Anyone giving up EV?
Discussion
It is pretty much guaranteed one of our next dailies will be EV (we have one each). We will need to have one, likely ICE for the foreseeable, that can do the longer distance runs with an EV that can do the shorter trips.
Our needs are such that shorter trips means being able to do 100 miles in a day so the older cheaper EVs are marginal, but cars like the Corsa/208e are looking promising in a year or two with the prices the way they are.
Our needs are such that shorter trips means being able to do 100 miles in a day so the older cheaper EVs are marginal, but cars like the Corsa/208e are looking promising in a year or two with the prices the way they are.
sjg said:
Nope, always liked how they drive, no worries about oil temperature and using the power from cold,
That is something that I really like about EVs, and I reckon that it must be great to just jump in them and floor them straight away should you wish. I never give any of my cars the beans until the oil temp is over 80 degrees, but that can take ages though depending on the weather. 
I'm 1 year into a 4 year salary sacrifice scheme for my EV which I really love driving (little Corsa) however I'd never pay its original book price. My thoughts when I took out the contract for it was that I'll likely stick with an EV while this scheme existed but I'd go back to ICE when it ended because I just wouldn't pay the prices EVs attract.
I charge at home, mostly off my own solar. My contract is an all inclusive affair including tyres, maintenance and insurance. Whether they seek to pass on the EV tax when that kicks in is so far unclear. So far though, it has cost me far far less than running my old Merc GL as a daily, even though I have retained the tank and still tax and insured it.
But I've been reading of the predicted drop in EV retail prices recently which, if it happens, does make them more attractive if I had to buy one outright in the future. I do a lot of "junk" miles (school run, shopping, visiting people) so using a small "white goods" vehicle makes sense.
I enjoy driving just about anything but I must admit having a 130bhp car that's always in the right gear as I squirt around the country lanes is especially fun. I didn't expect I'd actually like it. Thought it'd just be "transport".
I charge at home, mostly off my own solar. My contract is an all inclusive affair including tyres, maintenance and insurance. Whether they seek to pass on the EV tax when that kicks in is so far unclear. So far though, it has cost me far far less than running my old Merc GL as a daily, even though I have retained the tank and still tax and insured it.
But I've been reading of the predicted drop in EV retail prices recently which, if it happens, does make them more attractive if I had to buy one outright in the future. I do a lot of "junk" miles (school run, shopping, visiting people) so using a small "white goods" vehicle makes sense.
I enjoy driving just about anything but I must admit having a 130bhp car that's always in the right gear as I squirt around the country lanes is especially fun. I didn't expect I'd actually like it. Thought it'd just be "transport".
LimaDelta said:
The i3 went a couple of years ago. Both cars ICE now, and no plans to go back to BEV.
Not a financial decision, more a practicality one, and due to our location. If they ever bring the Cybertruck to the UK then I may reconsider...
I can’t see any way that they’ll be allowed in the UK.Not a financial decision, more a practicality one, and due to our location. If they ever bring the Cybertruck to the UK then I may reconsider...
In the US a “truck” seems to be allowed to ignore much of the pedestrian safety legislation there, and get nowhere near what would be required in the UK.
https://www.motoringresearch.com/car-news/tesla-cy...
I've got a Model 3 Performance, bought used when it was 3 year old, so financially this thing is saving me a fortune given I was going to change cars at the time anyway, and for something at the same price range.
I've learned never to say never, but as it stands now, I can't see me going back to ICE unless it's far cheaper to run, or I come into money that allows me to choose something special. I've always tried to strike a balance between a nice car and affordable running costs.
Like I say though, never say never. When I got my first turbo diesel, I swore I'd never go back to petrol. It was quick, loads of torque and cheaper to run. We got hit by EGR/DPF issues, then again on the next car, and we went back to petrol. This was before people started to realise that DPF equipped diesels were not suitable to shorter journeys.
I've learned never to say never, but as it stands now, I can't see me going back to ICE unless it's far cheaper to run, or I come into money that allows me to choose something special. I've always tried to strike a balance between a nice car and affordable running costs.
Like I say though, never say never. When I got my first turbo diesel, I swore I'd never go back to petrol. It was quick, loads of torque and cheaper to run. We got hit by EGR/DPF issues, then again on the next car, and we went back to petrol. This was before people started to realise that DPF equipped diesels were not suitable to shorter journeys.
TheBinarySheep said:
I've got a Model 3 Performance, bought used when it was 3 year old, so financially this thing is saving me a fortune given I was going to change cars at the time anyway, and for something at the same price range.
Out of interest did you buy before or after the huge dip in used values? Depreciation is pretty much always the biggest cost of car ownership, yet the one people rarely mention until they come to sell/PX as it's not coming out of their bank account every month like fuel does.SWoll said:
Out of interest did you buy before or after the huge dip in used values? Depreciation is pretty much always the biggest cost of car ownership, yet the one people rarely mention until they come to sell/PX as it's not coming out of their bank account every month like fuel does.
I bought before prices dropped.I paid around £34k and at the time I was looking at a similarly aged BMW M340i for around the same price.
At this moment, had I bought the M340i, then I'd have an asset worth around £8k more than my Tesla.
However, if I remember rightly, my running costs have reduced by around £3k a year, and I've calculated that at threes years of ownership, the Tesla is the cheaper of the two.
I do however think that the M340i has kept it's value fairly well, with 2019 models available on Autotrader for around a similar price to those 1-2 years newer. If you compare that to the 330i where there's a £6-8k different in price between a 2019 and 2021 model. Hindsight it a wonderful thing though.
2 months and 4k miles into my first EV, a Tesla Model 3 Long Range.
As a daily i'm struggling to think what else i'd have. I have an Elise and a motorbike in the garage for fun though. Without those i'd struggle a bit with an EV as my only car, as good as it is.
Only chance i'd give up EV completely is if i decided to go all in on a 911 GT3 or similar and combine the value of the other vehicles together, in which case i'd buy a sheddy petrol estate for the daily duties.
I paid £19k for the Tesla at 4 yrs old and 65k miles. Looks like it's worth about £17k-£18k now. That's fine. It's saved me about £300 in fuel in 2 months so far.
As a daily i'm struggling to think what else i'd have. I have an Elise and a motorbike in the garage for fun though. Without those i'd struggle a bit with an EV as my only car, as good as it is.
Only chance i'd give up EV completely is if i decided to go all in on a 911 GT3 or similar and combine the value of the other vehicles together, in which case i'd buy a sheddy petrol estate for the daily duties.
I paid £19k for the Tesla at 4 yrs old and 65k miles. Looks like it's worth about £17k-£18k now. That's fine. It's saved me about £300 in fuel in 2 months so far.
LowTread said:
I paid £19k for the Tesla at 4 yrs old and 65k miles. Looks like it's worth about £17k-£18k now. That's fine. It's saved me about £300 in fuel in 2 months so far.
This is where I'm saving the most money. My fuel costs have gone from an average of £210 per month, to less than £20. I'm also not paying BMW for a service plan or extended warranty.Some will say the BMW service plan is optional, it is, but if I'd gone for a BMW, I would have paid for one because I like the peace of mind and full manufacturer service history. With the Tesla, there's practically no servicing, so there's no need for a plan at all.
An extended warranty is also optional, but I always prefer them because engines and gearboxes are expense, so again, peace of mind. With Tesla, the battery and motors are covered for 8 year and over 100,000 mile anyway, so I don't need to pay more for peace of mind.
We did so many years ago, about 10 in fact, having tried a Zoe on the "99 quid" lease (plus battery and deposit etc). We chopped it in at 2 of the 3 years against a diesel clio on lease that was just cheaper overall, the mileage on the lease was low, and the low range of that model zoe was ok, (about 60 to 70 miles in practice), but it was before EV electric tarrifs, and the ppm grew from about 3 or 4ppm to nearer 7ppm, the clio was about 10ppm in diesel.
It was ok, but the clio was better, not brilliant, but better!
We are more likley to go back to a hybrid first now, whilst the tech has increased massively in EVs, the costs to buy and lease have also, and I am just not convinced they are where they need to be to have on without an element of compromise. it will come, i hope, unless development slows or stops once legislation forces them on everyone.
Most likely to go for a similar, entry level, small cheaper EV, closest i'd say at the mo is the MG4, but i think better and cheaper will soon come.
It was ok, but the clio was better, not brilliant, but better!
We are more likley to go back to a hybrid first now, whilst the tech has increased massively in EVs, the costs to buy and lease have also, and I am just not convinced they are where they need to be to have on without an element of compromise. it will come, i hope, unless development slows or stops once legislation forces them on everyone.
Most likely to go for a similar, entry level, small cheaper EV, closest i'd say at the mo is the MG4, but i think better and cheaper will soon come.
We have, twice. We had a Leaf between 2015 & 17 which we loved, but the range wasn't enough to make it a usable daily so it was swapped for an Octavia vRS. in 2020 we bought a Passat GTE- my wife never really gelled with it and we were looking at trading it in for a full EV (Tesla M3 and VW ID7 were the favourites). On the way home one evening in February the car bricked itself at a set of traffic lights with an ambulance on call behind it, blocking the ambulance in. Eight weeks later it's still immobile at the VW dealer and they have no idea what's wrong with it, or how much it will cost to fix. Needless to say it put my OH off anything electric and she now has another Octavia vRS.
I'd still have one though- I quite fancy a Renault 5 and either a Caterham or 997 for the weekend.
I'd still have one though- I quite fancy a Renault 5 and either a Caterham or 997 for the weekend.
I'd never go back for the daily. I am looking to find a special ICE to keep and cherish, but that's more of a fun investment than a motoring preference.
My business partner and I both began leasing EV's in 2020, due to the BIK rates - no brainer. We have discussed what we would do as and when the BIK free picnic ends, and we would both continue with EV, but paid for privately and back bill mileage to the company.
Mrs Deuce is particularly mind made up about EV now, she won't ever go back. We have two couple friends also with an EV and the ladies in those relationships are also adamant they won't go back - perhaps a common trait amongst the other sex that we don't really hear much from on this male-centric forum? In fact, the motoring press in general is mostly written by, and read by males. I suppose I'd have to go and lurk on mumsnet to see the EV vs ICE debate from the other side
EDIT: I gave into temptation - turns out they love them: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4935178-please-...
My business partner and I both began leasing EV's in 2020, due to the BIK rates - no brainer. We have discussed what we would do as and when the BIK free picnic ends, and we would both continue with EV, but paid for privately and back bill mileage to the company.
Mrs Deuce is particularly mind made up about EV now, she won't ever go back. We have two couple friends also with an EV and the ladies in those relationships are also adamant they won't go back - perhaps a common trait amongst the other sex that we don't really hear much from on this male-centric forum? In fact, the motoring press in general is mostly written by, and read by males. I suppose I'd have to go and lurk on mumsnet to see the EV vs ICE debate from the other side
EDIT: I gave into temptation - turns out they love them: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4935178-please-...
Edited by TheDeuce on Friday 12th April 16:47
I have gone back to ICE.
I tried hard with EV's - having had three, all with different individual strengths and weaknesses, they all suffered from poor actual range in the real world. I accept that my driving pattern is unusual - I do a "national average" 8K a year or so. However, the unusual bit is that over 90% of those miles are long journeys. I commute to my office in Central London by train (or motorcycle, or bicycle occasionally), but when I go to my projects they are scattered across the UK as if by blunderbuss. EV's just could not cope with this use pattern. The constant planning where to charge, planning a back up as well in case the first option was busy/broken (which was/is often) was exhausting. Seeing well known journeys (I have been doing the same thing for years) take twice as much time as with ICE was inefficient and hugely frustrating - exactly the two things that EV's are supposed to be better at, ironically.
Another thing - to scotch some of the nonsense on this forum. Be very clear that EV's are not better than ICE. They simply aren't. What they are is different. If that difference works for you, then great, but they are not better. Like all things, they have good points and bad points - it is just that these points are different to ICE cars.
Personally, other than for very local work (which I agree they are best at - hence my order for a Dacia Spring), I will stay with ICE as my "work" car until forced to change. This has nothing to do with "sounds and smells", as my classics can and do satisfy me in that department.
For those of you who can make it work now, that's great. I hope the cars and infrastructure continue to improve.
My own experience is that there is an awful long way to go.
I tried hard with EV's - having had three, all with different individual strengths and weaknesses, they all suffered from poor actual range in the real world. I accept that my driving pattern is unusual - I do a "national average" 8K a year or so. However, the unusual bit is that over 90% of those miles are long journeys. I commute to my office in Central London by train (or motorcycle, or bicycle occasionally), but when I go to my projects they are scattered across the UK as if by blunderbuss. EV's just could not cope with this use pattern. The constant planning where to charge, planning a back up as well in case the first option was busy/broken (which was/is often) was exhausting. Seeing well known journeys (I have been doing the same thing for years) take twice as much time as with ICE was inefficient and hugely frustrating - exactly the two things that EV's are supposed to be better at, ironically.
Another thing - to scotch some of the nonsense on this forum. Be very clear that EV's are not better than ICE. They simply aren't. What they are is different. If that difference works for you, then great, but they are not better. Like all things, they have good points and bad points - it is just that these points are different to ICE cars.
Personally, other than for very local work (which I agree they are best at - hence my order for a Dacia Spring), I will stay with ICE as my "work" car until forced to change. This has nothing to do with "sounds and smells", as my classics can and do satisfy me in that department.
For those of you who can make it work now, that's great. I hope the cars and infrastructure continue to improve.
My own experience is that there is an awful long way to go.
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