Tesla and Uber Unlikely to Survive...
Discussion
gangzoom said:
p1stonhead said:
I use Hargreaves Lansdown. You need to sign a W8BEN form first though.
Any less hassel ways with other Apps etc? p1stonhead said:
liner33 said:
Nasa's announcement about not using the Falcon heavy wont have helped Space X either
SpaceX are not public.Bloomberg story:-
"Tesla Inc. is pulling out all the stops to hit its production goals, giving a limited number of workers the option to work on the crucial Model 3 line instead of other vehicles and appealing to their competitive spirit to disprove the doubters.
The Elon Musk-led carmaker will suspend Model S and Model X production Thursday and Friday because it’s ahead of target on building those this quarter, Peter Hochholdinger, vice president of production, wrote to employees ...
Two days after Hochholdinger’s email, another top executive imparted urgency on Tesla staff to reach the company’s goal to assemble 2,500 Model 3s a week by the end of the quarter. Doug Field, senior vice president of engineering, said if the team can exceed 300 Model 3s a day it would be an “incredible victory” at a time when some investors are casting doubt on the company and shorting its stock.
“I find that personally insulting, and you should too. Let’s make them regret ever betting against us,” Field wrote in the March 23 email. “You will prove a bunch of haters wrong.”"
"Tesla Inc. is pulling out all the stops to hit its production goals, giving a limited number of workers the option to work on the crucial Model 3 line instead of other vehicles and appealing to their competitive spirit to disprove the doubters.
The Elon Musk-led carmaker will suspend Model S and Model X production Thursday and Friday because it’s ahead of target on building those this quarter, Peter Hochholdinger, vice president of production, wrote to employees ...
Two days after Hochholdinger’s email, another top executive imparted urgency on Tesla staff to reach the company’s goal to assemble 2,500 Model 3s a week by the end of the quarter. Doug Field, senior vice president of engineering, said if the team can exceed 300 Model 3s a day it would be an “incredible victory” at a time when some investors are casting doubt on the company and shorting its stock.
“I find that personally insulting, and you should too. Let’s make them regret ever betting against us,” Field wrote in the March 23 email. “You will prove a bunch of haters wrong.”"
AstonZagato said:
Bloomberg story:-
"Tesla Inc. is pulling out all the stops to hit its production goals, giving a limited number of workers the option to work on the crucial Model 3 line instead of other vehicles and appealing to their competitive spirit to disprove the doubters.
The Elon Musk-led carmaker will suspend Model S and Model X production Thursday and Friday because it’s ahead of target on building those this quarter, Peter Hochholdinger, vice president of production, wrote to employees ...
Two days after Hochholdinger’s email, another top executive imparted urgency on Tesla staff to reach the company’s goal to assemble 2,500 Model 3s a week by the end of the quarter. Doug Field, senior vice president of engineering, said if the team can exceed 300 Model 3s a day it would be an “incredible victory” at a time when some investors are casting doubt on the company and shorting its stock.
“I find that personally insulting, and you should too. Let’s make them regret ever betting against us,” Field wrote in the March 23 email. “You will prove a bunch of haters wrong.”"
A single day of a 60% achievement of a thrice reduced forecast, that would only be achieved by the desperate measure of stopping production of other models, would it seems, be deemed an " incredible victory". "Tesla Inc. is pulling out all the stops to hit its production goals, giving a limited number of workers the option to work on the crucial Model 3 line instead of other vehicles and appealing to their competitive spirit to disprove the doubters.
The Elon Musk-led carmaker will suspend Model S and Model X production Thursday and Friday because it’s ahead of target on building those this quarter, Peter Hochholdinger, vice president of production, wrote to employees ...
Two days after Hochholdinger’s email, another top executive imparted urgency on Tesla staff to reach the company’s goal to assemble 2,500 Model 3s a week by the end of the quarter. Doug Field, senior vice president of engineering, said if the team can exceed 300 Model 3s a day it would be an “incredible victory” at a time when some investors are casting doubt on the company and shorting its stock.
“I find that personally insulting, and you should too. Let’s make them regret ever betting against us,” Field wrote in the March 23 email. “You will prove a bunch of haters wrong.”"
I suppose they could always sack another 750 engineers/ workers, as they did last year, to encourage the others that are left.
Cheers,
Tony
FT are reporting that with the last set of bonds nosediving, Tesla may struggle to raise more cash that way. So one likely option is to mortgage their GigaFactory if they do get backed into a corner.
Musk and fellow board members are also being sued personally in the USA by shareholders of Tesla in multiple lawsuits, for 'breaching their fiduciary duty' when they decided to buy Solarcity. Musk (22% owner of Solarcity at the time) tried to get the lawsuits dismissed this week by claiming he was not himself directly in control of Tesla
however the judge, unsuprisingly, didn't buy it, and so the cases are going ahead.
Musk and fellow board members are also being sued personally in the USA by shareholders of Tesla in multiple lawsuits, for 'breaching their fiduciary duty' when they decided to buy Solarcity. Musk (22% owner of Solarcity at the time) tried to get the lawsuits dismissed this week by claiming he was not himself directly in control of Tesla
however the judge, unsuprisingly, didn't buy it, and so the cases are going ahead.The latest “hitler’ video remake depicts him finding out his money has been invested in Tesla bonds
https://twitter.com/rampcapitalllc/status/97910545...
https://twitter.com/rampcapitalllc/status/97910545...
I think the issue is that he's trying to innovate on too many things at one time.
Tesla have made huge investments in robots to automate things that even the industry leaders don't automate. There is an old adage that you first work out your process and then automate but Tesla have been really ambitious and tried to jump this stage. It's not completely misfounded - they acquired a German firm well known for their expertise in this area a few years ago. But it was always a high-risk strategy.
I've never fully understood why they didn't just outsource production to one of the contract specialists who are good at this. You could claim that Apple would have been a good example of this way of working from the tech. industry. I suppose they thought they could leapfrog the contract producers in manufacturing efficiency.
For rockets the scale will never be there to need to automate production to such a degree.
I think the question will be whether they sort manufacturing before the market stops wanting to fund their constant need for cash. My guess is that there are more than a few firms waiting in the wings for the cash crunch to come before acquiring them. My guess is that Tim Cook & Apple will be one.
I do not expect Tesla to die.
Tesla have made huge investments in robots to automate things that even the industry leaders don't automate. There is an old adage that you first work out your process and then automate but Tesla have been really ambitious and tried to jump this stage. It's not completely misfounded - they acquired a German firm well known for their expertise in this area a few years ago. But it was always a high-risk strategy.
I've never fully understood why they didn't just outsource production to one of the contract specialists who are good at this. You could claim that Apple would have been a good example of this way of working from the tech. industry. I suppose they thought they could leapfrog the contract producers in manufacturing efficiency.
For rockets the scale will never be there to need to automate production to such a degree.
I think the question will be whether they sort manufacturing before the market stops wanting to fund their constant need for cash. My guess is that there are more than a few firms waiting in the wings for the cash crunch to come before acquiring them. My guess is that Tim Cook & Apple will be one.
I do not expect Tesla to die.
chandrew said:
I think the issue is that he's trying to innovate on too many things at one time.
Tesla have made huge investments in robots to automate things that even the industry leaders don't automate. There is an old adage that you first work out your process and then automate but Tesla have been really ambitious and tried to jump this stage. It's not completely misfounded - they acquired a German firm well known for their expertise in this area a few years ago. But it was always a high-risk strategy.
I've never fully understood why they didn't just outsource production to one of the contract specialists who are good at this. You could claim that Apple would have been a good example of this way of working from the tech. industry. I suppose they thought they could leapfrog the contract producers in manufacturing efficiency.
For rockets the scale will never be there to need to automate production to such a degree.
I think the question will be whether they sort manufacturing before the market stops wanting to fund their constant need for cash. My guess is that there are more than a few firms waiting in the wings for the cash crunch to come before acquiring them. My guess is that Tim Cook & Apple will be one.
I do not expect Tesla to die.
I think your final sentence is correct. As long as a lot of debt is shed it would be a bargain for someone. Tesla have made huge investments in robots to automate things that even the industry leaders don't automate. There is an old adage that you first work out your process and then automate but Tesla have been really ambitious and tried to jump this stage. It's not completely misfounded - they acquired a German firm well known for their expertise in this area a few years ago. But it was always a high-risk strategy.
I've never fully understood why they didn't just outsource production to one of the contract specialists who are good at this. You could claim that Apple would have been a good example of this way of working from the tech. industry. I suppose they thought they could leapfrog the contract producers in manufacturing efficiency.
For rockets the scale will never be there to need to automate production to such a degree.
I think the question will be whether they sort manufacturing before the market stops wanting to fund their constant need for cash. My guess is that there are more than a few firms waiting in the wings for the cash crunch to come before acquiring them. My guess is that Tim Cook & Apple will be one.
I do not expect Tesla to die.
chandrew said:
I think the issue is that he's trying to innovate on too many things at one time.
Tesla have made huge investments in robots to automate things that even the industry leaders don't automate. There is an old adage that you first work out your process and then automate but Tesla have been really ambitious and tried to jump this stage. It's not completely misfounded - they acquired a German firm well known for their expertise in this area a few years ago. But it was always a high-risk strategy.
I've never fully understood why they didn't just outsource production to one of the contract specialists who are good at this. You could claim that Apple would have been a good example of this way of working from the tech. industry. I suppose they thought they could leapfrog the contract producers in manufacturing efficiency.
For rockets the scale will never be there to need to automate production to such a degree.
I think the question will be whether they sort manufacturing before the market stops wanting to fund their constant need for cash. My guess is that there are more than a few firms waiting in the wings for the cash crunch to come before acquiring them. My guess is that Tim Cook & Apple will be one.
I do not expect Tesla to die.
That makes sense. Car production should be the easy but, but if he's not following established methods then there are going to be problems.Tesla have made huge investments in robots to automate things that even the industry leaders don't automate. There is an old adage that you first work out your process and then automate but Tesla have been really ambitious and tried to jump this stage. It's not completely misfounded - they acquired a German firm well known for their expertise in this area a few years ago. But it was always a high-risk strategy.
I've never fully understood why they didn't just outsource production to one of the contract specialists who are good at this. You could claim that Apple would have been a good example of this way of working from the tech. industry. I suppose they thought they could leapfrog the contract producers in manufacturing efficiency.
For rockets the scale will never be there to need to automate production to such a degree.
I think the question will be whether they sort manufacturing before the market stops wanting to fund their constant need for cash. My guess is that there are more than a few firms waiting in the wings for the cash crunch to come before acquiring them. My guess is that Tim Cook & Apple will be one.
I do not expect Tesla to die.
When it comes to increasing production of the Mod 3 I cant help but think of the end of the movie "Gung Ho" 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Om3C1EpHLGs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Om3C1EpHLGs
fesuvious said:
Might I share an opinion,
I could by a Tesla. I love the ethos, the humour, the ability. I love the over the air updates. I think they look great. I think the asking price is fair.
For two years I have been looking at the EV market with casual interest (which with me normally ends with spend the wife gets angsty about!).
My take on Tesla though is that if I buy a brand new product I want to know the firm will absolutely be around to back it up for the next five years.
The way I see it Tesla need widespread loyalty, network, support and a great large fanbase before BMW, JLR, Mercedes, Ford, and others get EV's nailed, reliable, marketable and 'trusted' by the public.
It looks to me like Tesla won't do it.
They are no longer really 'niche' . And I suspect shortly they won't be able to have the cockyness of having absolutely the best product in the class.
If any firm was hugely loss making, and possibly about to face an onslaught of competition, would you invest?
For me, this is why whilst I fancy a Tesla, and also for that matter an i8 I just will not buy in just yet to the product.
There's too much disruption on the cards, and with the main manufacturers catching up, who knows which firms will do well, and which will not.
I know exactly where you are coming from having been exactly there, 3 years ago. I bottled it then and bought my third consecutive Lexus. Kept following Tesla like a hawk, became a little more relaxed about the cars reliability and Tesla’s financial position. Then came Brexit and the exchange rate fell off a cliff. I decided if I didn’t take the plunge then the pricing might get out of what I could justify, so I jumped. I could by a Tesla. I love the ethos, the humour, the ability. I love the over the air updates. I think they look great. I think the asking price is fair.
For two years I have been looking at the EV market with casual interest (which with me normally ends with spend the wife gets angsty about!).
My take on Tesla though is that if I buy a brand new product I want to know the firm will absolutely be around to back it up for the next five years.
The way I see it Tesla need widespread loyalty, network, support and a great large fanbase before BMW, JLR, Mercedes, Ford, and others get EV's nailed, reliable, marketable and 'trusted' by the public.
It looks to me like Tesla won't do it.
They are no longer really 'niche' . And I suspect shortly they won't be able to have the cockyness of having absolutely the best product in the class.
If any firm was hugely loss making, and possibly about to face an onslaught of competition, would you invest?
For me, this is why whilst I fancy a Tesla, and also for that matter an i8 I just will not buy in just yet to the product.
There's too much disruption on the cards, and with the main manufacturers catching up, who knows which firms will do well, and which will not.
I’m now just over a year into ownership and have had the best year of ownership of a car ever, and that spans 35 years. I’ve done 50% more miles than usual, had zero reliability issues and there is currently not another car I’d rather have - except maybe a P100D!
Everything about the car is a breath of fresh air, and just looking at other cars with all those buttons, knobs and dials makes me dizzy. The drive is superlative and even quicker thanks to the free performance updgrade they did a few months ago. 0-60 down from 5.2 to 4.2, just a tweak of the software sir, won’t keep you long. Anyone else had that?
The Supercharger network continues to expand and is a massive USP. Until either the public charging network is radically improved or other manufacturers get serious with developing one Tesla will remain the only EV capable up long distance travel without serious time compromises. Fair play to Jag for getting something to market but ask them where you can charge one quickly and reliably. The answer is, “nothing to do with us”.
The OTA updates are great, and often bring bugs with them that need ironing out. Their staff are enthusiastic but let down by seemingly non existent customer services systems and processes. Parts can be a problem if you are unlucky enough to need them as they are shipped from the US. ‘Tesla time’ means at some point in the future and Musk is a master of hype, but delivers. Mostly. Eventually.
Will they survive? I think so, and if not someone will snap them up - if only for the battery tech and Supercharger network.
Would I buy cash? No, PCP to protect against depreciation and treat the interest as an insurance premium to be able to hand it back at the end of the term.
As for the competition, I look forward to it but at the moment there isn’t any, and what’s on the horizon is only that. In the meantime Tesla continue to improve and learn from their mistakes.
Just my experience, YMMV.
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