How reliable are electric cars?

How reliable are electric cars?

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Discussion

98elise

26,625 posts

161 months

Tuesday 24th October 2017
quotequote all
Heres Johnny said:
babatunde said:
Question should probably ask if they are more reliable than ICE cars.


Answer is "we don't have a large enough subset to determine with any real accuracy" logic would support though that they would be more reliable than the equivalent ICE car due to fewer moving parts. The service schedules would support this hypothesis.

Once there are a few million on the road for 20+ years we will have a clearer view.
Service schedules don’t support it, Tesla recommend 12 months or 12.5k miles, that’s a lot more often than my last BMW. They don’t invalidate warranty if you don’t get it serviced, but that’s not the same as saying it shows they’re more reliable.

Given time they will be, and maybe it’s just Tesla, but Tesla are constantly rolling out software fixes and require the odd service centre visit.
There isn't much involved in a Tesla service though

Every 12,500 miles..

> Key fob battery replacement
> Multi-point inspection
> Tyre rotation (if needed)
> Wheel alignment check (and adjustment, if needed)
> Wiper blade set replacement

On the first 12,500 mile service there is also a drive unit fluids check.

Every 25,000 mile add..

> A/C desiccant bag replacement
> Battery coolant replacement
> Brake fluid replacement
> Cabin air filter replacement



TooLateForAName

4,751 posts

184 months

Tuesday 24th October 2017
quotequote all
feef said:
8K+ for a 2013 onwards is not really stretching a 'little bit' it's 25% more.

I've looked at both, and for the vast majority of my journeys (5 miles each way to work with maybe a detour via the school, and 40 miles on a saturday) the difference in range isn't a massive issue.

Is there an issue with the electric parking brake?
I paid £8900 for a 15K mile battery owned 2013 acenta 6.6 2 years ago. I'm sure you can get one for well under 8K now. Keep an eye on the speakev classifieds.

Electric parking brakes are very expensive if they go wrong.

Edited by TooLateForAName on Tuesday 24th October 14:52

Heres Johnny

7,229 posts

124 months

Tuesday 24th October 2017
quotequote all
98elise said:
There isn't much involved in a Tesla service though

Every 12,500 miles..

> Key fob battery replacement
> Multi-point inspection
> Tyre rotation (if needed)
> Wheel alignment check (and adjustment, if needed)
> Wiper blade set replacement

On the first 12,500 mile service there is also a drive unit fluids check.

Every 25,000 mile add..

> A/C desiccant bag replacement
> Battery coolant replacement
> Brake fluid replacement
> Cabin air filter replacement
Most car services are like that, they inspect a lot more than they actually change things. They’re looking for things that are starting to go astray and make adjustments. It’s not unusual for a motor unit to be replaced.

granada203028

1,483 posts

197 months

Tuesday 24th October 2017
quotequote all
My gen 1 Leaf has just passed 50K still with 11 battery bars. 1st one lost at 24K, so expecting to loose another soon.

Aircon pump has failed £1100 so looking out for a 2nd hand one. Driver's window slow in cold weather. New discs and pads for MOT else no other problems. Electric hand brake releases with a bit of a thump some times but no pattern to it.

Interested to know if any Leafs have had their batteries replaced or just cells. Or any power electronics or motor failures.

TooLateForAName

4,751 posts

184 months

Wednesday 25th October 2017
quotequote all
granada203028 said:
My gen 1 Leaf has just passed 50K still with 11 battery bars. 1st one lost at 24K, so expecting to loose another soon.

Aircon pump has failed £1100 so looking out for a 2nd hand one. Driver's window slow in cold weather. New discs and pads for MOT else no other problems. Electric hand brake releases with a bit of a thump some times but no pattern to it.

Interested to know if any Leafs have had their batteries replaced or just cells. Or any power electronics or motor failures.
The only failures that I'm aware of have been in the hotter US states. The leaf battery doesnt have active cooling and there have been failures in texas/arizona summers.

andrewrob

2,913 posts

190 months

Wednesday 25th October 2017
quotequote all
granada203028 said:
My gen 1 Leaf has just passed 50K still with 11 battery bars. 1st one lost at 24K, so expecting to loose another soon.

Aircon pump has failed £1100 so looking out for a 2nd hand one. Driver's window slow in cold weather. New discs and pads for MOT else no other problems. Electric hand brake releases with a bit of a thump some times but no pattern to it.

Interested to know if any Leafs have had their batteries replaced or just cells. Or any power electronics or motor failures.
Does seem to be a big difference between gen 1 and 2 with battery wear. My Gen2 (2013) is over 35k now and still on full battery bars.

There's a second hand pump on ebay that might do you for under £200 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2014-Nissan-Leaf-Air-Con...

ncbbmw

410 posts

184 months

Wednesday 25th October 2017
quotequote all
andrewrob said:
granada203028 said:
My gen 1 Leaf has just passed 50K still with 11 battery bars. 1st one lost at 24K, so expecting to loose another soon.

Aircon pump has failed £1100 so looking out for a 2nd hand one. Driver's window slow in cold weather. New discs and pads for MOT else no other problems. Electric hand brake releases with a bit of a thump some times but no pattern to it.

Interested to know if any Leafs have had their batteries replaced or just cells. Or any power electronics or motor failures.
Does seem to be a big difference between gen 1 and 2 with battery wear. My Gen2 (2013) is over 35k now and still on full battery bars.

There's a second hand pump on ebay that might do you for under £200 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2014-Nissan-Leaf-Air-Con...
That's a Gen2 UK build Leaf A/c compressor.

For a Gen1 Jap Built car you need 92600 1MG0A, Retail £915.45 + Vat.

Price pretty much the norm for an OE A/c Comp on a Japaneese brand vehicle.









ncbbmw

410 posts

184 months

Wednesday 25th October 2017
quotequote all
Heres Johnny said:
babatunde said:
Question should probably ask if they are more reliable than ICE cars.


Answer is "we don't have a large enough subset to determine with any real accuracy" logic would support though that they would be more reliable than the equivalent ICE car due to fewer moving parts. The service schedules would support this hypothesis.

Once there are a few million on the road for 20+ years we will have a clearer view.
Service schedules don’t support it, Tesla recommend 12 months or 12.5k miles, that’s a lot more often than my last BMW. They don’t invalidate warranty if you don’t get it serviced, but that’s not the same as saying it shows they’re more reliable.

Given time they will be, and maybe it’s just Tesla, but Tesla are constantly rolling out software fixes and require the odd service centre visit.
Only faults related to EV batteries and drive train's are relevent as failure of other parts such as a shock absorber, window switch, wiper motor etc are all old tech that that are no different to anything else.

Tesla service schedules are designed to get footfall into the dealership and generate income not because you need to rotate tyres or replace wipers at 12.5k, do Merc or BMW do that?

Nissan service interval for a Leaf is 12month or 18k.

1st Service is routine mechanical checks plus Screen wash and Pollen filter
2nd is as above plus brake Fluid.

Mine had 2 rear tyres @ 35k, 2 fronts @ 40k, (3mm left) but wanted them replaced for winter.

had new wipers last month @ 58k when they reported Front discs and pads at less than 50% worn.

No other issues with the car in the 3 years I've had it. (Gen2 Acenta)


Heres Johnny

7,229 posts

124 months

Thursday 26th October 2017
quotequote all
ncbbmw said:
Only faults related to EV batteries and drive train's are relevent as failure of other parts such as a shock absorber, window switch, wiper motor etc are all old tech that that are no different to anything else.

Tesla service schedules are designed to get footfall into the dealership and generate income not because you need to rotate tyres or replace wipers at 12.5k, do Merc or BMW do that?

Nissan service interval for a Leaf is 12month or 18k.

1st Service is routine mechanical checks plus Screen wash and Pollen filter
2nd is as above plus brake Fluid.

Mine had 2 rear tyres @ 35k, 2 fronts @ 40k, (3mm left) but wanted them replaced for winter.

had new wipers last month @ 58k when they reported Front discs and pads at less than 50% worn.

No other issues with the car in the 3 years I've had it. (Gen2 Acenta)
But that’s not really any different to an ICE. That’s my point. They may change the oil on an engine occasionally, but the rest of the service is the same. A car isn’t just an engine.

babatunde

736 posts

190 months

Thursday 26th October 2017
quotequote all
Heres Johnny said:
98elise said:
There isn't much involved in a Tesla service though

Every 12,500 miles..

> Key fob battery replacement
> Multi-point inspection
> Tyre rotation (if needed)
> Wheel alignment check (and adjustment, if needed)
> Wiper blade set replacement

On the first 12,500 mile service there is also a drive unit fluids check.

Every 25,000 mile add..

> A/C desiccant bag replacement
> Battery coolant replacement
> Brake fluid replacement
> Cabin air filter replacement
Most car services are like that, they inspect a lot more than they actually change things. They’re looking for things that are starting to go astray and make adjustments. It’s not unusual for a motor unit to be replaced.
The big difference is that the 8 warranty doesn't require this to be done, so basically IMO they are taking the piss out of customers who are happy to pay for nothing. Why people opt to pay for something that they are telling you isn't necessary baffles me.

The state of technology is such that if the car needs anything looking at or replacing it can communicate that fact to to the owner and Manufacturer.

Heres Johnny

7,229 posts

124 months

Thursday 26th October 2017
quotequote all
babatunde said:
The big difference is that the 8 warranty doesn't require this to be done, so basically IMO they are taking the piss out of customers who are happy to pay for nothing. Why people opt to pay for something that they are telling you isn't necessary baffles me.

The state of technology is such that if the car needs anything looking at or replacing it can communicate that fact to to the owner and Manufacturer.
8 year warranty isn’t on the whole car

Servicing picks up wear and tare. If you’re happy shagging tyres at a faster rate than needed because something is out or breathing through a 3 year old pollen filter, carry on..

As for the original question...

https://www.whatcar.com/news/reliability-survey/

Tesla last but one.


Edited by Heres Johnny on Thursday 26th October 20:24