Stoneleigh weekend
Discussion
I thought it was a great show, Saturday was very busy with Sunday a little slower but there was plenty to see and buy. Clearly there are less manufacturers around then there were 10 years ago which will mean less exhibitors. I still feel the policy of free entry for Kit Car drivers isnt a good commercial idea, no other show I know of does this.
tombs said:
... no other show I know of does this.
Many of the outdoor vintage steam/military vehicle/classic car shows do, but you have to book in advance as an 'exhibitor' (which also allows the organizer to stipulate arrival/departure times).This is one easy solution, as it also solves gtmdriver's valid point that if you expect to get in free on the grounds that you are providing part of the 'attraction', it's not unreasonable to expect you to stick around long enough to make a difference. It might discourage some 'drop of a hat' attendances by kit car drivers, but on the other hand it might encourage some to make the effort to attend on the day, if they've already had to make some effort to get their 'free' ticket.
I wonder if there was a 'donations box' type system on the gate for kit drivers if that would generate anything or is that a bit too old school?
I don't mind paying a couple of quid to get in even if its each day. If your aware in advance, leaving two or three pounds in your pocket isn't going to break the bank is it?
Slightly off topic. I had this brought to my attention as a possible 'problem'.
One vehicle in particular was pointed out to one of my club officials who sent me a photo. I checked and found that not only is the vehicle incorrectly registered, it also has no MOT. If it was a trailer queen I could understand it however it wasn't, it was however carrying 'baggage' that indicated it had been driven on a public highway to and from the event. Driving a vehicle with a stolen ID, no MOT, one dubious tyre and not the best condition -into a field full of enthusiasts one of whom happened to be the ex-owner of that registration number... It's a red '7'. I'm not going to post details unless asked but i'm sure the owner will know if he reads this GET YOUR CAR OFF THE ROAD or get it legal before you have a blow out and kill someone... Your car isnt even registered legally and therefore your insurance (if you have any) is void.
/rant...
I don't mind paying a couple of quid to get in even if its each day. If your aware in advance, leaving two or three pounds in your pocket isn't going to break the bank is it?
Slightly off topic. I had this brought to my attention as a possible 'problem'.
One vehicle in particular was pointed out to one of my club officials who sent me a photo. I checked and found that not only is the vehicle incorrectly registered, it also has no MOT. If it was a trailer queen I could understand it however it wasn't, it was however carrying 'baggage' that indicated it had been driven on a public highway to and from the event. Driving a vehicle with a stolen ID, no MOT, one dubious tyre and not the best condition -into a field full of enthusiasts one of whom happened to be the ex-owner of that registration number... It's a red '7'. I'm not going to post details unless asked but i'm sure the owner will know if he reads this GET YOUR CAR OFF THE ROAD or get it legal before you have a blow out and kill someone... Your car isnt even registered legally and therefore your insurance (if you have any) is void.
/rant...
Rebuilda said:
I wonder if there was a 'donations box' type system on the gate for kit drivers if that would generate anything or is that a bit too old school?
I don't mind paying a couple of quid to get in even if its each day. If your aware in advance, leaving two or three pounds in your pocket isn't going to break the bank is it?
Slightly off topic. I had this brought to my attention as a possible 'problem'.
One vehicle in particular was pointed out to one of my club officials who sent me a photo. I checked and found that not only is the vehicle incorrectly registered, it also has no MOT. If it was a trailer queen I could understand it however it wasn't, it was however carrying 'baggage' that indicated it had been driven on a public highway to and from the event. Driving a vehicle with a stolen ID, no MOT, one dubious tyre and not the best condition -into a field full of enthusiasts one of whom happened to be the ex-owner of that registration number... It's a red '7'. I'm not going to post details unless asked but i'm sure the owner will know if he reads this GET YOUR CAR OFF THE ROAD or get it legal before you have a blow out and kill someone... Your car isnt even registered legally and therefore your insurance (if you have any) is void.
/rant...
So in fact the illegal car in question was a free entry "exhibit"I don't mind paying a couple of quid to get in even if its each day. If your aware in advance, leaving two or three pounds in your pocket isn't going to break the bank is it?
Slightly off topic. I had this brought to my attention as a possible 'problem'.
One vehicle in particular was pointed out to one of my club officials who sent me a photo. I checked and found that not only is the vehicle incorrectly registered, it also has no MOT. If it was a trailer queen I could understand it however it wasn't, it was however carrying 'baggage' that indicated it had been driven on a public highway to and from the event. Driving a vehicle with a stolen ID, no MOT, one dubious tyre and not the best condition -into a field full of enthusiasts one of whom happened to be the ex-owner of that registration number... It's a red '7'. I'm not going to post details unless asked but i'm sure the owner will know if he reads this GET YOUR CAR OFF THE ROAD or get it legal before you have a blow out and kill someone... Your car isnt even registered legally and therefore your insurance (if you have any) is void.
/rant...
Equus said:
Many of the outdoor vintage steam/military vehicle/classic car shows do, but you have to book in advance as an 'exhibitor' (which also allows the organizer to stipulate arrival/departure times).
But there are plenty of those to attend, for instance the Performance French Car scene has one major event and everyone pays to get in thats pretty much the norm for the majority of exhibitions/shows.tombs said:
Equus said:
Many of the outdoor vintage steam/military vehicle/classic car shows do, but you have to book in advance as an 'exhibitor' (which also allows the organizer to stipulate arrival/departure times).
But there are plenty of those to attend, for instance the Performance French Car scene has one major event and everyone pays to get in thats pretty much the norm for the majority of exhibitions/shows.Equus said:
Many of the outdoor vintage steam/military vehicle/classic car shows do, but you have to book in advance as an 'exhibitor' (which also allows the organizer to stipulate arrival/departure times).
This is one easy solution, as it also solves gtmdriver's valid point that if you expect to get in free on the grounds that you are providing part of the 'attraction', it's not unreasonable to expect you to stick around long enough to make a difference. It might discourage some 'drop of a hat' attendances by kit car drivers, but on the other hand it might encourage some to make the effort to attend on the day, if they've already had to make some effort to get their 'free' ticket.
good point, kit drivers could be asked to book, if the weather looks iffy on the day some will attend anyway if they have a free ticket. There is a cost associated with admin and distribution of tickets as opposed to waving them in on the gate though.This is one easy solution, as it also solves gtmdriver's valid point that if you expect to get in free on the grounds that you are providing part of the 'attraction', it's not unreasonable to expect you to stick around long enough to make a difference. It might discourage some 'drop of a hat' attendances by kit car drivers, but on the other hand it might encourage some to make the effort to attend on the day, if they've already had to make some effort to get their 'free' ticket.
The topic of paying to display a private car as an exhibit has been discussed at length on various forums. Most seem to see sense that they should contribute financially, others are usually insistent that without them displaying there is no show.
No control what so ever though, a perfect example of a high quality kit car goes free and so does an appalling one that is donkeys years old and in a poor state. Only one of the above is an attraction, but that is maybe "kitist".(made up word)
Stuart Mills said:
There is a cost associated with admin and distribution of tickets as opposed to waving them in on the gate though.
This can be largely automated these days: register details online and print-your-own barcoded tickets (which can also gather useful data in terms of registrations vs. attendance, etc.). You could even give people a pre-printable display card that allows them to fill in details about their car, for the benefit of other show visitors - would save all the wondering about what the hell some obscure, one-off special is when you come across it parked up without its owner.
Equus said:
This can be largely automated these days: register details online and print-your-own barcoded tickets (which can also gather useful data in terms of registrations vs. attendance, etc.).
You could even give people a pre-printable display card that allows them to fill in details about their car, for the benefit of other show visitors - would save all the wondering about what the hell some obscure, one-off special is when you come across it parked up without its owner.
I can see some people having issues with doing that info sheet... You could even give people a pre-printable display card that allows them to fill in details about their car, for the benefit of other show visitors - would save all the wondering about what the hell some obscure, one-off special is when you come across it parked up without its owner.
If they filled them in honestly, we might also find out where some of the Eagle, Jago, Spartan and Dutton log books went
I've used an automated booking system to sort out small social events before and it works well, lets you see who else has already booked, can allocate stand positions, issues tickets and event information packs. All done using paypal.
Equus said:
This can be largely automated these days: register details online and print-your-own barcoded tickets (which can also gather useful data in terms of registrations vs. attendance, etc.).
You could even give people a pre-printable display card that allows them to fill in details about their car, for the benefit of other show visitors - would save all the wondering about what the hell some obscure, one-off special is when you come across it parked up without its owner.
Nice idea, I wonder what that would cost to set up? Are there registration software packages online you can purchase to generate unique barcodes?You could even give people a pre-printable display card that allows them to fill in details about their car, for the benefit of other show visitors - would save all the wondering about what the hell some obscure, one-off special is when you come across it parked up without its owner.
I really can't see an argument for free entry to kit car owner/drivers (and yes, I am one). On the basis that 'we are part of the show', then exhibitors should get in for free also!
If we would like the show to continue, then due thought should be made to charging everybody coming in - after all, if I take my kit car and sit in the club area with it (or leave it and go around the show) I must be getting some sort of pleasure/entertainment from doing so otherwise I wouldn't go? something for nothing? not the usual way things happen..... All those who think free entry is good because it saves them money, should perhaps consider that if a charge was made, then there could be more attractions, lower priced food (lower cost entry for refreshment stall could mean more competition and keener prices?) and everyone would benefit.
The argument that 'they must be making a fortune' clearly isn't true otherwise we wouldn't be down to one show - organisers would be tripping over each other to run shows if there was a lot of money to be made!
If we would like the show to continue, then due thought should be made to charging everybody coming in - after all, if I take my kit car and sit in the club area with it (or leave it and go around the show) I must be getting some sort of pleasure/entertainment from doing so otherwise I wouldn't go? something for nothing? not the usual way things happen..... All those who think free entry is good because it saves them money, should perhaps consider that if a charge was made, then there could be more attractions, lower priced food (lower cost entry for refreshment stall could mean more competition and keener prices?) and everyone would benefit.
The argument that 'they must be making a fortune' clearly isn't true otherwise we wouldn't be down to one show - organisers would be tripping over each other to run shows if there was a lot of money to be made!
An alternative point of view..
Does a kit car show have to be static? After all, kit car owners like their cars to be seen. Surely, there must be a point where, unless you are local to Stoneleigh, the kit car scene is preaching mostly to the converted?
Why not have a travelling show? More people outside of the scene will get to see the cars (in the fibreglass) and it could be a more of an all inclusive experience. Also, the food will be cheaper!
So, as an example, in my area the initial gathering could start near York and travel to and through the cities of Leeds, Manchester, Sheffield with meet and greet stops on the way.
Does a kit car show have to be static? After all, kit car owners like their cars to be seen. Surely, there must be a point where, unless you are local to Stoneleigh, the kit car scene is preaching mostly to the converted?
Why not have a travelling show? More people outside of the scene will get to see the cars (in the fibreglass) and it could be a more of an all inclusive experience. Also, the food will be cheaper!
So, as an example, in my area the initial gathering could start near York and travel to and through the cities of Leeds, Manchester, Sheffield with meet and greet stops on the way.
Edited by browse on Saturday 7th May 16:28
Fastpedeller said:
I really can't see an argument for free entry to kit car owner/drivers (and yes, I am one). On the basis that 'we are part of the show', then exhibitors should get in for free also!
If we would like the show to continue, then due thought should be made to charging everybody coming in - after all, if I take my kit car and sit in the club area with it (or leave it and go around the show) I must be getting some sort of pleasure/entertainment from doing so otherwise I wouldn't go? something for nothing? not the usual way things happen..... All those who think free entry is good because it saves them money, should perhaps consider that if a charge was made, then there could be more attractions, lower priced food (lower cost entry for refreshment stall could mean more competition and keener prices?) and everyone would benefit.
The argument that 'they must be making a fortune' clearly isn't true otherwise we wouldn't be down to one show - organisers would be tripping over each other to run shows if there was a lot of money to be made!
We seem to have this discussion every year! (At least once!)If we would like the show to continue, then due thought should be made to charging everybody coming in - after all, if I take my kit car and sit in the club area with it (or leave it and go around the show) I must be getting some sort of pleasure/entertainment from doing so otherwise I wouldn't go? something for nothing? not the usual way things happen..... All those who think free entry is good because it saves them money, should perhaps consider that if a charge was made, then there could be more attractions, lower priced food (lower cost entry for refreshment stall could mean more competition and keener prices?) and everyone would benefit.
The argument that 'they must be making a fortune' clearly isn't true otherwise we wouldn't be down to one show - organisers would be tripping over each other to run shows if there was a lot of money to be made!
Speaking for myself, having to pay to get in wouldn't stop me attending. I might (eventually) manage to turn up in a kit car someday!!
I think a reduced entry fee for kit car drivers would be a good compromise, but also like the idea of free entry for those who pre-book and (possibly) agree to stay at the show for a minimum length of time, say at least 4 hours. (Not sure how to enforce that!)
In one of our previous threads, didn't somebody (Stuart, perhaps) observe that the Newark show didn't charge kit car drivers because it started off as a few owners gathering in a field?
Eventually, the other shows had to follow suit and free entry became the norm.
I guess what I see is that, if something doesn't change, we will be back to kit car owners meeting in fields, rather than shows as we know them now.
If you're happy with that, that's fine.
Personally, although I do generally do some socialising at Stoneleigh, the show is about the manufacturers. The trade stands, although important, are less critical to my mind. I've asked several times what makes the show worthwhile for a manufacturer, but haven't really had any insight into this until Stuart's comments earlier in this thread. I would have to say, his attitude is IMHO perfect - to take the long view and make it an event in itself is something I would hope all the manufacturers would take on board - if the mainstream manufacturers had taken that view, we might still have a motor show of our now too!
Whatever happens, I can't see the food prices dropping anytime soon!!
I didn't know there was a Kit Car area on PH
I've been going to the show for too many years to remember, there were certainly fewer trade stalls this year and fewer last than the year before.
As so few camp and the main attraction IS the Kit Cars I've wondered why they didn't make it into a one day show.
I think the option of staying all day = getting in free is a good one and also cheaper entry if you come in a kitcar.
Regarding stalls, having had one at various shows in the past - it's a nightmare, a very long day, uncertain outcome and theft is a big problem - usually the most profitable stalls are the ones selling Food & Drink.
I've been going to the show for too many years to remember, there were certainly fewer trade stalls this year and fewer last than the year before.
As so few camp and the main attraction IS the Kit Cars I've wondered why they didn't make it into a one day show.
I think the option of staying all day = getting in free is a good one and also cheaper entry if you come in a kitcar.
Regarding stalls, having had one at various shows in the past - it's a nightmare, a very long day, uncertain outcome and theft is a big problem - usually the most profitable stalls are the ones selling Food & Drink.
It was great event for me.
I flew there from Poland for only one day.
I like very much your kit car culture.
My father which I took together was suprised that there was so many people aged like him.
I expected more racing kit cars.
I was looking for PH members at the Tribute AUtomotive stand but nobody was there when I was there.
These are my photos from Stoneleigh:
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10209088...
I flew there from Poland for only one day.
I like very much your kit car culture.
My father which I took together was suprised that there was so many people aged like him.
I expected more racing kit cars.
I was looking for PH members at the Tribute AUtomotive stand but nobody was there when I was there.
These are my photos from Stoneleigh:
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10209088...
Nice pictures Tomasz. The space frame 911 looks quite interesting
I hadn't been to any shows for about 4 years so found it quite interesting. A lot of familiar products but some fresh ideas and faces. I was there on the Monday which I guess was quieter due to the weather but still plenty to see for a few hours.
I like the idea posted above of a "rolling kit car show" Like "drive it" day but for kit cars and replicas maybe
I hadn't been to any shows for about 4 years so found it quite interesting. A lot of familiar products but some fresh ideas and faces. I was there on the Monday which I guess was quieter due to the weather but still plenty to see for a few hours.
I like the idea posted above of a "rolling kit car show" Like "drive it" day but for kit cars and replicas maybe
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