Are EV Tariffs Worth It?

[48k]

phil4 said:

To the OP you've said a few times that an EV tariff will need a meter change. I read that as you think it'll cost you. It doesn't... at least not directly.

Yes, we the consumer are paying for all the meters in our energy bill, but no, when they fit you a smart meter (it's not smart, at all), it costs you nothing, not even the fitting.

Sorry that you read it that way. I'm aware there is no charge for the meter upgrade. I already have a SMETS1 meter, I think tariffs like eg. Octopus Go need a SMETS2 meter. It was just an observation of something that would need doing in order to be able to get the tariff, I can't just click a button and switch.

[sjg]

If it’s a Secure brand SMETS1 then Octopus can take it over, no need for a new meter.

[Mikehig]

agent006 said:

Mikehig said:

The worry - for all of us, not just EV users - is what will happen at the next review of the price cap in March/April. There's talk of huge increases.

From some recent rough maths when I considered switching our EV and going back to ICE, it would need to be over 50p/kWh before it's price per mile comparable with a 45mpg diesel at £1.45/L

Apologies for not making my point clear. I wasn't trying to suggest anything about the relative costs of "fuelling" EVs vs ICEs. I was just flagging up a general concern about huge increases in the cost of electricity that are on the horizon which folk might want to consider when looking at changing tariffs or whatever.

[phil4]

48k said:

Sorry that you read it that way. I'm aware there is no charge for the meter upgrade. I already have a SMETS1 meter, I think tariffs like eg. Octopus Go need a SMETS2 meter. It was just an observation of something that would need doing in order to be able to get the tariff, I can't just click a button and switch.

Don't worry about apologiding, I'm just glad you know it's free, and so doesn't alter your calcs. Hope it all works out for you.

[FeelingLucky]

I'm somewhat surprised nobody has mentioned a home battery.
Get a big enough one fitted, and you need never be bothered with peak rate again, top up every night on the EV charging cheap rate.

[gmaz]

FeelingLucky said:

I'm somewhat surprised nobody has mentioned a home battery.
Get a big enough one fitted, and you need never be bothered with peak rate again, top up every night on the EV charging cheap rate.

see 5 posts up!

[LordFlathead]

SWoll said:

agent006 said:

Mikehig said:

The worry - for all of us, not just EV users - is what will happen at the next review of the price cap in March/April. There's talk of huge increases.

From some recent rough maths when I considered switching our EV and going back to ICE, it would need to be over 50p/kWh before it's price per mile comparable with a 45mpg diesel at £1.45/L

It's around 65p per kWh for us comparing an eTron 55 v Q7 55 (2.3 miles/kW v 26mpg) and TBH even if fuel costs were comparable I'd still pick the EV due to the convenience of home charging and superior drive train for everyday use.

Pretty much sums up our thoughts. Superior drive train = seamless power and smoothness that will never be beaten by an ICE'd car. Waking up with a full tank is magic and if I'm out and about 26p per kw/h on a Tesla Supercharger is negligible.

[Boxbrownie]

FeelingLucky said:

I'm somewhat surprised nobody has mentioned a home battery.
Get a big enough one fitted, and you need never be bothered with peak rate again, top up every night on the EV charging cheap rate.

And how much would a “big enough” home battery cost to be fitted by a reputable company?

[Lily the Pink]

FeelingLucky said:

I'm somewhat surprised nobody has mentioned a home battery.
Get a big enough one fitted, and you need never be bothered with peak rate again, top up every night on the EV charging cheap rate.

I'm soon having a 13kWp solar pv system fitted and am not at all convinced that a battery will be a good investment. I received a quote for an 8.2kWh battery at just over £4,000. That will require many many years to pay back; I shall see what my usage pattern is over the next year or so and expect the price of batteries to fall in the meantime before reconsidering.

[dapprman]

Lily the Pink said:

I'm soon having a 13kWp solar pv system fitted and am not at all convinced that a battery will be a good investment. I received a quote for an 8.2kWh battery at just over £4,000. That will require many many years to pay back; I shall see what my usage pattern is over the next year or so and expect the price of batteries to fall in the meantime before reconsidering.

How many panels and inverters you going to use? I have a large set up for a semi-detached 1950s former council house and I can manage 12 360w panels, giving me a potential maximum of 4.4kW, however my inverter like many of the consumer ones out there, will limit what the house/grid receive to 3.6kW.
For me a battery made perfect sense. There's very little to be made from putting excess back in to the grid, plus you can only get the FIT up to a certain size of maximum power generation (no clue what the limit is). I started to have days with negligible or no power generation as early as September at which point I started to top my battery up with off peak power for use during the day. Sure it's going to take 8-10 years to pay off the battery cost, but I should do so with a few years left before capacity starts to drop to any extent.
On batteries and EVs, one thing worth noting is the battery output. Mine will do ~3.5kW, however that does mean a 7.2kW charger will also draw 3.7kW from the grid - and that's ignoring anything the house is using (gaming PC does not help, and watch your consumption graphs shoot up when you put on the kettle, the rocket higher if you then have a microwave on at the same time).

[Lily the Pink]

35 panels on 2 inverters. As I understand it, going above 4kWp or thereabouts requires specific permission from the DNO, which my installers are assuring me will not be a problem. I'm expecting between 5.5 and 7.0p/kWh export.

[Blue Oval84]

OP - does your current SMETS1 meter work and speak to EDF, or was it fitted by a previous supplier and not work?

If it does work, then one thing to consider is asking them for ECO2020 on the Standard (Variable) price cap tariff. It's basically the same pricing structure as one of their EV tariffs (off peak 9pm to 7am weeknights and 9pm Friday to 7am Monday) but on the price cap rate instead.

Absolutely do not ask to be put on the EV tariff as this will be much higher than the price cap rates as it will reflect actual costs to them, rather than the cap.

Assuming you can move your energy intensive stuff to after 9pm, or the weekend, then it may work out better than regular one rate price cap.

Once we get to the new price cap in April 2022, re-assess the market and you'll likely find deals available below the price-cap (or switch directly to the EV version if it's well priced)

[48k]

Blue Oval84 said:

OP - does your current SMETS1 meter work and speak to EDF, or was it fitted by a previous supplier and not work?

If it does work, then one thing to consider is asking them for ECO2020 on the Standard (Variable) price cap tariff. It's basically the same pricing structure as one of their EV tariffs (off peak 9pm to 7am weeknights and 9pm Friday to 7am Monday) but on the price cap rate instead.

Absolutely do not ask to be put on the EV tariff as this will be much higher than the price cap rates as it will reflect actual costs to them, rather than the cap.

Assuming you can move your energy intensive stuff to after 9pm, or the weekend, then it may work out better than regular one rate price cap.

Once we get to the new price cap in April 2022, re-assess the market and you'll likely find deals available below the price-cap (or switch directly to the EV version if it's well priced)

The meter was fitted years ago it doesn't talk to EDF. The ECO 20:20 tariff is not available anymore anyway (according to my new friend Kushoo on webchat). These are my only options:



Also, zero chance of "moving energy intensive stuff to after 9pm" - 9pm is bedtime in this house!

[Blue Oval84]

Hmm, yes in that case just stick with Standard and re-visit at the end of March just as the cap is being increased.

Pretty sure your web chat friend is wrong though, Eco2020 is still available as it is listed on their tariff information labels online, albeit you'd probably already have to be on Standard before they'll let you move to it!