Replacing a BMW M535d - can't even get to a short list

[skoff]

For most of my life choosing my next car has been easy, I've mostly been able to assemble a pretty short list. This time I’m having sooo much difficulty deciding. I’m hoping for some advice, encouragement, real world experiences, or even ridicule (as is the PH way).

I’m no tyre kicker and cars for sale of the type(s) I’m looking for are fairly thin on the ground round my way, so it’s not just a case of test drive loads – I need to narrow it down a bit before I start travelling round.

Budget is a flexible (either way) £25k - which doesn't get you what it used too!

It needs to be -

• Petrol,
• RWD,
• Fun but can also daily drive.
• No SUVs / off road things (just not my cup of tea).
• 4 seats and prefer 4/5 doors.
• I need to be able to get my bicycle in the back (it fits in the boot of my 5 series) I’m ok with putting the rear seats down to do that.
• I couldn’t really care less about VED or economy (to a point, let’s say 20mpg as a minimum).
• I can afford to maintain my cars well and don’t mind performance car maintenance costs (again within reason – regular £5K bills would not be welcome) – and critically I don’t want to be left at the side of the road, so nothing too highly strung or fragile.
• I do about 10k miles per year, mostly for work

I’ve liked the BMWs I’ve owned and I’ve got a bit of an M-car itch, but the only M-car I’ve driven was a convertible E36 M3 with horrible scuttle shake (which I hated) so IMHO doesn’t really count. Will an M-car disappoint me?

I live in NE Scotland, so nice driving roads up here are often spoilt by poor maintenance, a decent ride would be appreciated – though my 5 series is hardly a magic carpet, so not a deal breaker.

My car history includes an Elise, Cerbera, Evo6, Lexus GS300, E39 touring, some 90’s hot-hatches, a few fast Fords, and a collection of other mundane or older stuff.

Current cars are - 2010 BMW M535d and Vauxhaull Monaro CV8. I’ve done a fair few miles in the BMW and whilst it’s a very capable and fun car to drive, it’s time to move it on. Being honest I’m really tired of the diesel noise. The Monaro is staying (99% sure on that) – it is my access to analogue driving, and I keep it nice for sunny days and holidays.

This is my list –

BMW M140i – This is the current front runner – I like that it’s fairly anonymous. However, will it be feel low-rent coming from a fairly well-specced 5 series? They are also favoured by the modification brigade –bad mods can mean poor reliability. I’ve nothing against those who modify (I did it to my 3 Cosworths years ago), but this is my daily so would prefer less risk and have it standard.

Merc A45 – faster than the 140i, but is it as fun to drive? I’m not bothered about traffic light GP or bragging rights.

BMW M5 (F10) – too similar to what I have perhaps? Will I be able to exploit the extra performance? Is it too fragile?

BMW M4 (F82) – top of the budget – I’d prefer a M3 for the practicality but they are at quite a significant premium it seems. Are they worth the extra over the 140i? Also modification worries for these too.

Alfa Quadrofoglio – would absolutely love one of these (this is my ‘heart car’), but far too expensive (at the moment).

Merc C63 or C43 – too similar to the Monaro? A bit of a one trick pony? Quite expensive for what they offer to me.

Merc E63 Bi-turbo – on paper my ideal car (esp in estate form) – but are these on a different level running cost-wise? Will also be a high miler at my budget. Also ‘on paper’ doesn’t translate into ‘want’ – I don’t really know why, but I’m finding it hard to be excited by an E-class. An E350d was the main competitor to my current 5 series and I didn’t find the choice a hard one to make at the time.

Early Porsche Panamera – left-field choice – ruinously expensive to run? Practical enough? Only been in older Porsches so not sure what to expect. Bit of a mid-life crisis car? Maybe I am actually having a mid-life crisis.

Something VAG? Never really been a fan. Good cars, but those that I have driven have been a bit lacking in soul, plus mostly FWD and “understeery” which is not to my taste.

Fiesta ST (or similar lower cost hatch) – Does this equal 70% of the fun of the more expensive cars for 30% or the cost? Not sure I could bring myself to actually do it, and people may laugh at a 52 year old in a teenager car, but I’m open to persuasion.

[ZX10R NIN]

My pick would be the Maserati Ghibli S it's a good steer & fits your criteria:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202301032...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202304116...

You'll get a nice facelift 330 for your budget:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202304025...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202303305...

I'm bias but the 6.2 C63 is an option I'd take a look at but I'd budget to get a LSD fitted, they transform the way they put the power down:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202304025...

Saloon wise the XF S 380 is also worth shortlisting they're a good steer & ride:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202303185...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202304136...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202304186...

[skoff]

Yes, I like the Maserati idea... Might find looking after it a bit challenging as my nearest dealer is a few hours drive. But definitely added to the list. Thanks

[alock]

skoff said:

Fiesta ST (or similar lower cost hatch) – Does this equal 70% of the fun of the more expensive cars for 30% or the cost? Not sure I could bring myself to actually do it, and people may laugh at a 52 year old in a teenager car, but I’m open to persuasion.

I would argue this would be more fun more of the time. The reason to reject it is because you want something more grown up and hence something more dull most of the time.

I would of thought that by 52 you're past caring what other people think of you.

[Francis2020]

Fiesta ST £ for £ are hard to beat...as per above.
Who cares what others think

[Terzo123]

I used to have a Monaro VXR, now have a C63. The Merc is in a different league performance wise.

[ChrisH72]

alock said:

skoff said:

Fiesta ST (or similar lower cost hatch) – Does this equal 70% of the fun of the more expensive cars for 30% or the cost? Not sure I could bring myself to actually do it, and people may laugh at a 52 year old in a teenager car, but I’m open to persuasion.

I would argue this would be more fun more of the time. The reason to reject it is because you want something more grown up and hence something more dull most of the time.

I would of thought that by 52 you're past caring what other people think of you.

I'm 51 next week and have a mk7 ST3. Nobody cares, I guarantee it.

[njj850]

Lexus GSF

Or something different, Mégane 280

Edited by njj850 on Saturday 13th May 20:05

[ScoobyChris]

I have an M140i that I run as a daily and I am always amazed that it costs buttons to run, given the performance, and is docile enough that my wife (who has no interest in cars) can drive it to the shops. It also goes under the radar and can be parked anywhere without drawing any attention.

Sure the M-cars have sharper handling, but I think they are more compromised as a daily with firmer ride and higher upfront and running costs and tbh the performance isn’t significantly greater.

Mine was bought new and I went a bit berserk with the options so may bias my opinion!

Chris

[ScoobyChris]

Francis2020 said:

Fiesta ST £ for £ are hard to beat...as per above.
Who cares what others think

For me, the ride on these is too firm for a daily driver! Maybe I am getting old

Chris

[BigChungus]

I have an M140i that I’ll be selling shortly (DM me if interested), it’s so much car for the money. Running costs really aren’t too bad either. Considered an M4 for ages, but the M-Lite is so close and does everything I want it to.

[nordboy]

If you’re a bit concerned about the ST Fiesta image at 52, then I can assure you, you need to stay away from the A45. I got rid of mine (i’m also 52) in the end, the constant pops and bangs was fun to start with, but soon wore thin. They are quick and handle ok, just ok though. Harsh ride.

I sold it to a dealer, then immediately bought a petrol Jag XFS. 3.0 litre supercharged v6, have to say, It’s the first time in many years that i’m not even considering a replacement, it’s a lovely place to be when gliding around, but press all the giggle buttons and it’s pretty amazing how quick and effortlessly it can cover ground for a big car. Down side is the mpg, but tbh, there’s not much more to put on the downside list.

I had the same budget as you and got a sub 30k miles, 66 reg car for that, from a main dealer as well.

[skoff]

Seems to be a lot of love for the Fiesta which is interesting, I do like a fast ford and I hear lots of good things about the Fiesta in particular, any owner I've ever spoken to has plenty of praise for them. It's certainly a frugal option. Has anybody swapped out a larger saloon for one who would care to share experiences? I'm all over Scotland visitng various whisky distileries in remote locations for my job, so I need some level of comfort, how are they day to day?

My tongue was firmly in my cheek when I mentioned people laughing, it really isn't a factor - I'm a 52 year old guy that goes full-on MAMIL on my bike so people laughing is something I'm used too.

@Terzo123 - no argument about your C63 comparison to the Monaro (and mines not a VXR either so even less power) - though I wasn't really talking about outright performance - it's more about the way it makes you feel driving it. The C63 is clearly a different league of car, but I just wonder if it would just feel like the Monaro on steroids? I've not driven one, so have no frame of reference. The Monaro was the car that replaced my Cerbera, and whilst the Cerbera was much, much faster - it made me feel similar - just without the bills, and the feeling the thing was constantly plotting to kill me. I'm by no means ruling the C63 out - far from it - there's a 2010 estate up for sale near me that I'm considering taking a look at - but it's a 2010 car up for 21K - and I don't think it's got the LSD, which as ZX10R says is a desirable thing to have and would add to the price. Are they really that good?

Thanks for those suggestions Njj850 - not thought about the Megane and know nothing about them, so will take a look - are you an owner? I kind of feel I've done the Lexus thing - my GS was a truly fantasic car, I put over 150K on that car and it just kept on going - I just feel like I've got the Lexus t-shirt now.

I think my list is getting longer, not shorter - anybody want to trash talk any of the cars on my list to put me off?

[skoff]

@ScoobyChris - That's insightful - thanks for posting - Options seem to greatly affect the second hand values on the M140i - and I guess that's partly my concern - lots of things I take for granted in my 5 can be rare options in the 1 series and as it's a car with the same DNA that might bother me, whereas if I moved to a different manufacturer it would be easier to adapt IYSWIM? Good to hear they are inexpensive to run though - the 5 sure isn't a cheap car to keep in good order. Does yours have the adaptive suspension? - I read it's a real game changer where ride comfort is concerned. I'm on non-adaptive M-suspension in my 5 and it's pretty harsh on Scottish roads - not that it bothers me all that much to be honest, but the Monaro is far smoother.

@Bigchungus (great forum handle btw) - thanks, probably not buying for a while (and need to decide what first!) - but happy to hear about your car in case the planets align... I've bought from fellow PHers in the past and it's always a preference to keep it in the family.

@nordboy The A45, esp with the aero kit sure is an extrovert's choice. If it's a good steer though, I honestly don't mind, but there is a lot to be said for stealth. I've been in a couple of Jag XF - albeit diesel variants - nice cars. How's it been reliability-wise? A friend of mine spent a fair bit of time in the Jag dealership - but I've no idea how the petrol engines fair in that respect.

[ScoobyChris]

I specced adaptive suspension. Compared to the passively sprung car, I think Comfort is more compliant and Sport is firmer. Mine stays in Comfort most of the time and while it’s not Rolls-Royce magic carpet ride smooth, it’s comfortable enough for an old man in a daily driver.

Chris

[ChrisH72]

I went from a BMW 3 series coupe to the mk7 ST.

Completely different cars to be honest. The Beemer was quiet, comfortable and had a silky smooth straight 6. Unfortunately it wasn't the most reliable and maintenance costs were a pain. The Fiesta is far more fun to drive and its size and weight make it feel much faster. Its a joy. But yes the ride is firm and interior quality isn't in the same league as BMW. Its much cheaper to run though.

For me, the Fiesta is a good fit as I only do around 4k miles a year and rarely more than 10 miles at a time.

With your budget it'd be the mk8 which is said to be a bit more mature and a better daily than the mk7. I think the problem is they're not as exciting as the mk7 and I don't think they represent great value at the moment. With a budget of 25k I think you could find something more suited to your needs in all honesty.

[ChrisH72]

Just to add, if you are prepared to sacrifice RWD I think a larger hot hatch would be a better fit for you.

FK8 Civic type r
I30N
Megane rs280
Focus ST 2.3

They have 5 doors and will take your bike easily. Also great fun to drive and shouldn't be expensive to run.

If it has to be RWD then I'd say you're on the right lines with an M140i. But rivals are said to be more fun so I'd definitely be checking them out.

[nordboy]

skoff said:

@nordboy The A45, esp with the aero kit sure is an extrovert's choice. If it's a good steer though, I honestly don't mind, but there is a lot to be said for stealth. I've been in a couple of Jag XF - albeit diesel variants - nice cars. How's it been reliability-wise? A friend of mine spent a fair bit of time in the Jag dealership - but I've no idea how the petrol engines fair in that respect.

Mine had the aero kit. I honestly was disappointed with the performance of the A45. Yes it was quick but the gearbox is st, once moving it's ok, but gets bogged down a lot, when you don't want it too. I couldn't live with it in the end, too many compromises.

I've had zero issues with my XFS. I've had 3 XF's over many years, the 2.7d and the 3.0 diesel XFS, no issues with any of them. The diesel XFS was nice, but some do report issues with the DPF's if you're not putting the miles in, and I wasn't. Performance wise, my current supercharged petrol is by far the best of the three. I'm far more comfortable pushing the XFS than the A45, and would hazard a guess that only on narrower roads would the A45 be quicker. And then I have the benefit of a luxury car if I want it. The A45 was far from that. Outstanding performance for a larger car, sounds great when the supercharger spools up as well.

The 2.0d JLR ingenium engine is the cause of a load of XF issues, but I'm pretty sure the 3.0 petrol is regarded as one of the better, most reliable engines.

I'm a bit of a BMW fanboy as well, and don't feel at all short changed in the XFS. I previously had a brand new 2020 540i msport tourer, and the Jag is more than a capable replacement.

[ZX10R NIN]

skoff said:

Yes, I like the Maserati idea... Might find looking after it a bit challenging as my nearest dealer is a few hours drive. But definitely added to the list. Thanks

There's a Maserati specialist in Nairn that a client I supplied a GT to & they're happy with their service.

[Belle427]

Watched a you tube video last night where a 440i was given some love ie nice suspension and a tune, may not have enough space for you though.