Model 3 UK orders.

[JD]

Dave Hedgehog said:

i am averaging 325 at the moment in winter, but have seen over 500 in very heavy traffic on very cold days

WH/m is your mpg its pretty simple to understand

a 100 watt old school light bulb will burn 100 watts an hour so 4 of them would burn 400 watts an hour, 10 would burn 1000watts or 1 kilowatt per hour, so a 75kw battery could power (ignoring losses) 10 100 watt bulbs for 75 hours

if a car burns 333 watts per mile it will be able to travel 3 miles per kilo watt or 225 miles on a full 75 kilo watt battery (ignoring losses)

it amazes me that you can drive around in a 2 tonne car and use less energy than 4 old light bulbs (or nearly 5 cars v a now banned 1600watt hoover)

It amazes because your maths is off by a touch.

Assuming 60mph average and 392Wh/mile and battery capacity of 70kWh

The car uses 24kW versus the lightbulbs .4kW

Or 240 of your lightbulbs

[Durzel]

Yeah let’s not get carried away Moving 2 tonnes doesn’t have a trivial energy cost.

[MaxSo]

He never said how far to be fair...

An i3 is doing about 4 mi/kWh (or 250 Wh/mi at) 60 mph.

So every mile driven at 60 mph consumes the same energy as 2.5 x 100 W light bulbs left on for 1 hour.

Edited by MaxSo on Thursday 23 January 13:14

[Zcd1]

squirdan said:

How does this compare to other people’s experience?

My lifetime average over ~14K miles is about 320 wh/mile. (I'm in Chicago, so warmer summers and much colder winters than in the UK)

[JD]

MaxSo said:

He never said how far to be fair...

An i3 is doing about 4 mi/kWh (or 250 Wh/mi at) 60 mph.

So every mile driven at 60 mph consumes the same energy as 2.5 x 100 W light bulbs left on for 1 hour.

Or, in other words, if you had 18 x

Edited by MaxSo on Thursday 23 January 12:48

Yes, so driving for one minute, is the same as leaving 2.5 lightbulbs on for one hour.

[MaxSo]

Yes, at 60 mph.

There was nothing wrong with his *maths*. It’s just that you assumed other factors - namely the distance driven (number of miles) and the speed (the predominate factor affecting consumption per mile).

I think I prefer my real life illustration of 18x 50 W halogen bulbs using 1,500 kWh more per year than 18x 5 W LED bulbs, and that 1,500 kWh being sufficient energy to drive an EV more than 6k miles.

For comparison, 1,500 kWh is roughly equivalent to 33 gallons of petrol in energy terms, so enough to drive an ICE only about 1,500 miles (at 45 mpg).

And that’s assuming you could somehow effectively “ generate petrol” by just swapping some light bulbs.

To illustrate what I mean further,

“4 old light bulbs” = 400 W = 24,000 Joules per minute’

An i3 (and other EVs I assume) can quite easily consume as little as 165 Wh per mile when driven carefully in town, in mild weather.

165 Wh = 594,000 Joules to cover 1 mile.

At 2.5 mph it would take 24 minutes to drive that mile.

So, 594,000 J / 24 mins = 19,800 J used per minute at 2.5 mph.

This is less than the energy used by 4 old light bulbs in 1 minute.

Edited by MaxSo on Thursday 23 January 14:47

[jamoor]

SWoll said:

squirdan said:

How does this compare to other people’s experience?

Still not clear what the Wh/mile really means!

Similar to mine if driven to enjoy rather than worrying about efficiency, which for me is always the case or why bother getting the Performance version.

Bad weather and constant heating will also be having a significant affect at this time of year in the UK of course. I'm expecting to see much closer to 300 once the weather improves but either way still far cheaper to run than any comparable performing ICE car so why worry about it? If you're planning on a longer trip then driving strategy would change I'm sure to push up the range.

Indeed, we are talking 3p vs 5p per mile which when spread over 10,000 miles is basically nothing.

If an ICE car was 15ppm when driven like a miss daisy and uses 50% more mpg when thrashing it the numbers are much greater.

[manracer]

ive noticed that dropping the temp from 20 to 18 and turning AC off dramatically reduces consumption. Im not saying I regularly do this as whats the point in being cold when you dont have to be, its just a a much more noticeable drop in the usage (from say 330 down to around 230)

[Zcd1]

manracer said:

ive noticed that dropping the temp from 20 to 18 and turning AC off dramatically reduces consumption. Im not saying I regularly do this as whats the point in being cold when you dont have to be, its just a a much more noticeable drop in the usage (from say 330 down to around 230)

I've had my car set to 68 degrees F (20C) with the A/C off for months. I rarely touch the HVAC controls, as a matter of fact - no need.

[ZesPak]

manracer said:

ive noticed that dropping the temp from 20 to 18 and turning AC off dramatically reduces consumption. Im not saying I regularly do this as whats the point in being cold when you dont have to be, its just a a much more noticeable drop in the usage (from say 330 down to around 230)

18 C?
Aren't you taking the refrigerator on wheels thing a bit too far?

[robt350c]

Ordered my car (performance model 3 in white) just over a week ago through my own company, pickup to be Manchester South. I got a text this morning saying my car is ready to be scheduled for delivery but have to select my preferred time within 1 day of the message.

Earliest date I can collect is 29th Jan, latest 1st Feb. Presume if I don't pick one of these dates my car gets allocated to another person?

What's the consensus, worth waiting for the new 20 reg for resale etc.?

If I reject this car I wonder how long before I got offered another car, hopefully within an early March delivery window?

[squirdan]

thanks for replies...v useful

agree re a long journey, am sure the steady cruise would bring it down, a lot of mine have been urban

overall though....a rounding error compared to an X5M or the M3 saloon I had before that !

[squirdan]

PS as seen earlier in central London ... it will soon be socially unacceptable to drive a high performance ICE

458 driver lucky it was only a finger in the dirt!

“Electric cars only ere”

[Pete102]

As a newbie to the electric car world, with the incoming changes to BIK in April I'm seriously considering leasing a model 3 but I'd appreciate a little bit of advice if anyone would mind helping out?

How / can the cost of the lease be claimed back as a business expense - is this just the cost of the monthly, or just the 0.45 p/mile or both?
Whats the current best place for a lease deal, I assume going in with a referral code sweetens the deal if going via Tesla?
Is the performance model worth it? Any other must have options?

I'll be speaking to my accountant about it in more detail but until then, I'm in your hands!

Thanks

Pete

[RobDickinson]

Dave Hedgehog said:

it amazes me that you can drive around in a 2 tonne car and use less energy than 4 old light bulbs (or nearly 5 cars v a now banned 1600watt hoover)

That's sadly not how it works.

1600w vacuum for an hour is 1.6kwh.

Drive 60 miles at 300wh/mi is 18kwh

4 lightbulbs for an hour would use 400wh or what you used for 1 mile which took less than a minute.

[Fastlane]

Pete102 said:

As a newbie to the electric car world, with the incoming changes to BIK in April I'm seriously considering leasing a model 3 but I'd appreciate a little bit of advice if anyone would mind helping out?

How / can the cost of the lease be claimed back as a business expense - is this just the cost of the monthly, or just the 0.45 p/mile or both?
Whats the current best place for a lease deal, I assume going in with a referral code sweetens the deal if going via Tesla?
Is the performance model worth it? Any other must have options?

I'll be speaking to my accountant about it in more detail but until then, I'm in your hands!

Thanks

Pete

I leased my M3P via my (VAT exempt) Ltd company back in December. You can charge the whole lease cost to the company (as you can with any car) as an operating lease payment, as well as the cost of installing the charger at home and work (you can get an OLEV grant to help with these costs), plus any other car-related expenses (car insurance, maintenance, tyres etc). The downside is that you can only claim back 4p/mile for any business miles.

In terms of the best lease deals, these change regularly - try leasing.com to compare deals - and remember to factor in any upfront cost when comparing across deals (leasing.com provide the total cost too, which is a far better measure than the advertised monthly cost). My all in monthly cost for a no-option (there are no must have options really) M3P with 12k miles/annum over 36 months is £634/month, or £22,824 in total. The referral code is worth about £60, so is really not that important and my lease company wouldn't let me apply one (Octopus/Tusker)!

I'd say any petrol head should/will opt for the Performance version, as I did. I think it is an excellent daily driver - I have a supercharged Ariel Atom for (warmer weather) fun though...

The best way of financing it etc. will depend on your circumstances, so do talk to your accountant to work out the true cost to you personally and the business.

[Durzel]

It kinda feels like you're really disadvantaged if you're not getting these on 0% BIK via a company.

I just want to buy the car, personally. I don't have a limited company. From what I can tell I will have a pay a stload more than any company car user.

[Pete102]

Brilliant, thank you.

Fastlane said:

I leased my M3P via my (VAT exempt) Ltd company back in December. You can charge the whole lease cost to the company (as you can with any car) as an operating lease payment, as well as the cost of installing the charger at home and work (you can get an OLEV grant to help with these costs), plus any other car-related expenses (car insurance, maintenance, tyres etc). The downside is that you can only claim back 4p/mile for any business miles.

In terms of the best lease deals, these change regularly - try leasing.com to compare deals - and remember to factor in any upfront cost when comparing across deals (leasing.com provide the total cost too, which is a far better measure than the advertised monthly cost). My all in monthly cost for a no-option (there are no must have options really) M3P with 12k miles/annum over 36 months is £634/month, or £22,824 in total. The referral code is worth about £60, so is really not that important and my lease company wouldn't let me apply one (Octopus/Tusker)!

I'd say any petrol head should/will opt for the Performance version, as I did. I think it is an excellent daily driver - I have a supercharged Ariel Atom for (warmer weather) fun though...

The best way of financing it etc. will depend on your circumstances, so do talk to your accountant to work out the true cost to you personally and the business.

[jamoor]

Fastlane said:

Pete102 said:

As a newbie to the electric car world, with the incoming changes to BIK in April I'm seriously considering leasing a model 3 but I'd appreciate a little bit of advice if anyone would mind helping out?

How / can the cost of the lease be claimed back as a business expense - is this just the cost of the monthly, or just the 0.45 p/mile or both?
Whats the current best place for a lease deal, I assume going in with a referral code sweetens the deal if going via Tesla?
Is the performance model worth it? Any other must have options?

I'll be speaking to my accountant about it in more detail but until then, I'm in your hands!

Thanks

Pete

I leased my M3P via my (VAT exempt) Ltd company back in December. You can charge the whole lease cost to the company (as you can with any car) as an operating lease payment, as well as the cost of installing the charger at home and work (you can get an OLEV grant to help with these costs), plus any other car-related expenses (car insurance, maintenance, tyres etc). The downside is that you can only claim back 4p/mile for any business miles.

In terms of the best lease deals, these change regularly - try leasing.com to compare deals - and remember to factor in any upfront cost when comparing across deals (leasing.com provide the total cost too, which is a far better measure than the advertised monthly cost). My all in monthly cost for a no-option (there are no must have options really) M3P with 12k miles/annum over 36 months is £634/month, or £22,824 in total. The referral code is worth about £60, so is really not that important and my lease company wouldn't let me apply one (Octopus/Tusker)!

I'd say any petrol head should/will opt for the Performance version, as I did. I think it is an excellent daily driver - I have a supercharged Ariel Atom for (warmer weather) fun though...

The best way of financing it etc. will depend on your circumstances, so do talk to your accountant to work out the true cost to you personally and the business.

Do you have any information where it says you can reclaim the cost of the charger back and reclaim the VAT? My accountant thought otherwise

[anonymous-user]

RobDickinson said:

Dave Hedgehog said:

it amazes me that you can drive around in a 2 tonne car and use less energy than 4 old light bulbs (or nearly 5 cars v a now banned 1600watt hoover)

That's sadly not how it works.

1600w vacuum for an hour is 1.6kwh.

Drive 60 miles at 300wh/mi is 18kwh

4 lightbulbs for an hour would use 400wh or what you used for 1 mile which took less than a minute.

Well Rob, that’s a much cleaner explanation than MaxSo’s meanderings though I’m still not sure that any of it has much relevance to anything!

I will try and explain the relevance of w/mile to my wife when our EV arrives but I think some of these explanations would just see her glaze over......