Can i justify a performance/sportier car?

Can i justify a performance/sportier car?

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Ads22

Original Poster:

314 posts

137 months

Monday 14th June 2021
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RoVoFob said:
There aren’t any rules with buying used cars - it’s not a science. Judging the condition of a car and its price is the only thing that matters. It’s fine if a car needs work - as long as the price reflects that and you put the savings from your budget aside for this. Then there’s no need to worry about ‘big bills’. Going for a higher priced car is no guarantee of quality...so don’t stress about not being able to afford the most expensive 130is out there.

I had around £3k to buy something a few months back. I spent £1,300 on a car that I knew needed work but left the remainder of the budget to cover this. I spent around another £1,300 on tyres, brake pads and discs all around and a few other bits and bobs. In the end I had a car that cost me £2,600 or so that would have cost me well over £3,000 otherwise - had I been able to find any others to choose from.

I am useless when it comes to DIY mechanics, so try to make informed decisions about the cars I buy - gauging the cost of any likely repair cost by pricing up parts and fitting on Euro Car Parts is one easy way. Or you could phone a BMW specialist in your area and get quotes for all the main jobs - they’ll be much cheaper than a BMW main dealer, which will charge ‘premium’ rates - just as a Ford or Honda dealer will. A quick Google and reading some reviews should help you find a half-decent one. I knew exactly how much the brakes, tyres and fitting would cost before I bought that car and knew that the overall cost of the car, parts and fitting was still good. You can do exactly the same.

If you really want to feel safe buying a 130i, you can price up all the potential pricey jobs on specific cars (water pump, suspension, a set of brake pads and discs, a set of tyres etc.) and add the applicable ones to the cost of each car you’re considering to get to get total likely cost and use those to see which car is the most affordable/appealing for you.

If you have £7,000 to spend and you think a £6,500 130i is likely to need £1,000 of imminent work, that could be a risky purchase for you - especially if you’ll be stressed about spending nearly all of your budget and having potential further costs. Meanwhile, you may find a £4,500 130i that needs £2,000 worth of work, which would still be in budget. Remember you can always haggle, too.

Of the last three cars I bought, one was up for £6,500 and I paid £5,850, another was advertised at £1,500 (dropped from £1,700) and I paid £1,300 and the third up for £2,995 and I paid £2,700 (despite the ad pretty much saying ‘the price is the price, if you don’t want to pay it, go away and find another one’. In each case I’ve raised issues with the car with the seller and said that with those issues in mind, I felt the car was worth £x,xxx. If a seller knows you’re serious and will give them an easy sale, it’s likely they’ll move on the price.

No one can tell you whether you’re over your head, as that depends on your financial situation. If £7,000 is all the money in the world that you have, and/or you’re not able to save much every month and/or your job isn’t very secure, I personally would spend a lot less on a car. If, however, you have £7,000 set aside for a car, a few savings pots for other things, a secure job and/or can save a few hundred pounds every month, then I’d see no reason to worry. As long as you don’t go to a main dealer for everything, there’s no inherent reason that a ‘premium’ BMW should cost more than a ‘non-premium’ Ford or Mazda. It’s not as if all Fords/VWs/Mazdas/Hondas are inherently reliable and cheap to run.

You talk about ‘too good for me’ and whether you ‘need 265hp’, as if you don’t deserve a 130i. If you’ve done some of the checks above and are prepared, you absolutely do deserve a 130i or any other affordable car that appeals. I don’t need 265hp, but I bought my 130i because I wanted it and could afford it. Simple.

Sorry for the essay, but there are ways to address all of your concerns and it sounds like you’ll feel more confident if you have answers to these.
Sound advice here again. Id say id probably feel comfortable finding quotes for all the big refresh jobs on these but am hoping to obtain an example with a lot already done as they are of that age now. Financially id say im in a good position and I usually do stash away a ‘uh oh!’ fund incase anything goes wrong on any car ive owned. Id say my only reservation is that these cars ‘being a bmw’ are certainly more complex than others cars ive looked at given theres more points of failure for things like vanos, waterpumps etc despite being reliable still, and given id use it for work i cant really have my car off the road too long potentially. Id also like to stash away in savings for a deposit as living on the fringes of outer london is notoriously expensive to buy.

Excuse the long post, on another note - interestingly enough my friend who owns an FN2 allowed me to have a go to settle the score as i do really like both cars. Id say its made the decision harder but ive summed up the positive and negatives of both cars below!

130i
Pros

Lovely engine!
Comfortable
RWD and better handling, steering feel
5 doors (mostly)
Better build quality
More subtle
Slightly better ride (still firm)
Engine note
Rare

Cons

Potentially more expensive repairs
Wont be able to use much of its performance but has more torque
More complex engine
Not quite as nice to look at (But i love LM blue!)
Usually older
Have always been advised to stay away from old bmws however lots of reports and owners advising these are reliable
Gear change and clutch not as nice

Type R FN2

Pros

Vtec engine also great! (Not as versatile)
Lovely noise in vtec
Looks better (in my eyes at least)
Big boot
Very reliable (more or less bulletproof engine)
Nice speedo display
Very good gear change!
More to choose from (less travelling to find one)

Cons

Driving position not as good as you sit higher
Seats arent as adjustable
Doesnt feel as sturdy
Crap paint
Ride quality! (However more composed than stock civic)
Harder work to drive around town
3 door
Suspension and handling not as good (would need alignment, new shocks and possibly alloys to improve it)

So there we go. Just need to make my mind up and stop flipping between the two. I am still swaying towards the 130i but conscious of day to day use im strongly considering both still. Id say there are definitely better examples of 1 series though for their age as civics tend to wear easier. At the moment im looking at what appears best at that time for sale.



Edited by Ads22 on Monday 14th June 14:28


Edited by Ads22 on Monday 14th June 14:30

Ads22

Original Poster:

314 posts

137 months

Tuesday 15th June 2021
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Obee72 said:
Forgot to ask but OP have you test driven either yet ?
Indeed i have. A few examples of both. The FN2 was some time ago so had a go in my friends modified one.

Its interesting to see others who have considered both. Really what seens to swing it to 130i for most people is the overall quality, interior and that engine. And most seem to end up going for the 130i. If i wasnt such a Honda fan boy id be quicker to discount the Civic but having had Hondas in the family for years its hard to criticise their reliability and engineering. Just a shame the overall drive is lacking and suspension always seems to come up as an issue. Annoyingly im well and truly priced out of their great stuff (Integra in particular and Prelude is very rare now) - Not a fan of the EP3 unfortunately but they actually are a pretty good car.

Was tempted as a halfway compromise with the Focus ST of same sort of age but they are incredibly thirsty, usually modified to hell now and then the added complexity of turbos.

One thing for sure is the 130i does seem quite a bit more grown up and more subtle in comparison- as no one would really suspect its a bona fide sports car underneath.

Ads22

Original Poster:

314 posts

137 months

Tuesday 15th June 2021
quotequote all
TameRacingDriver said:
I'm not sure I'd say a 130i was a bona fide sports car tbh, not even underneath. It's just a hatchback with RWD at the end of the day. You keep mentioning the poor suspension on the civic but I'd be highly surprised if the 130 was any better, as they're not known for their handling prowess (RWD does not necessarily a good car make), you would probably want to get the birds suspension for it to bring it up to the standard you seem to think it will be out of the box. My FN2 was standard and the handling wasn't that bad in all honesty, maybe a bit harsh in the ride but not exactly terrible.

Are you not considering a Z4 coupe also? That is more of a sports car, and if you can get away with 2 seats it's just so much nicer, though they are also more expensive sadly otherwise it would be a no brainer.
I wouldn't say the Civics is substantially worse but the BMW has more compliant suspension and I think is a bit more confidence inspiring even in normal driving, possibly also because you sit lower in it too. In general I just think the 130 felt closer to a proper sports car than the Civic which definitely feels more hot hatch-esque
Theres really not a lot in it though, that's why its such a close call. Just wish I could settle on one car without thinking id miss out if I didn't get the other but can't have everything I guess.

And yes I do like the Z4 coupe very much, and im sure it would be a better option but I do need some level of practicality unfortunately. Im sure its better than both the other cars however they are a fair Bit more expensive.

Ads22

Original Poster:

314 posts

137 months

Tuesday 15th June 2021
quotequote all
hucumber said:
'Can I justify a performance/sportier car?' -


Yes.
Correct answer! wink

The question is which one!….

Ads22

Original Poster:

314 posts

137 months

Tuesday 15th June 2021
quotequote all
Obee72 said:
Yeah I discounted the Focus ST as couldn't find an un-abused one.

My 130i had Bilstein dampers and Eibach springs and handling was good. The owner after me turned it into a weapon with M3 mods and it looked fantastic.

Sounds like you're familiar with Honda's so why take a punt on the 130i and see how it goes ? Worse case scenario, you'll sell for same as you bought and get an FN2.
Yes very difficult to find one without loads of mods and unfortunately theyre not tasteful mods. And the sad thing is the Fiesta ST is going the same way. After seeing how a lot of STs are driven and treated its really put me off them. I actually used to have one myself shortly after it came out, but always sensed once it came down in price itd soon reach McDonalds car parks along with the ST Lines frown

Going to weigh up my options with the BM and the Honda but the positive response for the 130s has been overwhelming! Annoyingly my desired requirements is always shifting, one minute i want something a bit over the top looking and raw like the Civic then next minute something understated but a bit more refined/ sleeperish like the 1 series……..i dont think the word indecisive even cuts it!

Ads22

Original Poster:

314 posts

137 months

Thursday 17th June 2021
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RoVoFob said:
You’re torn between a six-pot BMW and a high revving front-wheel drive Japanese car, so why not get a BMW 325ti AND a Toyota Celica 190:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/124755016641?hash=item1...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202105202...
Would love a 2 car setup and is something ive debated but not overly enthusiastic about double the running costs, mot insurance and also parking. If i was in a position to though i would without a doubt choose an MX5, i am starting to miss mine quite a bit. I do like the look of those 325 though! Rover-esque front end aside. Frustratingly the Celica does a lot of what im after but for some reason they do nothing for me.

And thanks for the JayEmm link Obee, is a good channel for 130 related stuff as he used to own one. Hes just released and interesting video comparing the hydraulic and electric steering on that model and concluded the hpas is not worth fretting over too much if you prefer the lci cars.

Ads22

Original Poster:

314 posts

137 months

Thursday 17th June 2021
quotequote all
s m said:
The Lotus Handling guy did quite like the 190


Oh no dont tell me that! laugh Cant be doing with more options im struggling as it is!

Ads22

Original Poster:

314 posts

137 months

Saturday 11th September 2021
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Thought why not revive this thread since it has turned into a bit of a saga but went for a E82 125i in the end after mulling over so many different cars. Was pretty set on the N52 powered 1 series but fell for the coupes looks over the hatch. It did take some time to find something in decent condition and car prices are really climbing at the moment.

Was a nice Water blue one which seems to be an unusual colour. The market had loads of black ones i found but is still a rare car.

Very nearly decided to push budget and go for a z4 coupe but would have been right at bottom end of market. Hopefully i stick with my decision this time!



Ads22

Original Poster:

314 posts

137 months

Sunday 12th September 2021
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s m said:
Nice choice - they can sound really nice with a performance exhaust on

E46 330 performance and feel a bit more nimble to me as lighter - plus you can wake them up to 130i levels of go too


That exhaust sounds amazing! Supposedly very rare now!