Anyone been for a test drive in a Jaguar i-Pace yet?

Anyone been for a test drive in a Jaguar i-Pace yet?

Author
Discussion

RacerMike

4,214 posts

212 months

Monday 3rd September 2018
quotequote all
A fairly honest and interesting piece of real car journalism about the IPace on Sniff Petrol by Richard Porter.

https://sniffpetrol.com/2018/08/31/a-week-with-a-j...

essayer

9,087 posts

195 months

Thursday 6th September 2018
quotequote all
A comment in the leasing thread got me thinking - the early tests are settling around 200 miles for 90kWh - that’s not great is it? 2.2 miles per kWh?
Or is this just journos booting it down the motorway to determine ‘range’ ?

EddieSteadyGo

12,050 posts

204 months

Thursday 6th September 2018
quotequote all
essayer said:
A comment in the leasing thread got me thinking - the early tests are settling around 200 miles for 90kWh - that’s not great is it? 2.2 miles per kWh?
Or is this just journos booting it down the motorway to determine ‘range’ ?
It isn't great. I suspect the actual range is a little higher than 200 miles when driven reasonably, but it seems the car is noticeably less efficient than Tesla.

I commented on the same point a bit earlier in this thread. Personally I think this is a big issue and will influence many people's decision whether to purchase one or not. Others including RacerMike think it won't matter to most people and is nothing to be concerned about.

RacerMike

4,214 posts

212 months

Thursday 6th September 2018
quotequote all
essayer said:
A comment in the leasing thread got me thinking - the early tests are settling around 200 miles for 90kWh - that’s not great is it? 2.2 miles per kWh?
Similar to the new Merc EQC apparently, but with another 10kWh battery capacity! That Merc is going to really struggle to do much more than 150 miles.

essayer

9,087 posts

195 months

Thursday 6th September 2018
quotequote all
Why is the range so bad given Leaf/ZOE etc easily do 4mpkwh?

The Jag’s being tested in some pretty decent weather. In winter are we going to be mid 100s range?

modeller

445 posts

167 months

Thursday 6th September 2018
quotequote all
There's a 90D owner who's posted on https://www.facebook.com/groups/JaguariPaceUK a writeup of what seems to be a vehicle with the production software (including CarPlay). He's intimating 260miles range ..

RacerMike

4,214 posts

212 months

Thursday 6th September 2018
quotequote all
essayer said:
Why is the range so bad given Leaf/ZOE etc easily do 4mpkwh?

The Jag’s being tested in some pretty decent weather. In winter are we going to be mid 100s range?
Well.....that's a bit like asking why an ICE hatchback can do 50mpg, but an SUV can only do 30mpg with the same engine. Weight, aero and driveline losses basically.

essayer

9,087 posts

195 months

Thursday 6th September 2018
quotequote all
RacerMike said:
Well.....that's a bit like asking why an ICE hatchback can do 50mpg, but an SUV can only do 30mpg with the same engine. Weight, aero and driveline losses basically.
An AWD 90D model X can do nearly 4mpkwh on official figures, and this has the same drivetrain arrangement, same weight and probably similar aeros

I’d be surprised if customer cars do less than 3.5mpkwh once driven normally - that should put the range at around 300 miles - if the car can really only do 200 (or less in winter) that’s not going to go down well with public perception

Perhaps that’s why Jag are knocking them out on cheap leases, to get improved consumption figures reported

RacerMike

4,214 posts

212 months

Thursday 6th September 2018
quotequote all
essayer said:
RacerMike said:
Well.....that's a bit like asking why an ICE hatchback can do 50mpg, but an SUV can only do 30mpg with the same engine. Weight, aero and driveline losses basically.
An AWD 90D model X can do nearly 4mpkwh on official figures, and this has the same drivetrain arrangement, same weight and probably similar aeros

I’d be surprised if customer cars do less than 3.5mpkwh once driven normally - that should put the range at around 300 miles - if the car can really only do 200 (or less in winter) that’s not going to go down well with public perception

Perhaps that’s why Jag are knocking them out on cheap leases, to get improved consumption figures reported
But an I Pace can do 3.5mpkwh on official figures. So that compares fairly reasonably to the official 4mpkwh of the Tesla. I think elsewhere people have mentioned that the I Pace aero isn't as good as a Model X, so that would probably make up for the 0.5 difference. It's pretty simple really......the I Pace and X are different cars, much as an F Pace and a Porsche Macan are. You wouldn't expect them to have the same mpg, so to me at least, it's not much of a surprise that a car with worse aero consumes more energy. They key thing here is whether that's actually an issue for most owners. There are multiple reports of people getting more than 220miles without much effort out of the I Pace, so this seems pretty reasonable to me!

EddieSteadyGo

12,050 posts

204 months

Thursday 6th September 2018
quotequote all
Maybe time for me to a do a volte-face.....

I lease a Leaf as our local runaround car. Car goes back to Nissan end of March next year. So I'm starting to think about alternatives.

Getting a new 40 kwh Leaf is an option, but the lease costs are not yet competitive. So my option I think would be buy an ex-demo car for around £25k. Or I was thinking of looking to try and find a 6 month old i3s maybe for £27k.

But over on the leasing thread, they have this deal on the i-pace. It is only an 18 month lease but that suits me fine. Mileage is also too low, so I've asked for a quote with a higher allowance.

https://www.fleetprices.co.uk/personal-lease-cars/...

So it's only the base model, and I stand by what I was saying previously that I don't think it is a quite a good enough range as a main family car. But at this price, the cost would probably be about same amount of depreciation as the i3s, for a car which has a much bigger battery and much higher performance.

It sounds strange to replace a Leaf with an I-Pace, but the deal sounds quite good - views?

anonymous-user

55 months

Thursday 6th September 2018
quotequote all
It's worth noting that pretty much all the chassis settings (except ride height) that improve handling and grip are a detriment to losses!

Wide tyres, aggressive camber and toe, stiff tyre carcasses all increase losses. In order to make an iPace "more sporty" than a Tesla they have effectively also made it more lossy!

EddieSteadyGo

12,050 posts

204 months

Monday 10th September 2018
quotequote all
Just to update the thread on the lease deal mentioned earlier, I've just signed my order form. The car is scheduled for delivery by Feb/March next year.

If you changed anything in terms of the base mileage or term length it pushed the price up quite significantly, so I've stuck with the original deal (9+17 for £283.06 inc VAT).

Mileage is 5,000 per annum with excess mileage at 29.48 pence per mile. Strangely, paying the excess mileage charge is cheaper than increasing the mileage allowance.

The averaged monthly cost is around £408 / month. I'm expecting to pay around £465 / month based on the amount I plan to use the car.

Hopefully by the time it goes back towards the end of 2020 they should be lots of alternative electric cars to choose from!

RacerMike

4,214 posts

212 months

Monday 10th September 2018
quotequote all
EddieSteadyGo said:
Just to update the thread on the lease deal mentioned earlier, I've just signed my order form. The car is scheduled for delivery by Feb/March next year.

If you changed anything in terms of the base mileage or term length it pushed the price up quite significantly, so I've stuck with the original deal (9+17 for £283.06 inc VAT).

Mileage is 5,000 per annum with excess mileage at 29.48 pence per mile. Strangely, paying the excess mileage charge is cheaper than increasing the mileage allowance.

The averaged monthly cost is around £408 / month. I'm expecting to pay around £465 / month based on the amount I plan to use the car.

Hopefully by the time it goes back towards the end of 2020 they should be lots of alternative electric cars to choose from!
Nice! I worked out earlier that with my current yearly mileage, if I switched to electric and charged between 2300 and 0600, I'd save over £150 a month in fuel cost, so that £465/month is a mega deal really when you consider it's a £65k car! You're effectively paying just over £300 a month for a brand new I-Pace

EddieSteadyGo

12,050 posts

204 months

Monday 10th September 2018
quotequote all
RacerMike said:
Nice! I worked out earlier that with my current yearly mileage, if I switched to electric and charged between 2300 and 0600, I'd save over £150 a month in fuel cost, so that £465/month is a mega deal really when you consider it's a £65k car! You're effectively paying just over £300 a month for a brand new I-Pace
I agree - TBH I do think it is a good deal. And it will be nice to have something again which has more sprightly performance!

RacerMike

4,214 posts

212 months

Monday 10th September 2018
quotequote all
EddieSteadyGo said:
I agree - TBH I do think it is a good deal. And it will be nice to have something again which has more sprightly performance!
Or brutal :P There's very little out there that can stay with an I-Pace to 60mph. On most A Roads, I genuinely think even a 911 would struggle against it, purely due to the traction and punch out of the corners. It's genuinely quite shocking at times!

gangzoom

6,316 posts

216 months

Monday 10th September 2018
quotequote all
EddieSteadyGo said:
Mileage is 5,000 per annum with excess mileage at 29.48 pence per mile. Strangely, paying the excess mileage charge is cheaper than increasing the mileage allowance.
Thats very cheap for a £60k ish car, not quite crazy £200/month Nissan Leaf cheap but not far off, and anyone in market for a longish range EV need to run the numbers as I suspect financially it makes alot of sense!!

Even based on doing 14k a year which is what am doing in the Tesla thats 'only' £625/month.

I suspect first 18 month deprecation will be easily 50% on top of that. Jaguar must be 'supporting' that deal in some way or other, much like how RCI backed the Leaf deals.

Edited by gangzoom on Monday 10th September 17:46

EddieSteadyGo

12,050 posts

204 months

Monday 10th September 2018
quotequote all
gangzoom said:
Thats very cheap for a £60k ish car, not quite crazy £200/month Nissan Leaf cheap but far off, and anyone in market for a longish range EV need to run the numbers as I suspect financially it makes alot of sense!!

Even based on doing 14k a year which is what am doing in the Tesla thats 'only' £625/month.

I suspect first 18 month deprecation will be easily 50% on top of that. Jaguar must be 'supporting' that deal in some way or other, much like how RCI backed the Leaf deals.
Yep - I agree. There is no way when I hand the car back at 18 months old it is going to be worth circa £57k. I can only presume they needed to fill up some build slots due to the build contract they have with Magna.


gangzoom

6,316 posts

216 months

Monday 10th September 2018
quotequote all
EddieSteadyGo said:
Yep - I agree. There is no way when I hand the car back at 18 months old it is going to be worth circa £57k. I can only presume they needed to fill up some build slots due to the build contract they have with Magna.
Just had a look on the specs of the 'S', manual mirrors and manual seats?? On a £60k car??

I persume any added options pushes the price up? I suppose if you know your handing the car back after 18 months you can live that, at least 18inch wheels should be almost impossible to kerb smile

EddieSteadyGo

12,050 posts

204 months

Monday 10th September 2018
quotequote all
gangzoom said:
Just had a look on the specs of the 'S', manual mirrors and manual seats?? On a £60k car??

I persume any added options pushes the price up? I suppose if you know your handing the car back after 18 months you can live that, at least 18inch wheels should be almost impossible to kerb smile
True - and I checked and it was confirmed that none of the options according to Jaguar had any "residual" value in terms of the lease. So the full cost had to be divided into 18 months. So I'm going to have to put up with the base spec. Having said that, I still get the 90 kwh battery and the near 700Nm of torque smile

RacerMike

4,214 posts

212 months

Monday 10th September 2018
quotequote all
gangzoom said:
Just had a look on the specs of the 'S', manual mirrors and manual seats?? On a £60k car??

I persume any added options pushes the price up? I suppose if you know your handing the car back after 18 months you can live that, at least 18inch wheels should be almost impossible to kerb smile
I can assure you it most certainly doesn’t have manual mirrors!