and even make the 330e more expensive to run over the next 3 years.
| Measure | BMW 320d | BMW 330e |
|---|---|---|
| BiK p/y @20% | £1,431 | £615 |
| BiK p/y @40% | £2,863 | £1,230 |
| Fuel cost @20k miles | £2,109 @ 50mpg | £2,961 @ 35mpg |
| HMRC miles 16ppm for 15k miles | £2,400 | £2,400 |
| Fuel cost private @5k miles | £518 @ 50mpg | £740 @ 35mpg |
| Total difference for 20k miles | + £808 | + £179 |
| including BiK saving | £808 (none) | £995 (+£816) |
Somebody might need to double check my working, but it looks like it is fairly negligible over the year (unless you're a 40% taxer). The 330e will erode the money you get back for business miles, but it is pulled back by the BiK saving. Obviously this is even better if you're on 40-45% tax band.
I suppose it really comes down to what you want in a car.
The 320d will do 50mpg around town and around 65mpg on the motorway. So you would find the 320d for business use a bit cheaper than you have shown.
Really big disclaimer coming up though; the BiK rates are going up for PHEV cars over the next few years and at a rate that approximately double the rise on diesels. Bear this in mind as the BiK increase could very well tip a diesel back in you favour and even make the 330e more expensive to run over the next 3 years.
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