My first EV Experience
Discussion
raspy said:
I've found on road trips it's quicker to rapid charge back up to 80%, get on with my journey (and charge up to 80% at the next place), rather than spend ages in one location waiting for it to charge really slowly to 100% (it's the 80-100% that takes bloody ages)
A good and valid Tip. Let the car work it all out (Does in our Tesla) like this.
I have to say as a recent EV driver (company car) that I am sold on EV's already. Just love it (VW ID4, base model)
But, im the sort to research stuff and watched hours of youtube videos and reviews to get an idea of public charging so when I ventured out to a public charger, I was prepared and all gone OK so far - I have RFID cards (CPS, electroverse, WeCharge) and a few apps - Tesla been the important one for charging and others to see where chargers are.
Having said all that, if 10 months ago, before I ventured into EV's I had an EV as a hire car, particularly in a foreign country I can see that it would be a struggle for many.
There is little standardisation of payment methods and misunderstanding of differencies between AC and DC chargers and their plugs and realistic charging speed. Add that to it not been obvious what the max speed any particular car will charge at and each having limitations based on temperature and exisiting charge % affecting the charge speed.
It would be quite daunting to someone hiring.
But, im the sort to research stuff and watched hours of youtube videos and reviews to get an idea of public charging so when I ventured out to a public charger, I was prepared and all gone OK so far - I have RFID cards (CPS, electroverse, WeCharge) and a few apps - Tesla been the important one for charging and others to see where chargers are.
Having said all that, if 10 months ago, before I ventured into EV's I had an EV as a hire car, particularly in a foreign country I can see that it would be a struggle for many.
There is little standardisation of payment methods and misunderstanding of differencies between AC and DC chargers and their plugs and realistic charging speed. Add that to it not been obvious what the max speed any particular car will charge at and each having limitations based on temperature and exisiting charge % affecting the charge speed.
It would be quite daunting to someone hiring.
Tomo1971 said:
I have to say as a recent EV driver (company car) that I am sold on EV's already. Just love it (VW ID4, base model)
But, im the sort to research stuff and watched hours of youtube videos and reviews to get an idea of public charging so when I ventured out to a public charger, I was prepared and all gone OK so far - I have RFID cards (CPS, electroverse, WeCharge) and a few apps - Tesla been the important one for charging and others to see where chargers are.
Having said all that, if 10 months ago, before I ventured into EV's I had an EV as a hire car, particularly in a foreign country I can see that it would be a struggle for many.
There is little standardisation of payment methods and misunderstanding of differencies between AC and DC chargers and their plugs and realistic charging speed. Add that to it not been obvious what the max speed any particular car will charge at and each having limitations based on temperature and exisiting charge % affecting the charge speed.
It would be quite daunting to someone hiring.
It was daunting, the biggest thing was working out how much time to not waste. But, im the sort to research stuff and watched hours of youtube videos and reviews to get an idea of public charging so when I ventured out to a public charger, I was prepared and all gone OK so far - I have RFID cards (CPS, electroverse, WeCharge) and a few apps - Tesla been the important one for charging and others to see where chargers are.
Having said all that, if 10 months ago, before I ventured into EV's I had an EV as a hire car, particularly in a foreign country I can see that it would be a struggle for many.
There is little standardisation of payment methods and misunderstanding of differencies between AC and DC chargers and their plugs and realistic charging speed. Add that to it not been obvious what the max speed any particular car will charge at and each having limitations based on temperature and exisiting charge % affecting the charge speed.
It would be quite daunting to someone hiring.
Paying was frigging irritating though, even though the Carrefour had a machine on the side it didn't work for me, and even locals were seeking help.
In hindsight having charging facility at the AirBnB (Or if we'd been in a hotel) would had been the way I'd work for charging, however im way ahead here in hoping this would be possible as AirBnB doesn't even have a filter to search for these.
Could I ask where you hired the Tesla from?
James6112 said:
Last weekend I hired a Tesla in the Uk as an experiment (£150 for 3 days, unlimited mileage, incl ‘free’ Tesla charging). First hop, South to the Lake district. It directed me to Rugby to get an hours charge. Said how many chargers were free etc.
Did 900+ miles in 3 days, Lakes/up to Loch Lomond, Derbyshire Peaks on the way back. No problems at all with the free charging.
Did 900+ miles in 3 days, Lakes/up to Loch Lomond, Derbyshire Peaks on the way back. No problems at all with the free charging.
Tomo1971 said:
I have to say as a recent EV driver (company car) that I am sold on EV's already. Just love it (VW ID4, base model)
But, im the sort to research stuff and watched hours of youtube videos and reviews to get an idea of public charging so when I ventured out to a public charger, I was prepared and all gone OK so far - I have RFID cards (CPS, electroverse, WeCharge) and a few apps - Tesla been the important one for charging and others to see where chargers are.
Having said all that, if 10 months ago, before I ventured into EV's I had an EV as a hire car, particularly in a foreign country I can see that it would be a struggle for many.
There is little standardisation of payment methods and misunderstanding of differencies between AC and DC chargers and their plugs and realistic charging speed. Add that to it not been obvious what the max speed any particular car will charge at and each having limitations based on temperature and exisiting charge % affecting the charge speed.
It would be quite daunting to someone hiring.
How daunting renting an EV in a foreign country depends upon whether the rental company have taken steps to make your life as simple as possible before even arriving (e.g. Hertz USA telling you in an email how to charge your EV) and upon arrival (e.g. I rented from a local firm in Portugal and they gave me a charge card that I could use anywhere I wanted to rapid charge on the highway, and the car itself gave me options in the satnav on where to charge) But, im the sort to research stuff and watched hours of youtube videos and reviews to get an idea of public charging so when I ventured out to a public charger, I was prepared and all gone OK so far - I have RFID cards (CPS, electroverse, WeCharge) and a few apps - Tesla been the important one for charging and others to see where chargers are.
Having said all that, if 10 months ago, before I ventured into EV's I had an EV as a hire car, particularly in a foreign country I can see that it would be a struggle for many.
There is little standardisation of payment methods and misunderstanding of differencies between AC and DC chargers and their plugs and realistic charging speed. Add that to it not been obvious what the max speed any particular car will charge at and each having limitations based on temperature and exisiting charge % affecting the charge speed.
It would be quite daunting to someone hiring.
You are right on one thing though, that if you are used to refuelling a petrol/diesel car and the rate of refuelling the tank slows down when it's cold outside or if you arrive with half a tank left, and your first EV experience is a rental car, and you would be left annoyed if nobody warned you that the speed at which it recharges depends upon how warm the battery is, the ambient temperature or your state of charge when plugging in.
I suspect there is a need for rental car companies (in general) to do much more to "inform" first time EV renters of what is involved and what happens when things don't go to plan.
raspy said:
I suspect there is a need for rental car companies (in general) to do much more to "inform" first time EV renters of what is involved and what happens when things don't go to plan.
I don't think there is any other answer here.Adding the wrong fuel won't ever happen again thats for sure so surely thats one less department!
I think in general terms car rental firms are still in 1995, I saw at Nice airport waiting for desk workers to process data I could had provided way in advance, yet the minute you want to find a vehicle nobody is around. Get the systems upgraded and doing something more productive!
I work with Enterprise and they are no different.
Ha, got a cheap deal on a Polestar from Bristol recently. Half the price of a compact and a lovely car to drive. Problem was that the previous renter was Spanish and he had set up all the controls to suit. We spent half an hour with the Hertz representative to no avail and we spent the weekend being navigated in Spanish. Thankfully my partner speaks the language and we got to our wedding destination with no problem. Charging was no problem and I was blown away by Exeter services. As a Tesla Model 3 owner I was in awe with how things could look like in the years to come.
Blackpuddin said:
No wonder Hertz US has started unloading its Polestars and Teslas, having to put up with confused customers must be a nightmare for their staff. As for expecting cars to be brought back with a near-full charge, that is a mickey take.
A lot of was down to higher than average repair costs for Teslas. I used to rent Teslas frequently with Hertz in different US airports, and I didn't see any confused customers each time (not saying that it's not confusing for some) - If you don't want to bring it back with similar charge to when they gave it to you, it's 35 bucks "recharging" fee. Hardly the end of the world, especially if you place a premium on the value of your time. We hired an EV in France last year and got precisely zero useful information from the hire car company. But we've got an EV in the UK, so we know the ropes. If we hadn't had that prior knowledge, it would have been a nightmare. Nothing to do with the car; everything to do with pretty crap customer service.
When you're new to EVs your first experience of public chargers is highly likely to be one of stress and frustration because although the cabling is indeed standardised, the logins, phone apps and payment methods aren't, and the quality of the "user experience" of all the software involved is frequently pants. It's very much like trying to pay for parking with your phone. The first time is a massive pain in the arse, but once you've set up the app on your phone and you know how to navigate the app, you can do it in a few seconds without thinking about it.
Experience of most people is that you quickly get into the rhythm of using an EV and they just work. For example, there are a couple of people in my mountaineering club who've got EVs through work (i.e. primarily for financial reasons) and use them without any issue to tour round the North West of Scotland, the Pyrenees and the Alps.
When you're new to EVs your first experience of public chargers is highly likely to be one of stress and frustration because although the cabling is indeed standardised, the logins, phone apps and payment methods aren't, and the quality of the "user experience" of all the software involved is frequently pants. It's very much like trying to pay for parking with your phone. The first time is a massive pain in the arse, but once you've set up the app on your phone and you know how to navigate the app, you can do it in a few seconds without thinking about it.
Experience of most people is that you quickly get into the rhythm of using an EV and they just work. For example, there are a couple of people in my mountaineering club who've got EVs through work (i.e. primarily for financial reasons) and use them without any issue to tour round the North West of Scotland, the Pyrenees and the Alps.
robbob1980 said:
Could I ask where you hired the Tesla from?
HiJames6112 said:
Last weekend I hired a Tesla in the Uk as an experiment (£150 for 3 days, unlimited mileage, incl ‘free’ Tesla charging). First hop, South to the Lake district. It directed me to Rugby to get an hours charge. Said how many chargers were free etc.
Did 900+ miles in 3 days, Lakes/up to Loch Lomond, Derbyshire Peaks on the way back. No problems at all with the free charging.
Did 900+ miles in 3 days, Lakes/up to Loch Lomond, Derbyshire Peaks on the way back. No problems at all with the free charging.
That was with Europcar
The prices do seem to vary, supply & demand etc
ATG said:
We hired an EV in France last year and got precisely zero useful information from the hire car company. But we've got an EV in the UK, so we know the ropes. If we hadn't had that prior knowledge, it would have been a nightmare. Nothing to do with the car; everything to do with pretty crap customer service.
When you're new to EVs your first experience of public chargers is highly likely to be one of stress and frustration because although the cabling is indeed standardised, the logins, phone apps and payment methods aren't, and the quality of the "user experience" of all the software involved is frequently pants. It's very much like trying to pay for parking with your phone. The first time is a massive pain in the arse, but once you've set up the app on your phone and you know how to navigate the app, you can do it in a few seconds without thinking about it.
Experience of most people is that you quickly get into the rhythm of using an EV and they just work. For example, there are a couple of people in my mountaineering club who've got EVs through work (i.e. primarily for financial reasons) and use them without any issue to tour round the North West of Scotland, the Pyrenees and the Alps.
Yes apps/payment pretty dire, although Carrefour was good as it told me charge usage and historic costs of charge.When you're new to EVs your first experience of public chargers is highly likely to be one of stress and frustration because although the cabling is indeed standardised, the logins, phone apps and payment methods aren't, and the quality of the "user experience" of all the software involved is frequently pants. It's very much like trying to pay for parking with your phone. The first time is a massive pain in the arse, but once you've set up the app on your phone and you know how to navigate the app, you can do it in a few seconds without thinking about it.
Experience of most people is that you quickly get into the rhythm of using an EV and they just work. For example, there are a couple of people in my mountaineering club who've got EVs through work (i.e. primarily for financial reasons) and use them without any issue to tour round the North West of Scotland, the Pyrenees and the Alps.
JNW1 said:
Your experience tends to confirm one my thoughts on EV's, namely they're great if you can charge mostly or exclusively at home but not so good if you have to rely on the public charging network. The latter often doesn't seem much cheaper than filling an ICE car and, more significantly, for the moment at least it appears to be nowhere near as convenient.
I would not really get an EV as a rental car to be totally fair, although we're totally EV at home. If you're not acquainted with the car or with the place you're moving to it could get tricky. OTOH I don't have any problem in travelling to unknown places with my car and I would not have issues in renting an EV in a place I know well. I have been to the Cote d'Azur this past winter and I must say that I couldn't feel that charging was an issue. The original plan was to charge on the way back at Tesla Supercharger in Nice, but I found that the Wiiz chargers in Juan les Pins were far more convenient.
They are slow chargers (11 kW on the Model3), but they charge 3 € from 22:00 to 7:00, so plugged the car with 30% battery and in the morning I had a full car paying peanuts: ~40 kWh at 3 € equal to 0.075 € / kWh... good for 200 ish motorway miles.
France has in my experience by far the best charging network (which is to be seen also in the growth of their EV sales).
I rented a Polstar 2 a few weeks ago for £30 a day from Hertz. They seam consistently £30-40 a day during the week. A nice car to drive but many are simply not ready for an EV.
In the rental office the guy ahead of me was renting an EV. You could see them visibility switch off when the agent started talking about the 2 charging cables, how to charge and the charge for each 10% of energy used. Needless to say he left with an ICE car
In the rental office the guy ahead of me was renting an EV. You could see them visibility switch off when the agent started talking about the 2 charging cables, how to charge and the charge for each 10% of energy used. Needless to say he left with an ICE car
AlexIT said:
I would not really get an EV as a rental car to be totally fair, although we're totally EV at home. If you're not acquainted with the car or with the place you're moving to it could get tricky. OTOH I don't have any problem in travelling to unknown places with my car and I would not have issues in renting an EV in a place I know well.
I have been to the Cote d'Azur this past winter and I must say that I couldn't feel that charging was an issue. The original plan was to charge on the way back at Tesla Supercharger in Nice, but I found that the Wiiz chargers in Juan les Pins were far more convenient.
They are slow chargers (11 kW on the Model3), but they charge 3 € from 22:00 to 7:00, so plugged the car with 30% battery and in the morning I had a full car paying peanuts: ~40 kWh at 3 € equal to 0.075 € / kWh... good for 200 ish motorway miles.
France has in my experience by far the best charging network (which is to be seen also in the growth of their EV sales).
Well I was in Juan Les Pin and it wasn't so great, locals were also reporting issues.I have been to the Cote d'Azur this past winter and I must say that I couldn't feel that charging was an issue. The original plan was to charge on the way back at Tesla Supercharger in Nice, but I found that the Wiiz chargers in Juan les Pins were far more convenient.
They are slow chargers (11 kW on the Model3), but they charge 3 € from 22:00 to 7:00, so plugged the car with 30% battery and in the morning I had a full car paying peanuts: ~40 kWh at 3 € equal to 0.075 € / kWh... good for 200 ish motorway miles.
France has in my experience by far the best charging network (which is to be seen also in the growth of their EV sales).
Maybe it was people using them overnight too much
fourstardan said:
It was daunting, the biggest thing was working out how much time to not waste.
Paying was frigging irritating though, even though the Carrefour had a machine on the side it didn't work for me, and even locals were seeking help.
In hindsight having charging facility at the AirBnB (Or if we'd been in a hotel) would had been the way I'd work for charging, however im way ahead here in hoping this would be possible as AirBnB doesn't even have a filter to search for these.
That's strange, on my Airbnb app I can filter for EV chargers.Paying was frigging irritating though, even though the Carrefour had a machine on the side it didn't work for me, and even locals were seeking help.
In hindsight having charging facility at the AirBnB (Or if we'd been in a hotel) would had been the way I'd work for charging, however im way ahead here in hoping this would be possible as AirBnB doesn't even have a filter to search for these.
I have a thread running in the travel section of pistonheads talking about rental car equivalents. I thought my latest experience is relevant here.
Rented a BMW X5 and got confirmation of a guaranteed Tesla model Y. That triggered the thread because I didn’t think they are equivalent and I had to drive 250 miles to my destination which is 1 hour drive away from the nearest super charger.
When I got on the shuttle to the Hertz counter I over heard an elderly couple talking. The husband was near tears. He just kept saying how he didn’t know how he could have booked an electric vehicle. The wife was reassuring him saying they would manage. I politely apologized for overhearing their conversation and let them know it was unlikely his mistake. He had probably been bait and switched like I had. That’s when everyone on the shuttle revealed they had all booked petrol cars and received confirmation of EV.
Once we got to the Hertz building it was chaos. 30 groups all complaining that they had been bait and switched. Lots of angry people.
When it was my turn the guy at the desk immediately went into defensive mode. I’m sure he was getting complaints all day long and was just ready for the next customer to complain. I just told him I wanted the car I booked or equivalent. The group was something like prestige elite SUV. Eventually, I said I would deal with the Tesla. That’s when he told me they only had model 3s. “Nope”. Was my response. I will take the XC90 I can see. That’s £85/day extra. The manager gave me an XC60 hybrid in the end.
So, that means my first EV was a total failure as the worst use case for EV is rental. Everyone in the building also had a terrible experience. As I left I saw they had Taycans. If they didn’t have the car in category they should give the Taycan. I would have taken that and dealt with the inconvenience as I’m looking at buying one.
Oh, hertz reported $400M loss in the last quarter due to EVs. They are now forcing them on to people using underhand practices.
Rented a BMW X5 and got confirmation of a guaranteed Tesla model Y. That triggered the thread because I didn’t think they are equivalent and I had to drive 250 miles to my destination which is 1 hour drive away from the nearest super charger.
When I got on the shuttle to the Hertz counter I over heard an elderly couple talking. The husband was near tears. He just kept saying how he didn’t know how he could have booked an electric vehicle. The wife was reassuring him saying they would manage. I politely apologized for overhearing their conversation and let them know it was unlikely his mistake. He had probably been bait and switched like I had. That’s when everyone on the shuttle revealed they had all booked petrol cars and received confirmation of EV.
Once we got to the Hertz building it was chaos. 30 groups all complaining that they had been bait and switched. Lots of angry people.
When it was my turn the guy at the desk immediately went into defensive mode. I’m sure he was getting complaints all day long and was just ready for the next customer to complain. I just told him I wanted the car I booked or equivalent. The group was something like prestige elite SUV. Eventually, I said I would deal with the Tesla. That’s when he told me they only had model 3s. “Nope”. Was my response. I will take the XC90 I can see. That’s £85/day extra. The manager gave me an XC60 hybrid in the end.
So, that means my first EV was a total failure as the worst use case for EV is rental. Everyone in the building also had a terrible experience. As I left I saw they had Taycans. If they didn’t have the car in category they should give the Taycan. I would have taken that and dealt with the inconvenience as I’m looking at buying one.
Oh, hertz reported $400M loss in the last quarter due to EVs. They are now forcing them on to people using underhand practices.
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