EVs... no one wants them!

[RayDonovan]

barryrs said:

£135k is RS money, with used stock at £90k plus £75k seems pretty low ball.

Not really. I'm a declining market, you'd want a minimum of £10k across the car - especially something like a E-tron where the used market is still trying to find its feet..

[Merc 450]

Looks like we won't have to bother with electric crappy cars in my lifetime the EU are saying they won't ban new diesel and petrol cars until 2035. I hate the EU but that's a great result

[Fastdruid]

lord trumpton said:

Friend of a friend - has an18 month old Audi etron gt with 6k miles. Paid iro 135k

Went to look at chopping it in today and was less than delighted to be offered 75k in px

THats a 65k loss over 6 k miles.

Feck that!!

£10.83/mile

Still, look on the plus side, thank goodness he didn't get an ICE and have to pay 10p/mile more in "fuel"!

[Macron]

Discombobulate said:

lord trumpton said:

Friend of a friend - has an18 month old Audi etron gt with 6k miles. Paid iro 135k

Went to look at chopping it in today and was less than delighted to be offered 75k in px

THats a 65k loss over 6 k miles.

Feck that!!

To be fair, that sort of loss will be familiar to many top end ICE BMW, Mercedes / AMG / Aston etc buyers. Eye watering.

But, the 135k list won't be what most people will have been used to paying pre Covid. The usual deposit contributions, inflated px, blah blah. List was one thing. During daft covid season it was the only thing.

The "25% loss when you leave the forecourt" is irrelevant if you've paid 25% less than list.

[EVOTECH3BELL]

ChocolateFrog said:

Discombobulate said:

lord trumpton said:

Friend of a friend - has an18 month old Audi etron gt with 6k miles. Paid iro 135k

Went to look at chopping it in today and was less than delighted to be offered 75k in px

THats a 65k loss over 6 k miles.

Feck that!!

To be fair, that sort of loss will be familiar to many top end ICE BMW, Mercedes / AMG / Aston etc buyers. Eye watering.

11 quid a mile in depreciation alone.

Some people really do have too much money.

Ouch

[captain.scarlet]

Merc 450 said:

Looks like we won't have to bother with electric crappy cars in my lifetime the EU are saying they won't ban new diesel and petrol cars until 2035. I hate the EU but that's a great result

It will certainly be interesting to see what becomes of e-fuels, but we're not in the EU: at times (without wishing this thread to get derailed), the former PM David Cameron said at the time that if the UK left the EU then it would be akin to the UK looking in from outside and being unable to have any say in any matters that would still affect the UK.

If suatainable e-fuels and conventional ICEs that can yield zero emissions are not ready in time, the UK will still have to plough on with EVs and a ban on ICEs (even if temporarily) whilst the EU enjoys a grace period.

[ruggedscotty]

stay of execution.....

but...

efuel, still not emission free - could be net zero but not emission free at point of use...

so..

fuel tax

clean air tax

cost of fuel

pay per mile road use...

might not be illegal but cost prohibitive to 95% of population.

And the masses wont like you using efuel. you will be seen as a climate rapist.


so in all but law not that great to use.

[lord trumpton]

Can our regular cars of today run off efuel?

Or will you need to buy an efuel engined vehicle?

Also with efuel is there a petrol and derv version or is it a stand alone 3rd type fuel?

[500TORQUES]

lord trumpton said:

Can our regular cars of today run off efuel?

Or will you need to buy an efuel engined vehicle?

Also with efuel is there a petrol and derv version or is it a stand alone 3rd type fuel?

The whole idea behind efuel is that it is a drop in product for a petrol ICE.

[silent ninja]

Synthetic fuels sound like total nonsense to me. You can't create energy out of nothing. Synthetically making something sounds like a recipe that will require net input of energy that will have to come from somewhere - renewables? What about the input materials? Then you have the problem of scaling to global levels. So it has to be a relatively simple and cheap process.

Given oil is one of the densest energy liquids in the world, I just don't see how the maths adds up.

Sounds like fantasy to me.

[Mammasaid]

500TORQUES said:

lord trumpton said:

Can our regular cars of today run off efuel?

Or will you need to buy an efuel engined vehicle?

Also with efuel is there a petrol and derv version or is it a stand alone 3rd type fuel?

The whole idea behind efuel is that it is a drop in product for a petrol ICE.

You'll have to buy a dedicated e-fuel vehicle, that won't be allowed to be run on regular dino juice, and I'd be surprised if e-fuels come in at under £10/litre.

However, this is all academic, as UK will be BEV only for new cars after 2035.

[500TORQUES]

Mammasaid said:

You'll have to buy a dedicated e-fuel vehicle, that won't be allowed to be run on regular dino juice, and I'd be surprised if e-fuels come in at under £10/litre.

However, this is all academic, as UK will be BEV only for new cars after 2035.

Why?

Efuel will be a drop in product for ICE.

Put aside the assertion its not a mass market viable product. Why wouldn't you use Efuel in a current ICE?

[Mammasaid]

500TORQUES said:

Mammasaid said:

You'll have to buy a dedicated e-fuel vehicle, that won't be allowed to be run on regular dino juice, and I'd be surprised if e-fuels come in at under £10/litre.

However, this is all academic, as UK will be BEV only for new cars after 2035.

Why?

Efuel will be a drop in product for ICE.

Put aside the assertion its not a mass market viable product. Why wouldn't you use Efuel in a current ICE?

I presume you haven't read this article then?

https://www.pistonheads.com/news/general-pistonhea...

[500TORQUES]

Mammasaid said:

500TORQUES said:

Mammasaid said:

You'll have to buy a dedicated e-fuel vehicle, that won't be allowed to be run on regular dino juice, and I'd be surprised if e-fuels come in at under £10/litre.

However, this is all academic, as UK will be BEV only for new cars after 2035.

Why?

Efuel will be a drop in product for ICE.

Put aside the assertion its not a mass market viable product. Why wouldn't you use Efuel in a current ICE?

I presume you haven't read this article then?

https://www.pistonheads.com/news/general-pistonhea...

I did.

That doesn't mean you cant use Efuel in a current ICE, it's suggesting a new ICE can't use conventional fuel.

[Mammasaid]

500TORQUES said:

Mammasaid said:

500TORQUES said:

Mammasaid said:

You'll have to buy a dedicated e-fuel vehicle, that won't be allowed to be run on regular dino juice, and I'd be surprised if e-fuels come in at under £10/litre.

However, this is all academic, as UK will be BEV only for new cars after 2035.

Why?

Efuel will be a drop in product for ICE.

Put aside the assertion its not a mass market viable product. Why wouldn't you use Efuel in a current ICE?

I presume you haven't read this article then?

https://www.pistonheads.com/news/general-pistonhea...

I did.

That doesn't mean you cant use Efuel in a current ICE, it's suggesting a new ICE can't use conventional fuel.

Correct, so you can keep your ICE vehicle as long as you want and keep refilling with fuel, either fossil or e-fuels (if you're rich enough).

However Germany's extracted an exemption for ICE vehicles that will allow them to be sold after 2035 in the EY (not the UK) as long as they are efuel only.

[500TORQUES]

Mammasaid said:

500TORQUES said:

Mammasaid said:

500TORQUES said:

Mammasaid said:

You'll have to buy a dedicated e-fuel vehicle, that won't be allowed to be run on regular dino juice, and I'd be surprised if e-fuels come in at under £10/litre.

However, this is all academic, as UK will be BEV only for new cars after 2035.

Why?

Efuel will be a drop in product for ICE.

Put aside the assertion its not a mass market viable product. Why wouldn't you use Efuel in a current ICE?

I presume you haven't read this article then?

https://www.pistonheads.com/news/general-pistonhea...

I did.

That doesn't mean you cant use Efuel in a current ICE, it's suggesting a new ICE can't use conventional fuel.

Correct, so you can keep your ICE vehicle as long as you want and keep refilling with fuel, either fossil or e-fuels (if you're rich enough).

However Germany's extracted an exemption for ICE vehicles that will allow them to be sold after 2035 in the EY (not the UK) as long as they are efuel only.

I know. You made an incorrect statement. You dont need to buy a dedicated Efuels car to use it.

[Macron]

TRKid said:

Yeah. I decided to buy mine from vwfs. £13.3k, 69 plate, 31k miles. It still has 5yrs of battery warranty left so I think it’ll still be worth at least £8k in 3 years. It would put the rough cost at £150pcm over three years.

Servicing is £100 every two years or 20k miles. I’ve averaged 3.9mi/kwh long term. Range averages around 125 miles. Not great, but fine for most commutes.

This does sound like a very sensible buy. You know your use case works, and the price sounds like you've got some meat on the bone to weather any continued storm.

[Little Lofty]

barryrs said:

WyrleyD said:

Personally I don't think I'll be able to have an electric car in my lifetime, reason being no parking anywhere near the house (terraced on a walkway with nearest parking about 100m away). I do like to read about them and hear about how people are getting on with them, I did come across some videos on Youtube by a guy called The MacMaster who seems to mainly review junk food, he must be doing OK though as he leased a new Taycan and he seems to dislike the concept of the electric car and is going back to petrol 911 as soon as he can. His first service cost something like £1500 which was £750 for the "service" and £750 for two rear tyres (this was at Porsche Leeds), anyway they are worth a watch.

Not sure what he has to complain about?

£750 for a service at a dealer that probably charges £150 per hour labour seems about right and the Michelin Pilot Sport 4 SUV's on my EQC are £375 each fitted.

I was pi**ed off when Citroën charged me £110 to ‘service’ my electric van. Considering there is very little to service on an EV I’d be raging at £750.

[Jaguar99]

Little Lofty said:

barryrs said:

WyrleyD said:

Personally I don't think I'll be able to have an electric car in my lifetime, reason being no parking anywhere near the house (terraced on a walkway with nearest parking about 100m away). I do like to read about them and hear about how people are getting on with them, I did come across some videos on Youtube by a guy called The MacMaster who seems to mainly review junk food, he must be doing OK though as he leased a new Taycan and he seems to dislike the concept of the electric car and is going back to petrol 911 as soon as he can. His first service cost something like £1500 which was £750 for the "service" and £750 for two rear tyres (this was at Porsche Leeds), anyway they are worth a watch.

Not sure what he has to complain about?

£750 for a service at a dealer that probably charges £150 per hour labour seems about right and the Michelin Pilot Sport 4 SUV's on my EQC are £375 each fitted.

I was pi**ed off when Citroën charged me £110 to ‘service’ my electric van. Considering there is very little to service on an EV I’d be raging at £750.

Even at £150 per hour, what are they spending all those hours actually servicing/checking? We already established they checked the tyres. Brakes unlikely to be very worn on an EV. Washer fluid and wiper blades? Body corrosion check? Software updates? Doesn’t sound like many hours work to me.

[barryrs]

A pollen filter and fitting is probably £100 at a Porsche main dealer.

Technician scratching his balls is probably another £50.

Premium brand charges premium prices; shocking!