End of the road for the Lexus LC and RC-F
Discussion
joshcowin said:
Odd one this as there are a few interesting GT cars available in this price point!
Around 60k second hand you have astons, maserati's, bently's and jags (xkr-s).
Imo of all the options the lexus is the worst looking. Amazing side profile but the rear is ugly!
The lexus offers little variation in specs compared to the other cars, and from what I can see there is 1 special edition which will set you back (90k+).
The engine is no doubt amazing, but so is the Aston v12, Maserati V8 and the Jag 5.0 is a brute (not special but effective).
As for new pricing £100k buys plenty of special cars.
That reads as quite a lot of the aforementioned badge snobbery. I'm interested to know what you think can be bought new for £100k that's as interesting and special as a LC. I'm a bit biased but everyone that's been near mine thinks it's a pretty special thing. As a former GranTurismo owner, the LC is better in virtually every way, especially the quality of the build and materials. The Maser doesn't wear well and suffers the traditional Italian sticky buttons.Around 60k second hand you have astons, maserati's, bently's and jags (xkr-s).
Imo of all the options the lexus is the worst looking. Amazing side profile but the rear is ugly!
The lexus offers little variation in specs compared to the other cars, and from what I can see there is 1 special edition which will set you back (90k+).
The engine is no doubt amazing, but so is the Aston v12, Maserati V8 and the Jag 5.0 is a brute (not special but effective).
As for new pricing £100k buys plenty of special cars.
FWIW the new GranTurismo is £130k without options and only has a V6. It's less attractive than the previous generation, and loses the interesting engine. I can't think of anything comparable at £100k - an entry level 911 with no options ticked is £97k and it's almost impossible to buy one without options unless you sacrifice something useful.
I'm not sure how the lack of spec variations (aka not having a German-style options list) is a bad thing. The LC has almost everything you could want as standard and the two options, HUD and excellent Mark Levinson stereo upgrade, were both very reasonably priced.
On the used market a Bentley Conti at £60k will be the flabby and dated looking 2nd-gen, and cost you a small fortune to run.
And as for the Jag being a LC competitor, it's a very nice car, but absolutely not. It's a halo trim of something that's obviously cheaper and less special.
spikyone said:
joshcowin said:
Odd one this as there are a few interesting GT cars available in this price point!
Around 60k second hand you have astons, maserati's, bently's and jags (xkr-s).
Imo of all the options the lexus is the worst looking. Amazing side profile but the rear is ugly!
The lexus offers little variation in specs compared to the other cars, and from what I can see there is 1 special edition which will set you back (90k+).
The engine is no doubt amazing, but so is the Aston v12, Maserati V8 and the Jag 5.0 is a brute (not special but effective).
As for new pricing £100k buys plenty of special cars.
That reads as quite a lot of the aforementioned badge snobbery. I'm interested to know what you think can be bought new for £100k that's as interesting and special as a LC. I'm a bit biased but everyone that's been near mine thinks it's a pretty special thing. As a former GranTurismo owner, the LC is better in virtually every way, especially the quality of the build and materials. The Maser doesn't wear well and suffers the traditional Italian sticky buttons.Around 60k second hand you have astons, maserati's, bently's and jags (xkr-s).
Imo of all the options the lexus is the worst looking. Amazing side profile but the rear is ugly!
The lexus offers little variation in specs compared to the other cars, and from what I can see there is 1 special edition which will set you back (90k+).
The engine is no doubt amazing, but so is the Aston v12, Maserati V8 and the Jag 5.0 is a brute (not special but effective).
As for new pricing £100k buys plenty of special cars.
FWIW the new GranTurismo is £130k without options and only has a V6. It's less attractive than the previous generation, and loses the interesting engine. I can't think of anything comparable at £100k - an entry level 911 with no options ticked is £97k and it's almost impossible to buy one without options unless you sacrifice something useful.
I'm not sure how the lack of spec variations (aka not having a German-style options list) is a bad thing. The LC has almost everything you could want as standard and the two options, HUD and excellent Mark Levinson stereo upgrade, were both very reasonably priced.
On the used market a Bentley Conti at £60k will be the flabby and dated looking 2nd-gen, and cost you a small fortune to run.
And as for the Jag being a LC competitor, it's a very nice car, but absolutely not. It's a halo trim of something that's obviously cheaper and less special.
Bentley - I know a serial Conti owner and even the latest one breaks.
F type isn't in the same ballpark, and the 911/991/992/99whateverpoint2pointsix sound boring and do the usual german thing of having no options at all as standard. I looked at one with no cruise control. Not no radar cruise, it had no cruise at all. But it's more of a sportcar apparently.
spikyone said:
That reads as quite a lot of the aforementioned badge snobbery. I'm interested to know what you think can be bought new for £100k that's as interesting and special as a LC. I'm a bit biased but everyone that's been near mine thinks it's a pretty special thing. As a former GranTurismo owner, the LC is better in virtually every way, especially the quality of the build and materials. The Maser doesn't wear well and suffers the traditional Italian sticky buttons.
FWIW the new GranTurismo is £130k without options and only has a V6. It's less attractive than the previous generation, and loses the interesting engine. I can't think of anything comparable at £100k - an entry level 911 with no options ticked is £97k and it's almost impossible to buy one without options unless you sacrifice something useful.
I'm not sure how the lack of spec variations (aka not having a German-style options list) is a bad thing. The LC has almost everything you could want as standard and the two options, HUD and excellent Mark Levinson stereo upgrade, were both very reasonably priced.
On the used market a Bentley Conti at £60k will be the flabby and dated looking 2nd-gen, and cost you a small fortune to run.
And as for the Jag being a LC competitor, it's a very nice car, but absolutely not. It's a halo trim of something that's obviously cheaper and less special.
I have no horse in the race here! Just chatting it through! FWIW the new GranTurismo is £130k without options and only has a V6. It's less attractive than the previous generation, and loses the interesting engine. I can't think of anything comparable at £100k - an entry level 911 with no options ticked is £97k and it's almost impossible to buy one without options unless you sacrifice something useful.
I'm not sure how the lack of spec variations (aka not having a German-style options list) is a bad thing. The LC has almost everything you could want as standard and the two options, HUD and excellent Mark Levinson stereo upgrade, were both very reasonably priced.
On the used market a Bentley Conti at £60k will be the flabby and dated looking 2nd-gen, and cost you a small fortune to run.
And as for the Jag being a LC competitor, it's a very nice car, but absolutely not. It's a halo trim of something that's obviously cheaper and less special.
Few points - Badge snobbery? I've listed jag and masser hardly snobby brands? Don't quite get that comment if I'm being honest!
At 100k I'd be buying a dbs with a v12 sorry but it looks better and has an amazing engine, it probably doesn't have the toys and tech though granted!
A new lc is £110+ though so it's still alot of money!
I didnt say options list did I? It was spec from what I can see some pretty basic colour options, and 3 interior colours? Don't care about options lists but being able to configure the car at this price point would be nice, look at Aston, Jag, Bentley...
Jag xkr-s is always going to get talked about in the sub £60k GT category for mid 40's you are looking at tidy examples probably one of the best VFM GT's going! Good looking and with a monster engine.
I have nothing against the LC it's just an odd car imo at £100k you are in v12 Aston and at £60k there are v8 astons and 5.0 supercharged hot rods. I didn't have a lexus on my wall as a kid but I had an Aston. Ferrari FF's are getting close also with the power warranty.
joshcowin said:
I have no horse in the race here! Just chatting it through!
Few points - Badge snobbery? I've listed jag and masser hardly snobby brands? Don't quite get that comment if I'm being honest!
At 100k I'd be buying a dbs with a v12 sorry but it looks better and has an amazing engine, it probably doesn't have the toys and tech though granted!
A new lc is £110+ though so it's still alot of money!
I didnt say options list did I? It was spec from what I can see some pretty basic colour options, and 3 interior colours? Don't care about options lists but being able to configure the car at this price point would be nice, look at Aston, Jag, Bentley...
Jag xkr-s is always going to get talked about in the sub £60k GT category for mid 40's you are looking at tidy examples probably one of the best VFM GT's going! Good looking and with a monster engine.
I have nothing against the LC it's just an odd car imo at £100k you are in v12 Aston and at £60k there are v8 astons and 5.0 supercharged hot rods. I didn't have a lexus on my wall as a kid but I had an Aston. Ferrari FF's are getting close also with the power warranty.
I suggested badge snobbery as you originally listed a bunch of cars that are no more special, IMO, than the LC. You also say "I didn't have a car of [that brand] on my wall as a kid..." - why would it matter what was on your wall as a kid unless you think it doesn't have the right image? When I was a kid, people made jokes about Skodas. Forgive me if you're not actually suggesting that the brand isn't desirable enough; I can't see another implication.Few points - Badge snobbery? I've listed jag and masser hardly snobby brands? Don't quite get that comment if I'm being honest!
At 100k I'd be buying a dbs with a v12 sorry but it looks better and has an amazing engine, it probably doesn't have the toys and tech though granted!
A new lc is £110+ though so it's still alot of money!
I didnt say options list did I? It was spec from what I can see some pretty basic colour options, and 3 interior colours? Don't care about options lists but being able to configure the car at this price point would be nice, look at Aston, Jag, Bentley...
Jag xkr-s is always going to get talked about in the sub £60k GT category for mid 40's you are looking at tidy examples probably one of the best VFM GT's going! Good looking and with a monster engine.
I have nothing against the LC it's just an odd car imo at £100k you are in v12 Aston and at £60k there are v8 astons and 5.0 supercharged hot rods. I didn't have a lexus on my wall as a kid but I had an Aston. Ferrari FF's are getting close also with the power warranty.
As you mention the Aston DBS and Ferrari FF I'm assuming your suggestion that you can buy stuff that's more special for £100k is a new vs. used comparison then - so entirely meaningless as you're looking at cars that are in reality much more expensive.
A shade under £110k gets the top spec, fully loaded special edition LC, with a 10 year warranty. £100k will get you a 10 year old DBS or FF. I'll guarantee that neither of them will be a patch on the LC for reliability or build quality, and that's ignoring the Ferrari's challenging looks.
For a fair comparison the cheapest new AM is a V8V that costs £125k before options and is a sports car rather than a GT, the cheapest Bentley is £180k.
To all intents and purposes, spec and options are the same thing: if you want to have a different colour interior in your new Aston Martin, it'll cost you money. It seems a strange criticism to say it's not special because there weren't enough colour and trim options; a big options list doesn't make a car special.
I'm going to say again, the Jag XKR-S is a lovely car. But it's not in the same league as the LC, even if it is a similar price for a used one. The Jag is nowhere close on quality or style, and is only a high trim of a less special car.
joshcowin said:
Odd one this as there are a few interesting GT cars available in this price point!
There are. But I like odd.For the same money I could have had a 360, an R8, a McLaren 570, an Aston Martin AMG turbo, an AMG GT turbo, any number of BMW M-wingdings, a 911 of various very slightly different blends separated by punctuation or a different digit, a Bentley, there’s a massive list.
But I’ve got bank vault build, no maintenance worries until 2032, crazy concept car looks (imho), no turbo, rear wheel drive and a kind of semi practical middle ground between sports R8 and 911 and the more GT type cars. And the roof comes off.
And nobody else bought one in the UK - there are only 600 here. Which I like too.
It’s a shame the EU is forcing this out of the showrooms - we’ll see more of this happening with low volume cars as manufacturers won’t want to invest millions to tick stupid eco boxes for such a small market.
spikyone said:
I suggested badge snobbery as you originally listed a bunch of cars that are no more special, IMO, than the LC. You also say "I didn't have a car of [that brand] on my wall as a kid..." - why would it matter what was on your wall as a kid unless you think it doesn't have the right image? When I was a kid, people made jokes about Skodas. Forgive me if you're not actually suggesting that the brand isn't desirable enough; I can't see another implication.
As you mention the Aston DBS and Ferrari FF I'm assuming your suggestion that you can buy stuff that's more special for £100k is a new vs. used comparison then - so entirely meaningless as you're looking at cars that are in reality much more expensive.
A shade under £110k gets the top spec, fully loaded special edition LC, with a 10 year warranty. £100k will get you a 10 year old DBS or FF. I'll guarantee that neither of them will be a patch on the LC for reliability or build quality, and that's ignoring the Ferrari's challenging looks.
For a fair comparison the cheapest new AM is a V8V that costs £125k before options and is a sports car rather than a GT, the cheapest Bentley is £180k.
To all intents and purposes, spec and options are the same thing: if you want to have a different colour interior in your new Aston Martin, it'll cost you money. It seems a strange criticism to say it's not special because there weren't enough colour and trim options; a big options list doesn't make a car special.
I'm going to say again, the Jag XKR-S is a lovely car. But it's not in the same league as the LC, even if it is a similar price for a used one. The Jag is nowhere close on quality or style, and is only a high trim of a less special car.
You are obviously happy with your choice, and so you should be it's a nice car! All I am trying to say is that for £100k there are interesting choices out there and for £60k the same applies! As you mention the Aston DBS and Ferrari FF I'm assuming your suggestion that you can buy stuff that's more special for £100k is a new vs. used comparison then - so entirely meaningless as you're looking at cars that are in reality much more expensive.
A shade under £110k gets the top spec, fully loaded special edition LC, with a 10 year warranty. £100k will get you a 10 year old DBS or FF. I'll guarantee that neither of them will be a patch on the LC for reliability or build quality, and that's ignoring the Ferrari's challenging looks.
For a fair comparison the cheapest new AM is a V8V that costs £125k before options and is a sports car rather than a GT, the cheapest Bentley is £180k.
To all intents and purposes, spec and options are the same thing: if you want to have a different colour interior in your new Aston Martin, it'll cost you money. It seems a strange criticism to say it's not special because there weren't enough colour and trim options; a big options list doesn't make a car special.
I'm going to say again, the Jag XKR-S is a lovely car. But it's not in the same league as the LC, even if it is a similar price for a used one. The Jag is nowhere close on quality or style, and is only a high trim of a less special car.
I am a petrol head and if I had £100k to spend I would be looking for the best car available, does a 10year old ferrari rank higher than a new lexus, TO ME, yes massively so. I could own a DBS a truly iconic british car ( maybe one of our best ever, v12 manual). But that's just me, you bought the car that appealed to you more, great, I don't get your need to shoot every other car down? Or me and my opinions?
Also on your badge snobbery comments, I owned a skoda (great car) I couldn't care less what the badge is. The badge snobbery comment is always played by those who have made a leftfield choice and feel the need to defend it, don't just enjoy your £100k car, at the end of the day I haven't got one!!
The xkr-s is £40kish just amazing value for money and very good looking imo. I think I brought it up as a pure value for money option as opposed to a direct rival to the lc.
Anyway as I say enjoy your car, it's really nice and you clearly love it.
andy43 said:
There are. But I like odd.
For the same money I could have had a 360, an R8, a McLaren 570, an Aston Martin AMG turbo, an AMG GT turbo, any number of BMW M-wingdings, a 911 of various very slightly different blends separated by punctuation or a different digit, a Bentley, there’s a massive list.
But I’ve got bank vault build, no maintenance worries until 2032, crazy concept car looks (imho), no turbo, rear wheel drive and a kind of semi practical middle ground between sports R8 and 911 and the more GT type cars. And the roof comes off.
And nobody else bought one in the UK - there are only 600 here. Which I like too.
It’s a shame the EU is forcing this out of the showrooms - we’ll see more of this happening with low volume cars as manufacturers won’t want to invest millions to tick stupid eco boxes for such a small market.
Got a pic? For the same money I could have had a 360, an R8, a McLaren 570, an Aston Martin AMG turbo, an AMG GT turbo, any number of BMW M-wingdings, a 911 of various very slightly different blends separated by punctuation or a different digit, a Bentley, there’s a massive list.
But I’ve got bank vault build, no maintenance worries until 2032, crazy concept car looks (imho), no turbo, rear wheel drive and a kind of semi practical middle ground between sports R8 and 911 and the more GT type cars. And the roof comes off.
And nobody else bought one in the UK - there are only 600 here. Which I like too.
It’s a shame the EU is forcing this out of the showrooms - we’ll see more of this happening with low volume cars as manufacturers won’t want to invest millions to tick stupid eco boxes for such a small market.
joshcowin said:
You are obviously happy with your choice, and so you should be it's a nice car! All I am trying to say is that for £100k there are interesting choices out there and for £60k the same applies!
I am a petrol head and if I had £100k to spend I would be looking for the best car available, does a 10year old ferrari rank higher than a new lexus, TO ME, yes massively so. I could own a DBS a truly iconic british car ( maybe one of our best ever, v12 manual). But that's just me, you bought the car that appealed to you more, great, I don't get your need to shoot every other car down? Or me and my opinions?
Also on your badge snobbery comments, I owned a skoda (great car) I couldn't care less what the badge is. The badge snobbery comment is always played by those who have made a leftfield choice and feel the need to defend it, don't just enjoy your £100k car, at the end of the day I haven't got one!!
The xkr-s is £40kish just amazing value for money and very good looking imo. I think I brought it up as a pure value for money option as opposed to a direct rival to the lc.
Anyway as I say enjoy your car, it's really nice and you clearly love it.
I still think the takeaway from this argument is your unfair comparison i.e. not like for like. For a £100k NEW, what compares to an LC500?I am a petrol head and if I had £100k to spend I would be looking for the best car available, does a 10year old ferrari rank higher than a new lexus, TO ME, yes massively so. I could own a DBS a truly iconic british car ( maybe one of our best ever, v12 manual). But that's just me, you bought the car that appealed to you more, great, I don't get your need to shoot every other car down? Or me and my opinions?
Also on your badge snobbery comments, I owned a skoda (great car) I couldn't care less what the badge is. The badge snobbery comment is always played by those who have made a leftfield choice and feel the need to defend it, don't just enjoy your £100k car, at the end of the day I haven't got one!!
The xkr-s is £40kish just amazing value for money and very good looking imo. I think I brought it up as a pure value for money option as opposed to a direct rival to the lc.
Anyway as I say enjoy your car, it's really nice and you clearly love it.
TeaVR said:
I still think the takeaway from this argument is your unfair comparison i.e. not like for like. For a £100k NEW, what compares to an LC500?
For £115k as that's what the LC is new the following appear on auto trader F type 5.0 r
New corvette with the 6.2 v8
911 gts
Cayman gt4
M4 csl
M8 comp
850i
Aston Vantage
Aston db11 (23 plate 2k miles)
Audi r8 v10
I'm sure I missed some but there's a fair few to choose from/ compare.
My 3 would be
Rarity and striking looks - Corvette
Practical - m8 comp
Pure drivers car - m4 csl or the Cayman
joshcowin said:
TeaVR said:
I still think the takeaway from this argument is your unfair comparison i.e. not like for like. For a £100k NEW, what compares to an LC500?
For £115k as that's what the LC is new the following appear on auto trader F type 5.0 r
New corvette with the 6.2 v8
911 gts
Cayman gt4
M4 csl
M8 comp
850i
Aston Vantage
Aston db11 (23 plate 2k miles)
Audi r8 v10
I'm sure I missed some but there's a fair few to choose from/ compare.
My 3 would be
Rarity and striking looks - Corvette
Practical - m8 comp
Pure drivers car - m4 csl or the Cayman
joshcowin said:
My 3 would be
Rarity and striking looks - Corvette
Practical - m8 comp
Pure drivers car - m4 csl or the Cayman
Good cars but different to the LC, it’s kinda in the middle of those. The M8 is theoretically closest but they’re advertised at 80 grand new as nobody wants them.Rarity and striking looks - Corvette
Practical - m8 comp
Pure drivers car - m4 csl or the Cayman
One of the latest reviews from a couple of weeks ago sums up the LC best - I was giggling all the way through it. And I HATE dentists.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HPszF7iwYw
And having had a Maserati and a couple of TVRs this 200,000 mile LC is very encouraging
https://www.carscoops.com/2023/12/this-2019-lexus-...
https://www.carscoops.com/2023/12/this-2019-lexus-...
joshcowin said:
For £115k as that's what the LC is new the following appear on auto trader
F type 5.0 r
New corvette with the 6.2 v8
911 gts
Cayman gt4
M4 csl
M8 comp
850i
Aston Vantage
Aston db11 (23 plate 2k miles)
Audi r8 v10
I'm sure I missed some but there's a fair few to choose from/ compare.
My 3 would be
Rarity and striking looks - Corvette
Practical - m8 comp
Pure drivers car - m4 csl or the Cayman
911 GTS - that's not really a GT (despite the name). It's a sports carF type 5.0 r
New corvette with the 6.2 v8
911 gts
Cayman gt4
M4 csl
M8 comp
850i
Aston Vantage
Aston db11 (23 plate 2k miles)
Audi r8 v10
I'm sure I missed some but there's a fair few to choose from/ compare.
My 3 would be
Rarity and striking looks - Corvette
Practical - m8 comp
Pure drivers car - m4 csl or the Cayman
Cayman GT4 - that certainly isn't a GT. It's all out sports car
Audi R8 - It's all out sports car
DB11 - with 2k miles - not really..... new, is it
Only fair comparison is an 8 Series. Not sure I could stomach the depreciation!
As for the striking looks of the Corvette - very subjective. To me, if I didn't know better, I'd have thought it was designed by the Russians having stolen some Ferrari plans from 20 years ago.
Go on, you know you want to.
35k off a new M8. Bargin! Honey Ishrunk photocopied my 4 series on 120%.
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-search?advertisin...
Put your head close to your screen and you can almost hear the depreciation whistling like a deflating balloon...
35k off a new M8. Bargin! Honey I
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-search?advertisin...
Put your head close to your screen and you can almost hear the depreciation whistling like a deflating balloon...
andy43 said:
Go on, you know you want to.
35k off a new M8. Bargin! Honey Ishrunk photocopied my 4 series on 120%.
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-search?advertisin...
Put your head close to your screen and you can almost hear the depreciation whistling like a deflating balloon...
35k off a new M8. Bargin! Honey I
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-search?advertisin...
Put your head close to your screen and you can almost hear the depreciation whistling like a deflating balloon...
TeaVR said:
911 GTS - that's not really a GT (despite the name). It's a sports car
Cayman GT4 - that certainly isn't a GT. It's all out sports car
Audi R8 - It's all out sports car
DB11 - with 2k miles - not really..... new, is it
Only fair comparison is an 8 Series. Not sure I could stomach the depreciation!
As for the striking looks of the Corvette - very subjective. To me, if I didn't know better, I'd have thought it was designed by the Russians having stolen some Ferrari plans from 20 years ago.
M8 comp is an Impressive car, dependant on spec it can fly under the radar and offer insane performance and luxury, certainly a contender. Cayman GT4 - that certainly isn't a GT. It's all out sports car
Audi R8 - It's all out sports car
DB11 - with 2k miles - not really..... new, is it
Only fair comparison is an 8 Series. Not sure I could stomach the depreciation!
As for the striking looks of the Corvette - very subjective. To me, if I didn't know better, I'd have thought it was designed by the Russians having stolen some Ferrari plans from 20 years ago.
DB11 isn't new but near enough not to worry and only 4-6months old, it's a great option/alternative!
R8, Aston, 911 all do the same job as the LC sorry they do, daily usability with good looks and performance. Carry enough luggage for a week away. If you can get in and out of them then no reason not to look at them!
Odd depreciation comment the LC tanks 5 years half price 3 years and 7 thousand miles £30k loss 1 year old with 5k £25k loss , its similar to many cars in the price bracket. Looking at autotrader the M8 comp is slightly better to own in this respect.
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