Has anyone gone back from EV ownership?
Discussion
2SPN said:
We've had ours (2015 22kWh model) as low as 49 miles to empty on a full charge. Zoe is a great town car and I can't imagine going back to ICE for that purpose, however the range and dreadful heater make it a challenge in the worst of winter.
Tiny battery so makes sense I suppose, the i3 is about 42kWh an could imagine it getting down to 100 miles if the weather really goes downhill.i3 heater is also pretty naff in current weather, takes an age to warm up if you don't pre-condition. Conversely the heater in the Model 3 is the best I've ever experienced and seems to warm the car pretty much immediately even with a stone cold battery. The heated seats are also far better than those in the i3.
WRT winter and hating - smaller batteries are hit far far harder.
Affected by low temps more so less energy and if you need x kwh for heating thats a far larger percentage of the remaining capacity than if you have a large battery. eg 10kwh of 20kwh available 50%, 10kwh of 75kwh is 13%
Affected by low temps more so less energy and if you need x kwh for heating thats a far larger percentage of the remaining capacity than if you have a large battery. eg 10kwh of 20kwh available 50%, 10kwh of 75kwh is 13%
Mmm, my Zoe was a 22, and the cold definitely hit the range hard. Not enough to affect my use, but certainly noticeable.
The comments on that article above regarding the disparate and flaky nature of the charging infrastructure are bang on IMO. If the government want to do one thing to make EVs more appealing, then mandating a single, non-contractual standard that must be accepted by everyone, and their charging points must work, is probably what's needed.
The inane variability in whose special-snowflake membership card you need to use a given charger, along with poor information on charger uptime and availability, make it a bit of a logistical bugger to plan long journeys with an eye on "well what if that charger's f
ked?" redundancy when you don't have a huge range to play with.
Still perfectly manageable, did 400+ miles in a day with opportunistic spot charging, but it feeds into my evaluation of current lower-end EV tech only truly working if you have another car or three to use as well.
Which everyone on PH does, so I don't understand why people here get all negative about such matters.
The comments on that article above regarding the disparate and flaky nature of the charging infrastructure are bang on IMO. If the government want to do one thing to make EVs more appealing, then mandating a single, non-contractual standard that must be accepted by everyone, and their charging points must work, is probably what's needed.
The inane variability in whose special-snowflake membership card you need to use a given charger, along with poor information on charger uptime and availability, make it a bit of a logistical bugger to plan long journeys with an eye on "well what if that charger's f
ked?" redundancy when you don't have a huge range to play with.Still perfectly manageable, did 400+ miles in a day with opportunistic spot charging, but it feeds into my evaluation of current lower-end EV tech only truly working if you have another car or three to use as well.
Which everyone on PH does, so I don't understand why people here get all negative about such matters.
2SPN said:
We've had ours (2015 22kWh model) as low as 49 miles to empty on a full charge. Zoe is a great town car and I can't imagine going back to ICE for that purpose, however the range and dreadful heater make it a challenge in the worst of winter.
Same as some friends of ours. Bought a Zoe for the school run, but in the winter it struggled to do the 50 miles needed to do both morning and evening runs. InitialDave said:
If the government want to do one thing to make EVs more appealing, then mandating a single, non-contractual standard that must be accepted by everyone, and their charging points must work, is probably what's needed.
Yes, exactly.In 2 years of ownership, we have never even considered charging the Zoe anywhere other than at home. The public charge network is a farce.
2SPN said:
InitialDave said:
If the government want to do one thing to make EVs more appealing, then mandating a single, non-contractual standard that must be accepted by everyone, and their charging points must work, is probably what's needed.
Yes, exactly.In 2 years of ownership, we have never even considered charging the Zoe anywhere other than at home. The public charge network is a farce.
The 'range anxiety' thing is in reality 'charger anxiety'
An original Hyundai Ioniq with a very modest 28kWh better (now available lightly used for £20k) is a very capable EV , and would not be a problem for the vast majority of people in the UK if only there were plenty of 100+kW charger locations dotted all over the country, each with several units, and with the reliability we expect and get from fossil fuel pumps.
An original Hyundai Ioniq with a very modest 28kWh better (now available lightly used for £20k) is a very capable EV , and would not be a problem for the vast majority of people in the UK if only there were plenty of 100+kW charger locations dotted all over the country, each with several units, and with the reliability we expect and get from fossil fuel pumps.
gangzoom said:
No idea how big a Pointer is but a X can fit a fully assembled toddler bed without having to remove a rear facing Isofix child seat. You also have aircon/ventilation vents almost in the boot area, if you care about that kind of thing.
[Img]https://live.staticflickr.com/1808/41948823955_854bd05140_c_d.jpg[/thumb]
That's a mighty big boot![Img]https://live.staticflickr.com/1808/41948823955_854bd05140_c_d.jpg[/thumb]
They look coupe-like from the outside.
How do you find the width? They look huge to me on UK roads...
InitialDave said:
If the government want to do one thing to make EVs more appealing, then mandating a single, non-contractual standard that must be accepted by everyone, and their charging points must work, is probably what's needed.
This is true.I know why Tesla only shows their chargers in the car, first off because they CAN show them as they know where they are. Secondly, they can ensure these work and lastly they can show more detailed information like availability.
It's a very effective system that doesn't look like rocket science to figure out, yet how others can get it so wrong is beyond me.
Charging infrastructure was maybe 4th or 5th on my list of reasons to go for the tesla over the I Pace, but I'm glad there's superchargers and I'm glad they're that easy to use.
aestetix said:
REALIST123 said:
I’m intrigued to know how Brexit forced you to change your car?
Had to move back to the UK due to loss of rights, forcing me to switch car. Also no home charging for the moment makes it a bit impractical, need to find somewhere with a driveway.Job38 said:
That's a mighty big boot!
They look coupe-like from the outside.
How do you find the width? They look huge to me on UK roads...
Width is not an issue, same as a XC90 or RR, and Transits are similar width. Its our main family hack, goes everywhere not had any problem yet in coming up to 45k miles.They look coupe-like from the outside.
How do you find the width? They look huge to me on UK roads...
Length is more of an issue in some car parks if am parking nose to tail with another 5 meter car. I actually wouldn't rule out the crazy Cybrertruck as potential next car, width is fine but over 5 meters in length and most parking spaces will be an issue.
REALIST123 said:
What rights did you lose? Seems odd from what I know. Where were you?
Don't want to dox myself but many rights have been lost, e.g.- Right to family reunions
- Right to continued freedom of movement (necessary for many jobs)
- Driving licence recognition
- Right to pension increases
- Right to have marriage recognized (same sex couples)
- Right to free medical care when travelling on EHCI
- Right to study and have it funded by the UK gov.
- Pet passports
There are more I forget right now.
Every country has a different way of handling brexit. Some are being slow about it so there is a lot of uncertainty. At some point you have to decide if you are going to risk staying and hoping they come up with a good offer to UK citizens, or if you are going to go back to Britain and try to get in before the mad rush of people looking for houses and jobs.
The other problem is that if you do come back your family will need to apply for the UK settlement scheme which is rapidly turning into Windrush 2, meaning you better get in early so you sue the Home Office if you have to and get everything adjudicated by the EU courts.
aestetix said:
REALIST123 said:
What rights did you lose? Seems odd from what I know. Where were you?
Don't want to dox myself but many rights have been lost, e.g.- Right to family reunions
- Right to continued freedom of movement (necessary for many jobs)
- Driving licence recognition
- Right to pension increases
- Right to have marriage recognized (same sex couples)
- Right to free medical care when travelling on EHCI
- Right to study and have it funded by the UK gov.
- Pet passports
There are more I forget right now.
Every country has a different way of handling brexit. Some are being slow about it so there is a lot of uncertainty. At some point you have to decide if you are going to risk staying and hoping they come up with a good offer to UK citizens, or if you are going to go back to Britain and try to get in before the mad rush of people looking for houses and jobs.
The other problem is that if you do come back your family will need to apply for the UK settlement scheme which is rapidly turning into Windrush 2, meaning you better get in early so you sue the Home Office if you have to and get everything adjudicated by the EU courts.
I have quite a few British friends living and working in the EU, and EU country national friends living in the UK
None have felt any need to repatriate.
REALIST123 said:
Still seems odd to me unless you’re in some peculiarly affected minority group.
Not really, I mean maybe the ones who live in British ghettos on the Costa del Sol or something but anyone who integrates is fairly likely to end up with an EU spouse or entire family for example.Actually even the ones who don't integrate are in trouble because of things like the loss of pet passports, problems owning property in the EU from outside it, loss of right to come and go if they don't qualify for settlement, problems moving money, pension frozen... Some of them seem to be hanging on and hoping because property prices have already come down a long way. Oh yeah, your mortgage is a bit of a problem if you suddenly become a non-EU citizen.
InitialDave said:
I had an EV (Zoe) went back to a normal car.
It's not that I didn't like it, I thought it was great, and it was enjoyable to give the newer tech a try, but from my perspective the numbers don't stack up over normal cars quite yet.
We were exactly the same. When we paid the super cheap lease, 99 quid, but then an extra 78 for the battery lease, then paid to charge it, c.3p a mile, a diesel Clio on lease and doing 55mpg was just cheaper. And without the range issues. This was back in 2013 or so, so I know some things are maybe better now, or the ice versions have increased in price. But a 1.5 diesel clip at 140 a month for 8k miles a year, was dirt cheap. It's not that I didn't like it, I thought it was great, and it was enjoyable to give the newer tech a try, but from my perspective the numbers don't stack up over normal cars quite yet.
We quite liked the Zoe, but in winter it was a pain, range was very poor indeed and became a real concern for even regular commute of less than 20 mile each way.
Edited by poo at Paul's on Sunday 26th January 01:14
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