B-road attacking coupe in reasonable budget?
Discussion
coldel said:
At the end of the day its a 3.5litre V6 GT car with a naturally aspirated 300bhp that carries a little bit too much weight but for the money it's a very good option.
Continuing on the weight topic, I have been comparing the 350Z to other coupes and sports cars:350Z: 1534 kg, 300hp, 0-100k/h: 5.8s
370Z: 1471 kg, 328hp, 0-100k/h: 5.3s
Mustang Ecoboost (4cyl.) 1655 kg, 317hp 0-100k/h: 5.8s
Hyundai Genesis: 1513 kg , 306hp, 0-100k/h: 6.5s
F-Type V6: 1567 kg, 340hp, 0-100k/h: 5.7s
Audi TT 2.0 : 1260 kg , 200hp, 0-100k/h: 6.6s
RCZ: 1272 kg, 200hp, 0-100k/h: 7.5s
And a totally different type of car just for comparison sake:
Focus RS: 1367 kg, 305hp, 0-100k/h: 5.9s
So how are these cars in comparison to the 350Z? Weights to power is not very different. Only the 370Z and F-type are quicker, but by a hair. Is the F-type at 1567kg perceived as heavy too for example?
coldel said:
I sat as a passenger in the guys car, and to be honest didnt notice over the noise of the XYZ midpipe and decat he had installed. But its all about making marginal gains, 40kgs might only be 3% but then you can look at weight saving all over the car. The standard exhaust and decat will save you another 20kgs if you get something lightweight. Suddenly the car is down at under 1500kgs but all the time you are increasing the Bhp to tonne ratio. And hey go on a diet as well will help haha. The noise in the cabin is more even with the sound proofing than you average car as the rear wheel arches are in the same cabin space as you - its the first thing I noticed when driving mine, sounded like the window was open. But you get used to it.
A remap will add 10-20 bhp depending on mods and start point etc. combine that with weight loss and you suddenly see the car with 300bhp, lighter, two seater RWD front engined V6 doing something pretty cool. Personally I think the car has aged well also in terms of looks, given its a 2002 design.
To be frank, find some local dealers and go drive the cars...you will know then...
Yes. Looking for one at a dealership now. Will test as soon as found. A remap will add 10-20 bhp depending on mods and start point etc. combine that with weight loss and you suddenly see the car with 300bhp, lighter, two seater RWD front engined V6 doing something pretty cool. Personally I think the car has aged well also in terms of looks, given its a 2002 design.
To be frank, find some local dealers and go drive the cars...you will know then...
I know what you mean about cabin noise with the wheels inside. I have had a few cars which were like this.
I agree the styling has aged well. I think it's because it's quite clean.
Your replies are very useful. Your experience with the car shows.
Cutting weight is definitely another way of adding hp. To be honest I think it's even better than adding hp actually.
Where else do you see a chance for weight cutting? What about creature comforts? Electric mirrors, electric seats? I would keep AC and electric windows as well as sat navi though. But wouldn't mind tossing a few less useful and superfluous things out.
DoubleD said:
Are you actually serious about getting a car? Or have the past 8 pages just been you killing time on the internet?
Serious! Can't take any of this FWD and 4x4 only anymore. Been too long. You marry, start a family, get kids and start neglecting your own wants. Time to get a fun car.
coldel said:
The standard seat weigh a tonne, if you get the electric ones etc. UK spec only had two specs, Japanese imports many more variations of the two. Replacing seats for carbon or lightweight would make a massive difference. The Rays I am referring to are these http://motor-stars.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/... the ones you linked are the GT4 special edition wheels. My bad, six spoke also not five!
Don't bother paying a premium for the factory sat nav option, better off getting one with a cubby hole and installing your own tablet - the sat nav is the out of date 'Bird View' which is just terrible. Or just hook your phone up!
If you are interested, sign up to 350z-uk.com loads of knowledge on there, loads of members who will help you through including non-UK ones. Lots of options people have run through from supercharged/turbo conversions, to engine swaps, to mad styling.
OK, thanks for the tip. I will check that forum out.Don't bother paying a premium for the factory sat nav option, better off getting one with a cubby hole and installing your own tablet - the sat nav is the out of date 'Bird View' which is just terrible. Or just hook your phone up!
If you are interested, sign up to 350z-uk.com loads of knowledge on there, loads of members who will help you through including non-UK ones. Lots of options people have run through from supercharged/turbo conversions, to engine swaps, to mad styling.
Sound advice about the sat navi. Thanks.
So I'm guessing the GT wheels are hard to come by? How are they for weight? They are by far my favorites.
About the seats, is it possible to just take the motors etc out and keep the seats? Would that save much weight? I'm not sure I want to go with thin plastic or carbon seats. I like the leather. But definitely don't need electric.
coldel said:
The GT4 wheels (car named after the game!) generally don't leave the cars, as owners like to keep the cars complete. But sometimes they pop up. You can remove the motors I presume, but then you would need some sort of manual replacement to move them. Better off just getting some GT style seats instead?
Ok. If the GT seats are easy to come by then I could. Good weight savings? I guess they are from the prior mentioned GT4 edition? Is a GT4 edition car hard to find or carry a high premium in price over a standard late 350Z?coldel said:
GT4s are a limited run https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/first-drives/... but to be honest the better car is the HR. The GT4 will ask a premium though in name only rather than any noticable advantage.
Ok. I didn't know the GT4 was DE only. I will definitely try to get a HR car. Some things I read about the DE put me off it. Besides, what I like about the GT4 is the wheels. I can probably find something similar aftermarket.
So the GT seats you mentioned aren't GT4? I guess GT is a normal trim?
Found some interesting details about the 350Z made for Europe. Not sure if that includes the UK versions because they are RHD and so maybe they are like the Japanese versions. But in Europe they only offered one trim. The top trim. In the U.S. they had like 5 trims. But here only the top trim. They are all called just 350Z though.
But they all have the top specs as standard. Such as the Brembos, larger wheels, ESP and all the gadgets. For the Brembos I found: "the calipers are made of gold anodized aluminum and fitted as standard in the German variants"
The German versions had some special things:
"In addition, the aerodynamics have been modified. Air ducts on the underbody ensure that the differential on the rear axle had extra cooling by additional cooling fins."
Even a larger water cooler was added to the German versions.
It seems Nissan was really worried about competing as well as they could with all those Porsches. I got all this info from German article.
Also a few interesting things I had no idea about. But this seems to be for the 350Z in general. The drive train is mounted lower for a low center of gravity and the engine is pretty far back. Doesn't seem to be quite front middle engine but more backwards than normal. The center of gravity of the engine is behind the front axle for sure. Because of that it has a 53%-47% weight distribution.
It has some impressive features for a car this age and at this price range too. Carbon fiber prop shaft, the bonnet and most of the components of the suspension are aluminium etc. All ordinary stuff in this type of car today. But didn't expect it in a car which started production in 2003.
It seems Nissan indeed tried to do the best they could for the car.
But they all have the top specs as standard. Such as the Brembos, larger wheels, ESP and all the gadgets. For the Brembos I found: "the calipers are made of gold anodized aluminum and fitted as standard in the German variants"
The German versions had some special things:
"In addition, the aerodynamics have been modified. Air ducts on the underbody ensure that the differential on the rear axle had extra cooling by additional cooling fins."
Even a larger water cooler was added to the German versions.
It seems Nissan was really worried about competing as well as they could with all those Porsches. I got all this info from German article.
Also a few interesting things I had no idea about. But this seems to be for the 350Z in general. The drive train is mounted lower for a low center of gravity and the engine is pretty far back. Doesn't seem to be quite front middle engine but more backwards than normal. The center of gravity of the engine is behind the front axle for sure. Because of that it has a 53%-47% weight distribution.
It has some impressive features for a car this age and at this price range too. Carbon fiber prop shaft, the bonnet and most of the components of the suspension are aluminium etc. All ordinary stuff in this type of car today. But didn't expect it in a car which started production in 2003.
It seems Nissan indeed tried to do the best they could for the car.
Edited by ZackM on Friday 21st September 20:53
Kawasicki said:
I would say the additional aero and cooling work was to cope with sustained high speed on the Autobahn, rather than some competition pressures.
Yes you are right. The brake upgrades as well.My remark about wanting to compete with Porsches was more about the whole car in general. It seems they had their mind in the right places when designing it and put an effort. With things like carbon fiber shaft, aluminium body and suspension parts and all the details.
Herbs said:
Ermmm - that's a Mercedes and he was talking about an Audi TT which looks like
As opposed to
Ermmm - I obviously know that's a Mercedes. There were other photos of the car in the page and one can't miss the huge star logo on the steering wheel. That's an AMG GT.As opposed to
My point is that, apparently the beam across the trunk is not an exclusivity of the 350Z.
P.S. nice wide angle lens shot of the TT trunk. Makes it look bigger. My wife had a TT.
Edited by ZackM on Tuesday 25th September 11:11
Herbs said:
Sorry i'm missing something, the bar in the AMG is right behind the seats and acts like a bulkhead for large items in the boot whereas the 350Z is bang slap in the middle of the boot, whats was the point of your post relating to a TT boot with a picture of a completely different car with a bar in a completely different place?
I had not seen any other cars with a beam across like in the 350Z and then I saw the AMG GT and saw there are others. This was the only point of me pointing it out. And I didn't post anything relating to a TT boot. I quoted him because he was talking about the beam in the 350Z. The TT was just part of the sentence and if I cut it off it would be missing something.It's in a different place, yes. But they serve the same purpose. In the 350Z and in the AMG the bar is there for extra torsional rigidity. This is putting performance over practicability, as it should be in a real sports car. They put it there because they probably thought buyers of a sports car wouldn't mind if it made it slightly more impractical, but gave the car better performance.
I know I don't mind. If I want practicability I buy a minivan.
coldel said:
350z boot is never going to take 3 suitcases, 2 hand bags, and 5 bags of shopping. But I hope you are not expecting to use it on the shopping runs! My wife and I had breaks away in the zed all the time, we drove it across Europe for 5 days and had plenty room in the back for the luggage. You can't get a chest of drawers in there but why would you (saying that a friend of mine in a 350z bought and picked up a folding massage table in one!).
If you need to sling two medium suitcases in along with some other bits and bobs its fine. You also get lots of cubby's all around the car behind the seats etc. When I bought my 19inch wheels with tyres I got them all in the car in one go also ;-)
You are preaching to the choir here. If you need to sling two medium suitcases in along with some other bits and bobs its fine. You also get lots of cubby's all around the car behind the seats etc. When I bought my 19inch wheels with tyres I got them all in the car in one go also ;-)
Like I have been saying, it doesn't bother me at all. It's a GT. A sports car. If I want practicality I would buy a minivan. Or something posing as a sports car such as a TT.
It reminds me of a guy on youtube who had a Ferrari 360 and was trying to transport a flat screen in it, so he strapped it to the roof. He did it for comedic effect and I'm sure the box was actually empty.
But even for comedy it makes no sense. A person who can afford a Ferrari can surely afford a second car or even third. He wouldn't need to pick up a flat screen in the 360. He can actually afford to just have it delivered AND installed. I know he was trying to show how it would be to daily drive a Ferrari as the only car. But who would do that and what would be the point?
Complaining about practicability is a 2 seats sports car is futile. It's like complaining there is too many calories in McDonald's food. The person should just buy a FWD hot hatch then if space is priority. Or better, buy a minivan and have all the space he wants.
Edited by ZackM on Tuesday 25th September 21:38
coldel said:
Ultimately as I say its not as impractical as some pictures taken at an angle might show you, having actually owned one you can easily get two suitcases in there, plenty enough space for most things. If you regularly need more space, you are buying the wrong car.
Even though I'm not really worried about luggage space it's good to hear from people who actually know the car that it's not a big problem. Cheers!To me it always looked adequate for a weekend run. All that it's needed.
coldel said:
The chassis is a multi car chassis I think called the FM chassis and Nissan used it across a number of cars - the same goes for the 370z I believe. It wasn't designed just for the 350z then they got all the way to the end then suddenly discovered it doesn't work -
aka_kerrly said:
Nissan would NOT have sold Skyline 350GTs if by making the car a 4 seater it became a floppy mess.
I totally agree with the above.It's interesting how there is only one person arguing that the brace is an after thought, while multiple people, and people who have actually owned the cars and seem to know way more about Nissan are repeatedly saying it wasn't.
Edited by ZackM on Monday 1st October 09:59
DoubleD said:
I havent said that it is an afterthought, I have said that to me it looks like an afterthought. Big difference.
Anyway how are the test drives going?
Yeah, but you also went on and on, insisting on it, which basically eliminates that difference you are talking about.Anyway how are the test drives going?
Test driving is going well, thank you.
Gassing Station | Car Buying | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff