Where’s the scam here ?

[Rockettvr]

Not sure if I’m in the right forum but here goes, I’ll try to keep it brief
Put the family car up for sale on eBay
Nothing special - £3k family car several others on eBay similar spec etc
A few enquiries- one guy tasks a few questions- wants to know about viewing- we arrange for him to contact me on Friday about viewing at the weekend
In the meantime his partner also contacts me asks a few questions also asks if I’ll take a deposit and hold car till end of month if they decide they want it
I say fine - I’ll give a receipt for deposit but keep car and documents until balance paid
Both of them seem very keen
Friday comes - guy contacts me and says I’ve discussed a deposit and “payments” with his partner - he’ll pay full asking without viewing
I clarify deposit then balance later at agreed date - car and docs stay with me until all paid up
He then says he’s abroad - different from 3 days earlier - still eager to do a deal - deposit sight unseen full asking price
None of it sits right - too eager - paying full price sight unseen, changing story ie he’s coming to view but then he’s abroad etc
Everything is screaming scam but I’m at a loss to see how it works
Ive told him to contact me once he’s home and he can view if it’s still available
Enlighten me please
Thanks

Edited by Rockettvr on Sunday 14th March 22:35

[67Dino]

Sounds like money laundering. He gives you the money then says he’s changed his mind or some sob story why he can’t now buy it and wants the money back.

Gives you details of a different bank account to send it to, or asks for cash. Threatens menaces if you say you want to keep the deposit.

End result, he gets a source of cash from a ‘clean’ bank account that can’t be traced back to his original source for the ‘dirty’ money.

[swisstoni]

I think your approach sounds reasonable whatever the truth is.
Not being in the country does seem to be a feature of buyers who are up to something.

[England87]

Don’t bother with deposits when selling, it simply isn’t worth the hassle any more. I just say turn up, pay and take the car now, no holding no deposits. Much easier.

[av185]

Scam.

Prob they will pay substantial deposit say £2000 with dud cheque then whilst clearing they will say they camnot buy the car for usual sob story/whatever reason and ask for half of it back by Western Union.....so you instantly lose £1000 whilst the cheque bounces.

[stevensdrs]

It's an old scam. They will pay you the full asking price into your bank and because they are abroad will send an agent to collect the car and the documents. As you have the money in your account you give the "agent" the car and the papers. The agent is of course the scammer.
Some time later the money will be reclaimed from your account as it was paid in by fraudulent means from someones hacked account.

Never sell a car to a person you have not seen and ensure that any payment they make is from their own account. If they wont let you check their identity then tell them to do one.

[VSKeith]

It could be that the next contact says that they can't view or collect in person due being abroad for longer than expected and would like the car to be collected by a courier, to deliver to them where they are.

You may then receive an email at around the same time from 'PayPal' saying that you've been paid x, where x is more than the asking price.

The difference is to be paid upfront to the 'courier', possibly via Western Union or similar. There will be no funds of course, but the email might look quite convincing, apart from the url in the full 'from' address. They may embellish further to add a need for urgency in an attempt to distract you from actually checking your PayPal account.

If you have the will and time on your hands, you might like to take the opportunity to waste their time with your own embellishments.

[Rockettvr]

Thanks for the quick replies gentlemen
The ad finished a short while ago and I’ve already been contacted by both the guy and his partner asking if the car sold
I’m guessing at money laundering as going back over my emails he’s very eager to get a deposit to me and then settle up the balance later- I guess at some point between the 2 there would be some form of personal catastrophe befall that would require a refund
I’m going to play along for a bit longer and see how long it is before they give up
Not worth reporting to eBay I guess as I can’t imagine they have the authority to pursue anything??

[Roger Irrelevant]

Is anybody really going to go to this effort and no small amount of risk to launder a poxy 3 grand? OP get the full asking price in cleared funds in your account and you'll be fine. Not everybody is a paranoid PHer who subjects even a shed to an inspection that would be OTT on the space shuttle; they'll just want a cheap car quickly.

[R5_BOY]

Roger Irrelevant said:

Is anybody really going to go to this effort and no small amount of risk to launder a poxy 3 grand? OP get the full asking price in cleared funds in your account and you'll be fine. Not everybody is a paranoid PHer who subjects even a shed to an inspection that would be OTT on the space shuttle; they'll just want a cheap car quickly.

Exactly this. If as above would they not be doing this on a more expensive vehicle ? I know I would be!

[loskie]

depending upon which country they are from 3k may be a lot PLUS 10 folks may fall for a 3k scam one person may not fall for a 30k one. After all like some have confirmed "nobody would waste time to scam £3k would they?"

Well yes they would and do.

[M12MTR]

Avoid this.

As above..... money will be withdrawn and your car gone.

[Thankyou4calling]

If I pay for something on a debit card or by bank transfer it ain’t easy to get the money back.

If you could the entire banking network would collapse.

[Blackpuddin]

Cheap cars are exactly the ones to scam as they are the ones most likely to succeed. One £3k car a week adds up to over £150k a year, a tidy income.

[Sheepshanks]

stevensdrs said:

It's an old scam. They will pay you the full asking price into your bank and because they are abroad will send an agent to collect the car and the documents. As you have the money in your account you give the "agent" the car and the papers. The agent is of course the scammer.
Some time later the money will be reclaimed from your account as it was paid in by fraudulent means from someones hacked account.

Never sell a car to a person you have not seen and ensure that any payment they make is from their own account. If they wont let you check their identity then tell them to do one.

I've never heard of the car being collected before.

Usually the scam is to overpay then ask for a refund of the overpayment. So people saying it wouldn't be done for a few £K are wrong - normally they're hoping to make a few hundred.

[steveo3002]

will be a deposit from some stolen /hacked /dodgy account

then sorry we dont need it , give me 75% back but can it be to the mrs account because the dog died , then somewhere in the future the bank suss out it wasnt your money and snatch back the original deposit

[Wagonwheel555]

Scam or not, taking a deposit makes it more difficult to sell it to someone else if he messes you about further.

No deposit, if you want to buy it come and look at it.

It sounds like a scam of some sort, most likely as someone has said about where he is abroad for longer than he thought blah blah blah, could he pay into your bank and then get someone to collect it.

Move on and if he happens to want to come and look in person, see what happens but don't be taking a deposit off him.

[steveo3002]

yep for sale to whoever can turn up with the payment first

fine if someone want to visit the bank and return next day , take a couple hundred to keep it

[Pixelpeep Z4]

R5_BOY said:

Roger Irrelevant said:

Is anybody really going to go to this effort and no small amount of risk to launder a poxy 3 grand? OP get the full asking price in cleared funds in your account and you'll be fine. Not everybody is a paranoid PHer who subjects even a shed to an inspection that would be OTT on the space shuttle; they'll just want a cheap car quickly.

Exactly this. If as above would they not be doing this on a more expensive vehicle ? I know I would be!

Scammers are clever, they do this for a living! People are generally more careful selling a £50k car than a 3k one, and some wouldn't even bother reporting a 3k scam to the police.

also, you've got to remember how little effort this takes.

It's all about volume


they do this, day in, day out. they may well have a team of 8-10 people in a room, 10 hours a day, 7 days a week.

imagine they each send just 5 emails in a day, on £3k cars...£15,000 a day. x 10 operatives .. £150k a day. Flying under the radar.

Even if they only did 100 days a year, that'd be £15m per year.

Pay your workers £30 a day?

10 laptops from pc world

10 pay as you go phones

a few word templates with random scripts.

job jobbed.

who's in?

[Roger Irrelevant]

Thankyou4calling said:

If I pay for something on a debit card or by bank transfer it ain’t easy to get the money back.

If you could the entire banking network would collapse.

Precisely, so any scam that involves the scammer giving YOU the money in cleared funds first is the most rubbish scam in the world. This question has come up quite a few times before, with plenty of people saying that it's dead easy for funds from a dubious source to be recovered from the account of an innocent party, but when you drill down into the law it's actually really, really difficult. So difficult that a scammer would have to be absolutely mental to rely on doing it for their scam to work.

But if people want to jump at shadows whenever somebody offers to give them money (shock!) upfront (horror!) in exchange for something they've advertised as being for sale (gasp!) then that's up to them.