Secondhand car price crash? (Vol. 2)

[Theoldguard]

Deep Thought said:

I think while some of us may conclude that leaving scuffs and dings unfixed and anything above basic maintenance not done as "not being able to afford to", i think outside of this car enthusiasts forum in the real world most people just dont care about their cars enough to spend anything but the bare minimum.

I looked at my neices Qashqai yesterday - corroded and badly scuffed alloys, parking dings, bumper scuffs, etc. I'm sure it gets the bare minium of servicing only and any repairs will be done only when something lights up on the dash to tell them. They're not short of a few bob but i dont think it occurs to them to resolve any of it, they're just not car enthusiasts and dont care. Its a means to get them and their kids from A to B.

One of my nephews has a quite a fresh looking Audi A4. Hes all over place as hes a Councillor and the car. I'm sure theres maybe 120K+ on it, but in conversation I asked him recently what miles was on it now and he said i've no idea. Maybe it gets serviced but i'd be surprised if it gets any more than that.

I think many of us dont realise how little Joe Public cares about their cars.

There will be a whole host of different reasons but you will be surprised how many live to a monthly budget, the amount of savings people have is low in general, whilst paying £300 a month for a car takes care of alot of potential problems and unexpected bills putting new tyres on or getting a ding repaired is for many people money wasted with no return. If you were buying a fairly new used car you would expect good tyres and any dings put right, but people drive around happy to live with it or simply unable to afford to put it right.

[RayDonovan]

r3g said:

RayDonovan said:

100%. I was trying to advise a mate recently who's trying to launch a business that relies on people to be proactive in their car maintenance (app to check tyre tread depth) - my argument was that 99% of the general public don't give a fk. Tyres get changed when:

Fails an MOT
Told by the garage during a service
Unrepairable puncture

My sister had a 4.0d X6 which blew both turbos due to never being on a long run. Repaired then replaced with a 4.4v8 diesel RR and they've having the same issues again - she does 5k a year, majority of 2 mile trips to the school.

We see so many cars come in for their first MOT and the tyres are like F1 slicks ! Either that or the tracking is so far on the piss that there's no rubber on the inner edge and they're driving on the metal cords. The customers are quite often completely shocked by it and "had no idea, it's only 3 years old so shouldn't have any problems"

In my probably unpopular opinion, drivers should be fined when a car fails an MOT for illegal tyres. 3pts and £100 fine might get people to pay attention.

[SFTWend]

RayDonovan said:

In my probably unpopular opinion, drivers should be fined when a car fails an MOT for illegal tyres. 3pts and £100 fine might get people to pay attention.

I'd support that. Maybe a similar fine for brake lights not working etc.

Re scuffs and scrapes, many private sellers advertise their cars for sale with these. In some cases repairs would probably cost a grand or two, but the cars are still advertised at top retail money.

[fflump]

RayDonovan said:

In my probably unpopular opinion, drivers should be fined when a car fails an MOT for illegal tyres. 3pts and £100 fine might get people to pay attention.

3 pts or a tyre awareness course

[ChrisH72]

SFTWend said:

RayDonovan said:

In my probably unpopular opinion, drivers should be fined when a car fails an MOT for illegal tyres. 3pts and £100 fine might get people to pay attention.

I'd support that. Maybe a similar fine for brake lights not working etc.

Re scuffs and scrapes, many private sellers advertise their cars for sale with these. In some cases repairs would probably cost a grand or two, but the cars are still advertised at top retail money.

Problem with brake lights is unless someone tells you it's a very easy one to miss.

I try to check all our bulbs regularly but only noticed my wife's car had a brake light out whilst following her to the MOT test centre. When we arrived I told them it was out and asked if they could change it before the test. But they failed it anyway and then replaced the bulb. Bit annoying as the MOT history now looks like we don't care about maintenance which is far from the truth.

[r3g]

ChrisH72 said:

Problem with brake lights is unless someone tells you it's a very easy one to miss.

I try to check all our bulbs regularly but only noticed my wife's car had a brake light out whilst following her to the MOT test centre. When we arrived I told them it was out and asked if they could change it before the test. But they failed it anyway and then replaced the bulb. Bit annoying as the MOT history now looks like we don't care about maintenance which is far from the truth.

Weak argument Chris. Brake lights are easy to test on your own at night time. Shop frontages with glass windows like supermarkets and petrol stations are the obvious places, but reversing close to anything solid is sufficient to see the red glow from each side and the top light if fitted. Most cars younger than 20 years old will flag a bulb warning on the dash display, too.

[ChrisH72]

r3g said:

ChrisH72 said:

Problem with brake lights is unless someone tells you it's a very easy one to miss.

I try to check all our bulbs regularly but only noticed my wife's car had a brake light out whilst following her to the MOT test centre. When we arrived I told them it was out and asked if they could change it before the test. But they failed it anyway and then replaced the bulb. Bit annoying as the MOT history now looks like we don't care about maintenance which is far from the truth.

Weak argument Chris. Brake lights are easy to test on your own at night time. Shop frontages with glass windows like supermarkets and petrol stations are the obvious places, but reversing close to anything solid is sufficient to see the red glow from each side and the top light if fitted. Most cars younger than 20 years old will flag a bulb warning on the dash display, too.

Good to know you check yours daily, well done.

[Fusion777]

We see servicing as the "bare minimum", but it's not. Many don't even bother with that. It's MOT/fix as cheaply as possible when unusable.

[AlexNJ89]

Fusion777 said:

We see servicing as the "bare minimum", but it's not. Many don't even bother with that. It's MOT/fix as cheaply as possible when unusable.

So many cars you see clattering along with black smoke coming out.

I think a lot of people think they do maintenance during the MOT test.

[Sheepshanks]

Fusion777 said:

We see servicing as the "bare minimum", but it's not. Many don't even bother with that. It's MOT/fix as cheaply as possible when unusable.

They think garages just exist to rip them off.

To be fair, it’s possibly even worse if you know a bit about cars because it then just makes you angry when you know more about the work that needs doing than they do.

[macron]

Quiet thread, obvs everything is fine!

Kia/ Nissan in Yeovil today, one person browsing, only 2 on in sales. Great march, terrible April they said. Certainly no need for more people in sales, just valeting and servicing.

I think it was the last vol where I posted some falling trade values on a particular car, which was chopped in for a ford which turned out to be a disaster. The trade in came back as it hadn't left a compound, now worth 20% less than when it went in, just from sitting about!

Naturally retail prices have hardly moved. Well played dealers!

[loskie]

Bought a 48 000m Golf Alltrack 2.0TDI man Jan 23 price guides were circa £12.5 k+ similar guides with 65k miles on now £8.5k.

It's not an investment though to me it's a tool and so far a bloody good car.

[Mabozza]

based on trying to sell my car (including using Motorway), my experience is that selling privately, there are not many takers in the £15k-£20k range, even for a premium brand.
Not even getting the usual spam / timewaster wanna be gangstas & pimps offering "£12K cash (freshly printed) take it away tonight bruv" are buying.

Trade prices for my car are low, where as the retail is still at a premium, as is anything I would be looking to buy, meaning the cost to change to get in a similar car is more than expected.

[r3g]

Mabozza said:

based on trying to sell my car (including using Motorway), my experience is that selling privately, there are not many takers in the £15k-£20k range, even for a premium brand.

You need someone with £15-20k in cash - there's your problem. Everyone needs finance these days. It's hard enough trying to shift stuff privately in the mid 4 figure range never mind 5 figures. Unless you get incredibly lucky you'll end up chasing the market down and will eventually be at the price of the original offers from dealers when you first listed it.

Something I noticed after a recent selling spree is that the 100k mile stigma is still very strong. Over 100k and eveyone thinks they're doing you a favour by offering you pocket change to take it off your hands. Also, more than 3 owners on anything less 10 years old and nobody is interested as they think there must be something wrong with it.

[nickfrog]

r3g said:

You need someone with £15-20k in cash - there's your problem. Everyone needs finance these days. It's hard enough trying to shift stuff privately in the mid 4 figure range never mind 5 figures. Unless you get incredibly lucky you'll end up chasing the market down and will eventually be at the price of the original offers from dealers when you first listed it.

I must be really lucky then, I always sell privately £10k-£35k. Plenty of people either with cash or getting their finance at lower rates than in the trade while preferring to pay less than retail.

[Deep Thought]

nickfrog said:

r3g said:

You need someone with £15-20k in cash - there's your problem. Everyone needs finance these days. It's hard enough trying to shift stuff privately in the mid 4 figure range never mind 5 figures. Unless you get incredibly lucky you'll end up chasing the market down and will eventually be at the price of the original offers from dealers when you first listed it.

I must be really lucky then, I always sell privately £10k-£35k. Plenty of people either with cash or getting their finance at lower rates than in the trade while preferring to pay less than retail.

It'll depend on the car though too.

A performance or rare car or weekend toy thats clearly been well maintained may well attract a private buyer at that price point with cash.

Whereas the customer for a eurobox Golf 1.6 TDI or similar and needing a trade in is likely just to default to a car dealer

[Theoldguard]

nickfrog said:

I must be really lucky then, I always sell privately £10k-£35k. Plenty of people either with cash or getting their finance at lower rates than in the trade while preferring to pay less than retail.

Thats the key, pricing less than retail. Alot of the private sales the last few years are on par with retail, with quite a few looking more expensive. When you consider the additional risk of buying private and the lack of part ex, finance , warranties etc it's always been the way that the private sale price reflects that.

I often bought privately as I liked chatting to the owner and understanding more about the car, it normally ends up a win win for both buyer and seller, but these last few years with silly prices and the likes of WBAC, motorway and others desperate to mop up stock offering decent prices private car sales have really dropped off.

And now with IRs the way they are, even personal loans are over 7% and that's if you can get that rate, and on the flip side getting 5% on savings many don't want to use cash. So alot of things stacked against private sales at the minute, but with the big buyers lowering their offers and trade in prices less then what they have been, it can still work out well for both buyer and seller doing things through a private sale.

[macron]

Ford in finding AA coloured electric cars a hard sell shocker.

[Deep Thought]

Theoldguard said:

I often bought privately as I liked chatting to the owner and understanding more about the car, it normally ends up a win win for both buyer and seller, but these last few years with silly prices and the likes of WBAC, motorway and others desperate to mop up stock offering decent prices private car sales have really dropped off.

I think a lot of private sellers dont want to be bothered trying to sell to the general public. People expecting something for nothing who then get butt hurt when you wont accept their offer of half your asking price "for cash mate" (as opposed to....?). Roll that in with the amount of scammers, thieves, trade buyers trying to buy your car for a song and stories of people being threatened with court action months down the line when a private sale car is "not as described".

[AlexNJ89]

I must be one of the lucky ones as I've never had any issues selling cars privately.

I don't get triggered if a time waster phones me up. I just get them off the phone and move on with my day.