"Adaptive" ECU
Discussion
DanH said:
Yep and it has to be distilled water too right? As long as its switchable its not that big a prob.
One numpty garage filled my EVO6 one with screen wash once..... To be honest, on the EVO it made very little difference on all but the hottest days.
That said, if it works well on the M12 sign me up! I live about 2 miles from Roush so I'll be first in the queue then
pbrett said:
Yep and it has to be distilled water too right? As long as its switchable its not that big a prob.
One numpty garage filled my EVO6 one with screen wash once..... To be honest, on the EVO it made very little difference on all but the hottest days.
That said, if it works well on the M12 sign me up! I live about 2 miles from Roush so I'll be first in the queue then
I can't help but think an artfully placed scoop might be more useful anyway. Wouldn't the way the back window is cut off create a low pressure area anyway, so the amount of air going into the intercooler might be somewhat suboptimal anyway. Could try rerouting a side scoop that vents into the engine bay into the intercooler.
I was about to say exactly the same thing - I am sure the numberplate covering a large area of the mesh behind the intercooler doesn't help much either. I also keep looking at the way the pipes from the intakes in the rear quarters are kinked and squashed as they come through the chassis into the engine back, and wonder if there is something that could be done to get more air flowing through them too.
thatphilbrettguy said:
Removing the numberplate is a known winner on track days. Makes a world of difference.
Nowhere else to put it for road usage though =/
The Vegantune boys had a cunning idea for road use. Think springs and hinges.
Yep I know about that idea, but I'm not sure I'd want to go there!
I like what radical do with some of their cars - put it mounted on the underside of the wing! (parallel to the wing so nearly invisible)
pbrett said:
One numpty garage filled my EVO6 one with screen wash once..... To be honest, on the EVO it made very little difference on all but the hottest days.
Did you actually have water injection fitted, or do you mean the intercooler spray button by the handbrake? Not one of my friends have reported a difference from using the intercooler spray button.
LaurenceFrost said:
One numpty garage filled my EVO6 one with screen wash once..... To be honest, on the EVO it made very little difference on all but the hottest days.
Did you actually have water injection fitted, or do you mean the intercooler spray button by the handbrake? Not one of my friends have reported a difference from using the intercooler spray button.
I had an uprated version (better jets / pump) but it was still operated from the original switch. Like I said though, very little difference.
The noble uses an MBE ecu - which could be modified to switch on water injection when the Air Charge Temps get above a certain level
however - i've tried water injection myself and was dissapointed with the results - the water ends up taking up space that could be filled with air and the car looses power.
The ecu should retard the ignition when the act's get too hot to keep it safe. Water injection is used on race cars as an anti detonant - so you can continue to drive it hard.
A better solution is to fit a co2 spray - that sprays directly onto the intercooler and is triggered via a soleniod and relay from the ecu. this way the charge temps stay cool without filling the cylinders with water, costing you power
however - i've tried water injection myself and was dissapointed with the results - the water ends up taking up space that could be filled with air and the car looses power.
The ecu should retard the ignition when the act's get too hot to keep it safe. Water injection is used on race cars as an anti detonant - so you can continue to drive it hard.
A better solution is to fit a co2 spray - that sprays directly onto the intercooler and is triggered via a soleniod and relay from the ecu. this way the charge temps stay cool without filling the cylinders with water, costing you power
gadgeroonie said:
The noble uses an MBE ecu - which could be modified to switch on water injection when the Air Charge Temps get above a certain level
however - i've tried water injection myself and was dissapointed with the results - the water ends up taking up space that could be filled with air and the car looses power.
The ecu should retard the ignition when the act's get too hot to keep it safe. Water injection is used on race cars as an anti detonant - so you can continue to drive it hard.
A better solution is to fit a co2 spray - that sprays directly onto the intercooler and is triggered via a soleniod and relay from the ecu. this way the charge temps stay cool without filling the cylinders with water, costing you power
except filling a c02 cannister is even more of a pain in the arse than distilled water. Also why use CO2, may as well use liquid nitrogen!
I still think airflow mods would be more rewarding and sustainable.
m12_nathan said:
I've got a smaller rear plate which may help a *bit* but think some kind of lip above the intercooler would help get move air trough it - think BBR's MINI sooper S inlet lip or similar?
I don't know anything about aerodynamics really, but on the Elise, the area above the engine bay which is similar in shape to the noble with the flat back window, is apparently a negative pressure area or something like. Means bugger all airflow apparently.
Having said that, I'm assuming that the information about the Elise is accurate, and that the Noble is similar. The fact that mid engined race cars tend to route the intake to the roof suggests theres a fair amount of truth in it however.
m12_nathan said:
What about a 340 type snorkal arrangement like the reverie one, execpt it could follow one of the butresses up and pop up above the roofline to one side?
Might work, apparently the race team have experimented with scoops too, and to not much avail (3rd hand info though so don't quote me on that). I was thinking some kind of scoop on the top of the rear clam outside the line of the cabin might work, but not convinced about cutting up a clam to experiment! Or maybe even supplementing the scoopage behind the side windows, but that will hinder visibility.
Could also try a NACA duct underneath the undertray?
Frankly I reckon its best to let the race team work this stuff out and copy them if it works and isn't disfiguring.
What about M400 scoops on the side and some ducting inside the clam to the intercooler combined with a NACA duct under the floor (like that idea as NACA ducts don't mess up airflow and you might be able to reduce the air pressure under the car).
I want a wind tunnel and a supply of 10 rear clams and various ducts and scoops to play with
What about simply selotaping the intercooler to the roof vertically
I want a wind tunnel and a supply of 10 rear clams and various ducts and scoops to play with
What about simply selotaping the intercooler to the roof vertically
Pinnacle, that seems a fairly extreme solution! Is that a rendered mock up or really on your car? Also what is rear vis like now if its fitted. I'm not sure how people view mods like that in the states, but I suspect it would hammer the resale value over here. Tuned cars in the UK tend to sell for no real premium in the UK and are harder to shift. Its a shame as in germany they fetch more which makes sense to me.
Nathan, I like your last idea. There was an old rally car at the festival of speed which had the intercooler raised up with a scoop like that.
Not really convinced about randomly putting naca ducts in etc, could bugger up the airflow in the engine bay I'd think?. At least it wouldn't be cutting into anything visible though. The S2 Elise has one on the undertray.
M400 side scoops might be an option, although I have no idea how effective they are. They also stick out which means I'd probably clip them on something. They look cool though! Also is the ducting from the side scoops in the m400 more useful? Its fairly amusing in the GTO3 (tiny flat pipe).
DanH said:
Pinnacle, that seems a fairly extreme solution! Is that a rendered mock up or really on your car? Also what is rear vis like now if its fitted.
Danno, yes it is only a computer rendering, and no, not on the car. Valid point about resale, but when you lads are speaking of NACA ducts, raised scoops, and other, that is the same situation.
One other point that is under consideration is fixed, thermostated fans on the backside of the intercooler drawing air through it, as the front one does. Granted more noise, but should help more when the car is not moving so quickly.
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