7Kw public chargers - how useful?
Discussion
Mark V GTD said:
I should say that I don't have a home wall charger and not really intending to shell out a grand to get one at this stage so that makes me completely reliant on public chargers. Although when I drove an ICE car I was completely reliant on petrol stations so not much change there!
You can still use a 3 pin charger at home. Relying solely on public chargers is just asking for trouble.paradigital said:
rewild said:
Context is everything.
They make a lot of sense in a park and ride, but not much sense in a motorway services.
I don't think they're any use in a supermarket carpark, but I guess being able to say "free charging while you shop" is worth the expense of installing them.
I see the benefit of them at the supermarket, my Model 3 will charge at 29mi/hour at 7kW, so with a weekly shop taking around an hour, and the round trip being 3~ miles, I’m getting 26 miles of free “fuel” per week.They make a lot of sense in a park and ride, but not much sense in a motorway services.
I don't think they're any use in a supermarket carpark, but I guess being able to say "free charging while you shop" is worth the expense of installing them.
For anyone that lives within a 15mi radius of the store, the journey is essentially free.
The assumption is that if you can afford an EV, you are the type of people they want to attract to the store. And getting a bit of free charging (even though in reality its pence here), its appealing to the owners for convenience - and ability to get more range than when they arrived. The cynic in me says that they are deliberately fitting 7Kw chargers because they probably have an algorithm that works out how much extra revenue they get for each minute that a buyer stays - so fitted the slower charger to extend the time. Add that up across all customers per day / week / month - suddenly its a nice little extra and easily off-sets the installation of the chargers.
And given that an average supermarket is pulling a ton of electricity anyway (aircon, cooling, fridges etc), a few 7Kw chargers are peanuts to them. And if I was 10 miles away and its a nice one - I would totally go there!
tamore said:
don't get hung up on supermarkets. how about leisure parks where there is a cinema and eateries. 3-4 hrs parked up where you could quite easily take on 20kWh+. Train station car parks? hotel car parks? anywhere away from home where your car will be left for a good while.
most of these places don't have these chargers thoughgeorgeyboy12345 said:
tamore said:
don't get hung up on supermarkets. how about leisure parks where there is a cinema and eateries. 3-4 hrs parked up where you could quite easily take on 20kWh+. Train station car parks? hotel car parks? anywhere away from home where your car will be left for a good while.
most of these places don't have these chargers thoughIf I’m going to be somewhere for more than 3 hours I usually keep an eye out for one , as the cost is quite similar to home charging, and the parking spaces usually well placed. Otherwise I ignore them.
I’ve noticed over time it’s getting easier and the apps are getting more reliable.
I’ve noticed over time it’s getting easier and the apps are getting more reliable.
I dont have a charger at home at the moment. i've had a few guys around and they're saying that there needs to be around 30m of wiring to be done and i dont think they're keen on doing that.
So i'm waiting on the council to come up with an alternative to on street charging which is undergoing testing at the moment.
So my schedule is this at the moment - finish work at around 5/6am park my car at the local tesco which is a short 5 minute walk away. i set the timer to 2 hour 45 mins on my phone and then go and pick my car up then go to sleep.
so that 7kw charger is essential for me. I do have a lidl a 10 minute walk away which is a 50kw charger should i need to charge a large amount.
I have to charge around 3 times a week for me to do my stuff for the week
So i'm waiting on the council to come up with an alternative to on street charging which is undergoing testing at the moment.
So my schedule is this at the moment - finish work at around 5/6am park my car at the local tesco which is a short 5 minute walk away. i set the timer to 2 hour 45 mins on my phone and then go and pick my car up then go to sleep.
so that 7kw charger is essential for me. I do have a lidl a 10 minute walk away which is a 50kw charger should i need to charge a large amount.
I have to charge around 3 times a week for me to do my stuff for the week
tamore said:
georgeyboy12345 said:
tamore said:
don't get hung up on supermarkets. how about leisure parks where there is a cinema and eateries. 3-4 hrs parked up where you could quite easily take on 20kWh+. Train station car parks? hotel car parks? anywhere away from home where your car will be left for a good while.
most of these places don't have these chargers thoughI guess I'm lucky to have 2 x 7kw charges within a 10 minute drive from my home, both are at or close to the train station. I also have 4 x 11kw charges at another train station (20 minutes from home) and 10 more close by. They are ALL free to charge 
I'm using an 11kw charger this morning. None of the 4 chargers were being used when I arrived which meant I'm looking at just under 3 hours to put 40% charge into the battery. These particular chargers are 2 to a charge post which means my charge time will effectively double if someone plugs into the same post. It's unlikely that will happen though.
And I don't charge at home so for me, these 7kw and 11kw free charge points are extremely useful
If I had a long commute every day and didn't use trains as much as I do, they'd be slightly less useful. Horses for courses and all that.
I'm using an 11kw charger this morning. None of the 4 chargers were being used when I arrived which meant I'm looking at just under 3 hours to put 40% charge into the battery. These particular chargers are 2 to a charge post which means my charge time will effectively double if someone plugs into the same post. It's unlikely that will happen though.
And I don't charge at home so for me, these 7kw and 11kw free charge points are extremely useful
If I had a long commute every day and didn't use trains as much as I do, they'd be slightly less useful. Horses for courses and all that.Shaoxter said:
Mark V GTD said:
I should say that I don't have a home wall charger and not really intending to shell out a grand to get one at this stage so that makes me completely reliant on public chargers. Although when I drove an ICE car I was completely reliant on petrol stations so not much change there!
You can still use a 3 pin charger at home. Relying solely on public chargers is just asking for trouble.It was a piece of piss to wire up mine as the CU was on the other side of the wall, took maybe half an hour. No way was I paying a grand for a glorified plug.
ChocolateFrog said:
About £50 for a commando socket and some wiring.
It was a piece of piss to wire up mine as the CU was on the other side of the wall, took maybe half an hour. No way was I paying a grand for a glorified plug.
It's not a grand and the chargers have a lot more flexibility re charge times, lockable etc. Also I am pretty sure you got yours signed off by building regs, which will have cost a bit. It was a piece of piss to wire up mine as the CU was on the other side of the wall, took maybe half an hour. No way was I paying a grand for a glorified plug.
That's actually an interesting solution.
If you're charging from the grid, and don't have solar integration or anything complex to worry about, that commando socket is basically all an EV "charger" is doing. (They shouldn't call them chargers, really, they're not chargers, they're just power supplies. The charger is in the car.)
There is no doubt EV home charger boxes are a massive rip-off.
Don't the vast majority of EVs have the timer/delay/schedule ability built in to the car and phone app? So you could still do all the off-peak stuff from that.
A quick google suggests Type 2 to 32A commando cable is £250.
I like this idea.
EDIT: I could also fit two of them on each side of the double garage without breaking the bank, instead of one on the face wall to service both cars on the driveway. Much more discrete and means the cable isn't as much of a trip hazard. Could add another inside the garage too. All without getting near the cost of a single branded wallbox thing.
Genuinely, I'd like to hear reasons NOT to do this.
If you're charging from the grid, and don't have solar integration or anything complex to worry about, that commando socket is basically all an EV "charger" is doing. (They shouldn't call them chargers, really, they're not chargers, they're just power supplies. The charger is in the car.)
There is no doubt EV home charger boxes are a massive rip-off.
Don't the vast majority of EVs have the timer/delay/schedule ability built in to the car and phone app? So you could still do all the off-peak stuff from that.
A quick google suggests Type 2 to 32A commando cable is £250.
I like this idea.
EDIT: I could also fit two of them on each side of the double garage without breaking the bank, instead of one on the face wall to service both cars on the driveway. Much more discrete and means the cable isn't as much of a trip hazard. Could add another inside the garage too. All without getting near the cost of a single branded wallbox thing.
Genuinely, I'd like to hear reasons NOT to do this.
Edited by rewild on Wednesday 27th July 09:10
Road2Ruin said:
It's not a grand and the chargers have a lot more flexibility re charge times, lockable etc. Also I am pretty sure you got yours signed off by building regs, which will have cost a bit.
MK Commando (switched) units are lockable. I don't know about all EV's but I know you set charge limits/times on some if not all. Installation of any electrical circuits is a different matter. As far as I recall, adding to an existing circuit is fine but installing a new circuit should only be done by a qualified electrician.
CharlieAlphaMike said:
MK Commando (switched) units are lockable. I don't know about all EV's but I know you set charge limits/times on some if not all.
Installation of any electrical circuits is a different matter. As far as I recall, adding to an existing circuit is fine but installing a new circuit should only be done by a qualified electrician.
If the circuit is to be used for a car charger then it needs to meet the regs for that, doesn't matter if it's a dedicated car charger or a commando socket. Installation of any electrical circuits is a different matter. As far as I recall, adding to an existing circuit is fine but installing a new circuit should only be done by a qualified electrician.
With regards to the original OP, I use the 7KW charger at Tesco quite a bit when shopping, the hour or two top up while we're there for free is a useful top up. Wouldn't bother at a services or anything where I would only be there for 15-20 minutes though.
I think that as we get more chargers and more EVs, being able to just trickle charge it whenever it happens to be parked somewhere will help with the usability for people without off road charging. An hour at the supermarket at 7kW might not add much, but an hour here and an hour there, slow kerbside chargers, etc, and it becomes much less of a problem for people.
rewild said:
That's actually an interesting solution.
If you're charging from the grid, and don't have solar integration or anything complex to worry about, that commando socket is basically all an EV "charger" is doing. (They shouldn't call them chargers, really, they're not chargers, they're just power supplies. The charger is in the car.)
There is no doubt EV home charger boxes are a massive rip-off.
Don't the vast majority of EVs have the timer/delay/schedule ability built in to the car and phone app? So you could still do all the off-peak stuff from that.
A quick google suggests Type 2 to 32A commando cable is £250.
I like this idea.
EDIT: I could also fit two of them on each side of the double garage without breaking the bank, instead of one on the face wall to service both cars on the driveway. Much more discrete and means the cable isn't as much of a trip hazard. Could add another inside the garage too. All without getting near the cost of a single branded wallbox thing.
Genuinely, I'd like to hear reasons NOT to do this.
A car communicates with an EV charger via a data link in the charging cable. No data link, no charging. How does a Commando socket do that? It just has 32A, nothing else.If you're charging from the grid, and don't have solar integration or anything complex to worry about, that commando socket is basically all an EV "charger" is doing. (They shouldn't call them chargers, really, they're not chargers, they're just power supplies. The charger is in the car.)
There is no doubt EV home charger boxes are a massive rip-off.
Don't the vast majority of EVs have the timer/delay/schedule ability built in to the car and phone app? So you could still do all the off-peak stuff from that.
A quick google suggests Type 2 to 32A commando cable is £250.
I like this idea.
EDIT: I could also fit two of them on each side of the double garage without breaking the bank, instead of one on the face wall to service both cars on the driveway. Much more discrete and means the cable isn't as much of a trip hazard. Could add another inside the garage too. All without getting near the cost of a single branded wallbox thing.
Genuinely, I'd like to hear reasons NOT to do this.
Edited by rewild on Wednesday 27th July 09:10
People who say home EV chargers are a massive rip off are people who have no idea about them, what they involve, how they work, the electrical regs required, etc. It's like saying that a Ford Fiesta is a massive rip off at £20k+.
An EV charger is effectively a life long 'petrol pump'/fuel supply for your home and some people seem to want to try a budget DIY option. Just look at that Commando socket vs. a proper charger. It looks ... well, you can see how it looks.
As with everything, someone will always try to DIY/budget solution it and that's fine assuming it is safe...
Road2Ruin said:
It's not a grand
That was what I was qouted last week. Where can I get one installed for significantly less?rewild said:
A quick google suggests Type 2 to 32A commando cable is £250. I like this idea.
https://topcharger.co.uk/commando-sockets-for-ev-charging-a-complete-guide/Edited by Mark V GTD on Wednesday 27th July 10:35
paradigital said:
I see the benefit of them at the supermarket, my Model 3 will charge at 29mi/hour at 7kW, so with a weekly shop taking around an hour, and the round trip being 3~ miles, I’m getting 26 miles of free “fuel” per week.
For anyone that lives within a 15mi radius of the store, the journey is essentially free.
I think people who routinely spend more than 30 minutes in a supermarket need 400V applying somewhere other than their car.For anyone that lives within a 15mi radius of the store, the journey is essentially free.
Mark V GTD said:
Road2Ruin said:
It's not a grand
That was what I was qouted last week. Where can I get one installed for significantly less?https://pod-point.com/solutions/driver/home-chargi...
Took me all of 1 minute.
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