Do BEV's actually save you money currently?
Discussion
They have some good advantages, but for just paying up a lump sum, or on Pcp , does the low fuel cost save anything?
Looking at the new E up certainly not, over the petrol equivalent. Thousands more
Kia E Niro... no ... thousands more.
Even the Golf R seems to be cheaper than the cheapest Model 3 on PCP per month for 8000 miles per year including the amount saved on petrol.
EV cars currently are not a cheap car, they are a car for a niche that serves that niche very well.
I want to go EV but being a northerner at the moment calculator says no.
Looking at the new E up certainly not, over the petrol equivalent. Thousands more
Kia E Niro... no ... thousands more.
Even the Golf R seems to be cheaper than the cheapest Model 3 on PCP per month for 8000 miles per year including the amount saved on petrol.
EV cars currently are not a cheap car, they are a car for a niche that serves that niche very well.
I want to go EV but being a northerner at the moment calculator says no.
I think you need to look at the whole cost of running both - depreciation, fuel, road tax, luxury car tax, servicing costs, maintenance, charge point installation, electricity costs, financing costs.
The Model 3 has pretty high predicted residuals (58% according to Autocar, higher according to other sources) over 3 years and 36k miles, so that may well off set the higher up front cost vs a ICE equivalent.
The value you place on any car ICE vs EV will of course will be individual to you.
The Model 3 has pretty high predicted residuals (58% according to Autocar, higher according to other sources) over 3 years and 36k miles, so that may well off set the higher up front cost vs a ICE equivalent.
The value you place on any car ICE vs EV will of course will be individual to you.
At the bottom end of the new EV market I'd tend to agree. The price hike to an EV model is massive (Corsa-E or MG ZSE are perfect examples) and unless you plan on running the car for a long period won't pay back.
The Model 3 is a different story IMHO. You can't compare with a Golf as it's rival for the 3 Series/A4/C-Class at which point spec for spec the price remains very similar for the SR+ and LR to comparable models.
Model 3 Performance is £52k (was £49k yesterday) . It's considerably quicker and better equipped as standard than an RS4 but costs over £10k less. Add to that the saving in fuel and looks fair to me?
The Model 3 is a different story IMHO. You can't compare with a Golf as it's rival for the 3 Series/A4/C-Class at which point spec for spec the price remains very similar for the SR+ and LR to comparable models.
Model 3 Performance is £52k (was £49k yesterday) . It's considerably quicker and better equipped as standard than an RS4 but costs over £10k less. Add to that the saving in fuel and looks fair to me?
superpp said:
depends what you buy and if you consider the 2nd hand market.
my leaf was £7995 with 12800 miles, bought this year.
does a 34 commute daily at a cost of 34p.
This. my leaf was £7995 with 12800 miles, bought this year.
does a 34 commute daily at a cost of 34p.
I bought a 2 year old Leaf with 8k miles on the clock 2 years ago at a £10k screen price, on a PCP at £150 a month including servicing (deposit was £500). I get my electricity for free from work. I used to spend £300 a month on diesel in an unreliable s
t tip of an old car. I now have 100% reliability in to the bargain.Yes, it saves me a lot of money.
SWoll said:
At the bottom end of the new EV market I'd tend to agree. The price hike to an EV model is massive (Corsa-E or MG ZSE are perfect examples) and unless you plan on running the car for a long period won't pay back.
The Model 3 is a different story IMHO. You can't compare with a Golf as it's rival for the 3 Series/A4/C-Class at which point spec for spec the price remains very similar for the SR+ and LR to comparable models.
Model 3 Performance is £52k (was £49k yesterday) . It's considerably quicker and better equipped as standard than an RS4 but costs over £10k less. Add to that the saving in fuel and looks fair to me?
It depends where you place the Model 3 in the 'luxury category'. It's been said by a fair few sources that the build quality falls well short of a mid range German/Japanese executive saloon, but as you point out, the performance places it quite high up as figures are comparable to higher end sports models.The Model 3 is a different story IMHO. You can't compare with a Golf as it's rival for the 3 Series/A4/C-Class at which point spec for spec the price remains very similar for the SR+ and LR to comparable models.
Model 3 Performance is £52k (was £49k yesterday) . It's considerably quicker and better equipped as standard than an RS4 but costs over £10k less. Add to that the saving in fuel and looks fair to me?
coetzeeh said:
I see random posts about EV's being quicker - and often compared to RS4, C63, M3 and so on.
The new Electric Porsche's time around the N'ring is 10 seconds slower than the Alfa QF.
They are often very quick off the line, the nature of electric motors & their immediate torque lends itself to that, which is why it is often used as a party trick for even vehicles like the Tesla Lorry, doing mad dashes to 60, or along a 1/4 mile. When rolling starts & more real world scenarios are given where the ICE is allowed to essentially stay fully in its powerband throughout the test different results are often given, and as you point out, EVs tend to fall far behind on track and particularly in technical handling, they are able to carry their weight marginally lower than an ICE, but tend to carry far more of it as one of the inheirant flaws of battery tech. The new Electric Porsche's time around the N'ring is 10 seconds slower than the Alfa QF.
Personally, what I am looking forward to in EV space is the proliferation of hydrogen, it is already happening outside of Europe & it will leak into here eventually, the tech has the potential to be far lighter whilst being just as potent to launch as a BEV, some of the heavy haulage HEV concepts are coming in at weights comparable to their diesel equivalents which really is something (considering the likes of the Tesla semi being theorised to be at least 2 to 3 times heavier).
It's an impossible to question to answer because they have such a different cost profile to ICE cars. If you're the sort of person who buys a brand new car every three years, I don't think they make sense yet because the initial purchase price is so high. However if you buy cars intending to run them into the ground over 10-15 years and 100k+ miles, I think they're at the point where they will probably work out cheaper than ICE powered vehicles.
It's hard to make a comparison for people who buy used because the used EV market is so small and so new and the cars are advancing so quickly.
It's hard to make a comparison for people who buy used because the used EV market is so small and so new and the cars are advancing so quickly.
Like anything in the car world, the newer or flasher the car you buy, the more it'll cost you!
I bought a base spec, i3 second hand 3 years ago. No one wanted one back then, so my 6 month old ex main dealer demo car with just 347 miles on the clock cost me, £16,200. cheap!!
Fast forward 3 years and it's worth, as far as i can tell, exactly what i paid for it. It's had one service, and is due a set of tyres, and i've put about £600 worth of 'lecy in it in that time
Total costs with tyres is looking to be about £1200 over 3 years and 25k miles, or about £400 a year (or 1.6 pence per mile)
(it's zero to tax, and when added to our insurance (which has other cars on it) the overall cost of the policy went down!)
If you can find another car that is as quiet, comfortable, and as fun and as quick, for that sort of outlay then you should buy it!
I bought a base spec, i3 second hand 3 years ago. No one wanted one back then, so my 6 month old ex main dealer demo car with just 347 miles on the clock cost me, £16,200. cheap!!
Fast forward 3 years and it's worth, as far as i can tell, exactly what i paid for it. It's had one service, and is due a set of tyres, and i've put about £600 worth of 'lecy in it in that time
Total costs with tyres is looking to be about £1200 over 3 years and 25k miles, or about £400 a year (or 1.6 pence per mile)
(it's zero to tax, and when added to our insurance (which has other cars on it) the overall cost of the policy went down!)
If you can find another car that is as quiet, comfortable, and as fun and as quick, for that sort of outlay then you should buy it!
How about a challenge to beat this. Free fuel, Free insurance, no VED, no servicing costs, no wear and tear, no depreciation. free breakdown cover.
Even bangernomics would find it hard to beat.
https://www.evezy.co.uk/about-evezy/
Renault Zoe 12k miles/year £289 / month no commitment cancel anytime
Insurance
Breakdown cover
Wear & Tear
Service & Repair
Charging
Road Tax
kambites said:
HalcyonRichard said:
Even bangernomics would find it hard to beat.
It's good for a new(ish) car, but you can run an older car for a lot less than that. 1000 miles a month at 40mpg in a diesel powered car will cost you £150 in fuel.
Average full comp insurance in the UK is £45 a month for 12k miles of coverage.
You've got < £100 to cover the rest and show me how you'd spend a lot less on an older car.
SWoll said:
Go on then. 12k miles a year including fuel, insurance (inc tyres), VED, maintenance and depreciation.
I run both of our cars, which have a combined mileage of about 12k, for less than that. If you run a car which is old enough for depreciation to be a non-issue, £270 a month is quite a lot to spend!So how you spend a lot less... well it depends on where you're doing the miles but if they're mostly motorway 60mpg isn't unrealistic out of a 15 year old diesel; insurance... well I insure my Elise for £150 a year so I reckon I could insure an old diesel for £10 a month. Servicing... you can get a oil and filter change done for £50 if you shop around; another £50 for the MoT; so that's £100 a year. Tyres, maybe £100 a set for part-worn budgets and they should do 30k miles of that sort of driving on that sort of car so that's 30 months or around £3.50 a month. Tax, I don't know what old diesels are taxed at and it can't be more than £20 a month?
I'm not saying I'd want to run a car like that, but very many people do!
Edited by kambites on Friday 13th September 21:06
kambites said:
It's good for a new(ish) car, but you can run an older car for a lot less than that.
Yes I have been there. But add up all the costs, fuel alone could be £150/month.Then add insurance, depreciation,VED, tyres, sevicing,.........That monthly fee covers everything :-
Insurance
Breakdown cover
Wear & Tear
Service & Repair
Charging
Road Tax
kambites said:
I run both of our cars, which have a combined mileage of about 12k, for less than that. If you run a car which is old enough for depreciation to be a non-issue, £270 a month is quite a lot to spend!
But there must be some depreciation and costs in service / repair tyres, brakes oil change .....etc. And at 12,000 miles/year fuel must cost a quite a bit. And running a car must include ALL costs.Gassing Station | EV and Alternative Fuels | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff