Porsche Taycan
Discussion
The reason why the Taycan has a lower range is that they have gone for a chemistry composition that optimises energy generation because Porsche thinks it’s more important to be able to drive the car hard repeatedly and reliably.
I’m not aware of any actual or potential Taycan buyer who cares all that much about the range. If this is what excites you guys so much about a car, why aren’t you talking about Konas and the like and questioning the value of Teslas in comparison?
I’m not aware of any actual or potential Taycan buyer who cares all that much about the range. If this is what excites you guys so much about a car, why aren’t you talking about Konas and the like and questioning the value of Teslas in comparison?
DMZ said:
The reason why the Taycan has a lower range is that they have gone for a chemistry composition that optimises energy generation because Porsche thinks it’s more important to be able to drive the car hard repeatedly and reliably.
I’m not aware of any actual or potential Taycan buyer who cares all that much about the range. If this is what excites you guys so much about a car, why aren’t you talking about Konas and the like and questioning the value of Teslas in comparison?
Tesla supporters do seem to spend a large amount of effort justifying their preference and seem very sensitive to criticism. The likelihood is that Porsche will sell plenty of Taycans to people who can afford them and unlike Tesla, actually make a profit while doing so. Penty of people will likewise continue to buy Tesla’s because they are cheaper. Personally I won’t buy either because I don’t want to drive a milk float however fast it might be.I’m not aware of any actual or potential Taycan buyer who cares all that much about the range. If this is what excites you guys so much about a car, why aren’t you talking about Konas and the like and questioning the value of Teslas in comparison?
In what way is a Taycan alike to a milk float? My milk is delivered by a diesel truck, I know because it wakes me up at 4am every Tuesday.
Saying it's like a milk float would be similar me refusing to drive a Carrera GT because it's like a moped; they share the same fuel.
Saying it's like a milk float would be similar me refusing to drive a Carrera GT because it's like a moped; they share the same fuel.
Edited by Witchfinder on Thursday 12th December 14:03
DMZ said:
I’m not aware of any actual or potential Taycan buyer who cares all that much about the range. If this is what excites you guys so much about a car, why aren’t you talking about Konas and the like and questioning the value of Teslas in comparison?
^You haven't owned an EV have you?Real life range of around 150 miles without going into the last 10% of battery isn't too bad in the UK, as that means a weekend outing to some where 60-70 miles away wouldn't leave you with range anxiety.
Drop that down to 100-120 miles and all of a sudden even a 50 mile round trip is pushing things, add in if you want to actually use the performance of something like a Taycan range and efficiency has a massive impact on the usability of the car.
If your treating it purely as a town car and never drive it more than the 100 miles from the house range probably is fine, but trying to do long runs in a 200 mile EPA rated car with a 90kWh pack will be a major pain.
Charging times depends on both charger speed and miles achieved per kWh, on a 50KW charger (most common) that 90kWh pack is going to take 2hr to gain 200 miles if it hits EPA ratings. Find a 350KW charger and things will be fine, but Ionity pricing may end up at €1.2/kWh, so £100 to go 200 miles, at which point you have wonder why not just buy a Panamera??
I actually agree on efficiency, Hyundai/Kia are better than Tesla. But 200 EPA miles from a 90kWh+ pack is a new low in the EV world!
gangzoom said:
DMZ said:
I’m not aware of any actual or potential Taycan buyer who cares all that much about the range. If this is what excites you guys so much about a car, why aren’t you talking about Konas and the like and questioning the value of Teslas in comparison?
^You haven't owned an EV have you?Real life range of around 150 miles without going into the last 10% of battery isn't too bad in the UK, as that means a weekend outing to some where 60-70 miles away wouldn't leave you with range anxiety.
Drop that down to 100-120 miles and all of a sudden even a 50 mile round trip is pushing things, add in if you want to actually use the performance of something like a Taycan range and efficiency has a massive impact on the usability of the car.
If your treating it purely as a town car and never drive it more than the 100 miles from the house range probably is fine, but trying to do long runs in a 200 mile EPA rated car with a 90kWh pack will be a major pain.
Charging times depends on both charger speed and miles achieved per kWh, on a 50KW charger (most common) that 90kWh pack is going to take 2hr to gain 200 miles if it hits EPA ratings. Find a 350KW charger and things will be fine, but Ionity pricing may end up at €1.2/kWh, so £100 to go 200 miles, at which point you have wonder why not just buy a Panamera??
I actually agree on efficiency, Hyundai/Kia are better than Tesla. But 200 EPA miles from a 90kWh+ pack is a new low in the EV world!
He’s also suggesting that many people think that way; if they don’t and range is all important, then why buy a M3 performance and brag about 2s 0-60 times when that, if it has any meaning at all, is range damaging.
I agree with him. I think Taycan owners will use them as willy wavers and won’t give a damn about the range.
I think M3P owners are in between. They willy wave the 0-60 times but in truth, most of the time, will be pussyfooting along, maximising range.
The more mature, sensible folk will buy the Korean cars. Like my Mrs.
I shall now retire and put on my hard hat..........
REALIST123 said:
I agree with him. I think Taycan owners will use them as willy wavers and won’t give a damn about the range.
But how can you not worry about range if it means just a trip as simple as Leicester to Birmingham and back may leave you stranded on the side of the M69??Especially more so if you're going to use all the performance on the M69. The whole 'issue' with EVs you cannot just pop into a Shell garage and fill up V power after a run.
How anyone can say range doesn't matter on a performance EV with less than 200 miles EPA is beyond me. The only people you will be showing the car to if your careful is the recovery truck driver!
SWoll said:
gangzoom said:
I was actually playing the configurator this afternoon, as the 4S pricing isn't mad especially compared to still hight Model S pricing.
Never understood the Model S comparisons as space wise the Taycan is comparable to a Model 3 and if you go through the options list to spec similar to the M3P it's £100k+ for the 4S (or twice the price) whilst slower, considerably worse on range and no dedicated charging network.Edited by gangzoom on Wednesday 11th December 20:40
I love Porsche's cars but that does seem to prove what a bargain the M3P is TBH. You could have one + a 718 Cayman T for the weekends for the same price as the Taycan 4S with a few options (panoramic roof, larger battery, driving assists, vegan leather etc.)
simonwhite2000 said:
Yet still I would never even consider a Tesla. But I would fancy one of these as a daily without a shadow of a doubt.
Which fine, but it doesn't change the fact a £80k+ EV with a 90kWh should offer more than just 200 EPA rated miles.The fact Porsche has made up an 'independent' company/website to make up range numbers shows even Porsche realise they have buggered something up some where.
But in true VAG company ethos, rather than fix the issue, covering up the issue with lies is the preferred option.
DMZ said:
The reason why the Taycan has a lower range is that they have gone for a chemistry composition that optimises energy generation because Porsche thinks it’s more important to be able to drive the car hard repeatedly and reliably.
I’m not aware of any actual or potential Taycan buyer who cares all that much about the range. If this is what excites you guys so much about a car, why aren’t you talking about Konas and the like and questioning the value of Teslas in comparison?
That makes no sense at all a kwh is a kwh. I’m not aware of any actual or potential Taycan buyer who cares all that much about the range. If this is what excites you guys so much about a car, why aren’t you talking about Konas and the like and questioning the value of Teslas in comparison?
jjwilde said:
I've just read that rating is for the slow version, the 'turbo' version is expected to have an even worse rating! I can't get my head around how it's so bad. The Tesla is the faster and bigger car...
Its for the taycan turbo rather than the turbo S which will get slightly lower range rating. There's also cheaper rwd versions with smaller batteries afik
Sambucket said:
Maybe in Late 2020 onwards, when the competition ‘starts trying’, Tesla will start getting some credit for innovative ev engineering.
Doesn’t seem to be much appetite for the idea in 2019.
I heard Porsche had almost completed the PPE platform when they got a model 3 and tore it apart, they are redesigning it now...Doesn’t seem to be much appetite for the idea in 2019.
Sambucket said:
Maybe in Late 2020 onwards, when the competition ‘starts trying’, Tesla will start getting some credit for innovative ev engineering.
Doesn’t seem to be much appetite for the idea in 2019.
Tesla has spent how many billions? And been at it, what, 18 years now?Doesn’t seem to be much appetite for the idea in 2019.
Do you feel they have made EV innovations to justify 18 years of work, and many, many billions spent??
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