Westminster Council disincentivise EVs from tomorrow
Discussion
Similar whinging all over twitter about the prices of public charging. It's like EV owners think they should be entitled to cheap transport.
It was never going to happen. Tax income needs to be replaced and the energy companies need to replace their lost income from drivers moving away from petrol/diesel.
If these sweeteners to get folks switched to EV continued the country would be significantly worse off.
It was never going to happen. Tax income needs to be replaced and the energy companies need to replace their lost income from drivers moving away from petrol/diesel.
If these sweeteners to get folks switched to EV continued the country would be significantly worse off.
Nomme de Plum said:
croyde said:
I live 8 miles from work commuting from Kingston to Acton.
Over £11 by train and takes 1.5 hours
A fiver in the car takes an hour
£2 on the motorbike takes 20 mins
Sometimes I walk.
Train costs are crazy.
Is £11 season ticket cost? Over £11 by train and takes 1.5 hours
A fiver in the car takes an hour
£2 on the motorbike takes 20 mins
Sometimes I walk.
Train costs are crazy.
That's as easy cycle ride or combination bus, walk. When i lived and worked in London I did not have a car there. Aren't London residents still entitled to free travel when over 50. I know my friend who lives in Twickenham made great use of it to commute into Waterloo.
Khan brought that in as a temporary measure during Covid but never revoked it.
First thing that ever incentivised me to stop using the car but the restriction has put me back into it.
It's not about clean air, it's about money, but I digress.
Strike today, another reason to not get rid of the car but it's a nice morning so I did walk about 4 miles until I got to the nearest tube station. Tube drivers had called their strike off.
Felt quite good, I could have continued the next 4 miles to work but I would have been late.
croyde said:
Over 60, I do have one but you can only use it on the train after 0930, and bus/tube after 0900.
Khan brought that in as a temporary measure during Covid but never revoked it.
First thing that ever incentivised me to stop using the car but the restriction has put me back into it.
It's not about clean air, it's about money, but I digress.
Strike today, another reason to not get rid of the car but it's a nice morning so I did walk about 4 miles until I got to the nearest tube station. Tube drivers had called their strike off.
Felt quite good, I could have continued the next 4 miles to work but I would have been late.
I used to enjoy walk/bus between meetings across central London. I missed greatly the old route masters for hoping on and off. Khan brought that in as a temporary measure during Covid but never revoked it.
First thing that ever incentivised me to stop using the car but the restriction has put me back into it.
It's not about clean air, it's about money, but I digress.
Strike today, another reason to not get rid of the car but it's a nice morning so I did walk about 4 miles until I got to the nearest tube station. Tube drivers had called their strike off.
Felt quite good, I could have continued the next 4 miles to work but I would have been late.
runnerbean 14 said:
I concede this is a first world problem, and one that was probably inevitable, but from Monday Westminster Council are withdrawing a valuable incentive for EV parking.
By chance, tomorrow I am making one of my (now relatively rare) trips in to London and have the choice of taking my daughter's car, which has a resident's parking permit, and my EV. Both are parked outside my house (hers because she is away). For the past five or six years I have only driven an EV to and in London, doing my bit to keep emissions off the streets, but tomorrow I'll take the diesel.
Something similarly daft will be happening in Oxford from September, penalising private car use so those that can will buy large diesel pick-ups (which are not classed as private cars) instead. I often wonder if local politicians grasp the law of unintended consequences - I think the clear answer is NO.
Why not still do your bit? The rest of us have to pay to park in London so why not you?By chance, tomorrow I am making one of my (now relatively rare) trips in to London and have the choice of taking my daughter's car, which has a resident's parking permit, and my EV. Both are parked outside my house (hers because she is away). For the past five or six years I have only driven an EV to and in London, doing my bit to keep emissions off the streets, but tomorrow I'll take the diesel.
Something similarly daft will be happening in Oxford from September, penalising private car use so those that can will buy large diesel pick-ups (which are not classed as private cars) instead. I often wonder if local politicians grasp the law of unintended consequences - I think the clear answer is NO.
TX.
Edited by Terminator X on Monday 8th April 13:05
MrBig said:
Similar whinging all over twitter about the prices of public charging. It's like EV owners think they should be entitled to cheap transport.
It was never going to happen. Tax income needs to be replaced and the energy companies need to replace their lost income from drivers moving away from petrol/diesel.
If these sweeteners to get folks switched to EV continued the country would be significantly worse off.
We should all have access to cheap forms of transport. It was never going to happen. Tax income needs to be replaced and the energy companies need to replace their lost income from drivers moving away from petrol/diesel.
If these sweeteners to get folks switched to EV continued the country would be significantly worse off.
I don't darken Twitter but am one of those whinging about the cost of public charging.
Principally on the basis that they are charging 3x-15x per unit more for the exact same fuel bought retail by a home user. ie gouging and trying desperately to hang on to petrol levels of charging (sic). Petrol stations allegedly make little to nothing from actual fuel sales... If that's true then they are not making up for any losses.
Govt tax revenue is different.
I wholly agree that any sweeteners on the purchase of luxury EVs should be abolished.
Spanking small sectors of the public needs to stop and the way tax is harvested should be revamped across the board. Would be lovely if taxes were more directly reamed from the usage of the services. But that'll never happen.
Murph7355 said:
We should all have access to cheap forms of transport.
I don't darken Twitter but am one of those whinging about the cost of public charging.
Principally on the basis that they are charging 3x-15x per unit more for the exact same fuel bought retail by a home user. ie gouging and trying desperately to hang on to petrol levels of charging (sic). Petrol stations allegedly make little to nothing from actual fuel sales... If that's true then they are not making up for any losses.
Govt tax revenue is different.
I wholly agree that any sweeteners on the purchase of luxury EVs should be abolished.
Spanking small sectors of the public needs to stop and the way tax is harvested should be revamped across the board. Would be lovely if taxes were more directly reamed from the usage of the services. But that'll never happen.
This is just peurile.I don't darken Twitter but am one of those whinging about the cost of public charging.
Principally on the basis that they are charging 3x-15x per unit more for the exact same fuel bought retail by a home user. ie gouging and trying desperately to hang on to petrol levels of charging (sic). Petrol stations allegedly make little to nothing from actual fuel sales... If that's true then they are not making up for any losses.
Govt tax revenue is different.
I wholly agree that any sweeteners on the purchase of luxury EVs should be abolished.
Spanking small sectors of the public needs to stop and the way tax is harvested should be revamped across the board. Would be lovely if taxes were more directly reamed from the usage of the services. But that'll never happen.
Do you think beer should cost the same in a pub as it does at home?
It costs money to provide chargers, you're going to have to pay for that.
If you think it can be done much cheaper, maybe there's a business opportunity for you.
MrBig said:
Similar whinging all over twitter about the prices of public charging. It's like EV owners think they should be entitled to cheap transport.
It was never going to happen. Tax income needs to be replaced and the energy companies need to replace their lost income from drivers moving away from petrol/diesel.
If these sweeteners to get folks switched to EV continued the country would be significantly worse off.
Electricity at home is 5%. Electricity on public chargers is 20%. There's good justification there for aligning them to 5% to ensure those without off-street parking aren't penalised. Any increase to the home Electricity 5% VAT rate would hurt the most vulnerable. It was never going to happen. Tax income needs to be replaced and the energy companies need to replace their lost income from drivers moving away from petrol/diesel.
If these sweeteners to get folks switched to EV continued the country would be significantly worse off.
Ken_Code said:
Charging the same for EVs as for other cars isn’t disincentivising them. A disincentive would be charging them more than other cars pay.
snuffy said:
How is removal of an incentive a disincentive?
You're confusing an actual disincentive with the act of disincentivising.
Murph7355 said:
We should all have access to cheap forms of transport.
I don't darken Twitter but am one of those whinging about the cost of public charging.
Principally on the basis that they are charging 3x-15x per unit more for the exact same fuel bought retail by a home user. ie gouging and trying desperately to hang on to petrol levels of charging (sic). Petrol stations allegedly make little to nothing from actual fuel sales... If that's true then they are not making up for any losses.
Govt tax revenue is different.
I wholly agree that any sweeteners on the purchase of luxury EVs should be abolished.
Spanking small sectors of the public needs to stop and the way tax is harvested should be revamped across the board. Would be lovely if taxes were more directly reamed from the usage of the services. But that'll never happen.
The chargers are expensive. ABB make some of the better units but they are anywhere from 25k for a 50kw charger to nearly 100k for the latest 360kw chargers. That's just for the charger. The power supply, built environment (curbs, covers, lighting), PCI audits, Payment terminal costs, Back Office servers, PAS1899 requirements etc are all insanely expensive too. A simple 4-5 charger site can very quickly move into the millions to install. You'd have to sell a lot of kWh to make £1M back if you're only making a few pence per kWh I don't darken Twitter but am one of those whinging about the cost of public charging.
Principally on the basis that they are charging 3x-15x per unit more for the exact same fuel bought retail by a home user. ie gouging and trying desperately to hang on to petrol levels of charging (sic). Petrol stations allegedly make little to nothing from actual fuel sales... If that's true then they are not making up for any losses.
Govt tax revenue is different.
I wholly agree that any sweeteners on the purchase of luxury EVs should be abolished.
Spanking small sectors of the public needs to stop and the way tax is harvested should be revamped across the board. Would be lovely if taxes were more directly reamed from the usage of the services. But that'll never happen.
runnerbean 14 said:
I concede this is a first world problem, and one that was probably inevitable, but from Monday Westminster Council are withdrawing a valuable incentive for EV parking.
By chance, tomorrow I am making one of my (now relatively rare) trips in to London and have the choice of taking my daughter's car, which has a resident's parking permit, and my EV. Both are parked outside my house (hers because she is away). For the past five or six years I have only driven an EV to and in London, doing my bit to keep emissions off the streets, but tomorrow I'll take the diesel.
Something similarly daft will be happening in Oxford from September, penalising private car use so those that can will buy large diesel pick-ups (which are not classed as private cars) instead. I often wonder if local politicians grasp the law of unintended consequences - I think the clear answer is NO.
Timely post. I'm due to go to London this Friday and I'd missed the change in parking rates. By chance, tomorrow I am making one of my (now relatively rare) trips in to London and have the choice of taking my daughter's car, which has a resident's parking permit, and my EV. Both are parked outside my house (hers because she is away). For the past five or six years I have only driven an EV to and in London, doing my bit to keep emissions off the streets, but tomorrow I'll take the diesel.
Something similarly daft will be happening in Oxford from September, penalising private car use so those that can will buy large diesel pick-ups (which are not classed as private cars) instead. I often wonder if local politicians grasp the law of unintended consequences - I think the clear answer is NO.
Ken_Code said:
SWoll said:
No. Stopping incentivising something is still not the same as disincentivising.By all means take your argument up with dictionary.com.
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