Buying a second hand kit car
Discussion
Should be enough combined knowledge on this forum for us to be able to set out aqlist of things people should look out for when buying a second hand kit, whether it's a car that has been built and registered, or an abandoned project-
I'll start by saying that the first thing to do is to check its legal status. If it's on the road, is it correctly registered, or has the builder evaded the SVA/IVA test by keeping it on the donor registration or by cloning a for instance MK as an old Dutton? If it's an abandoned project make sure you get all the receipts and the build photos
I'll start by saying that the first thing to do is to check its legal status. If it's on the road, is it correctly registered, or has the builder evaded the SVA/IVA test by keeping it on the donor registration or by cloning a for instance MK as an old Dutton? If it's an abandoned project make sure you get all the receipts and the build photos
As far as the car itself is concerned, probably the single most important thing is the wiring. It's a lot easier to change a duff engine, or any other component, than it is to rewire a car. If the donor loom has been used (the clue to this is big masses of wire done up with cable ties to reduce its bulk, often crammed up behind the dashboard), then make sure all the electrics are working perfectly, because if they aren't it may be impossible to sort out properly without a complete rewire.
I'm surprised this thread is dying a death like this. I reckon probably at least half the kit cars in existence are owned by people who didn't build them. I know most of the cars I see have been bought second hand and most of those owners would have benefited from some advice as to what to look for.
I suppose though, even if we did build up a decent check list the problem would be to get people to look at it before looking at the car! It's a lot easier to make a bad mistake buying a kit than it is buying a second hand production car.
I suppose though, even if we did build up a decent check list the problem would be to get people to look at it before looking at the car! It's a lot easier to make a bad mistake buying a kit than it is buying a second hand production car.
Research is IMHO the first place to start, most kits have there own forum so thats the obvious place to start, especially as a lot of cars for sale will be known within the club, not all admittedly.
Try and get someone who knows the make of kit to go with you to have a look, dont just jump in and buy the first one you see, unless it comes via recommendation from a known source as it were.
Make sure its properly registered, check all the paperwork to ensure its as advertised, look at the general build quality, you get a good feeling for a kit judging its build quality, go over it with a fine toothcomb, outside inside underneath etc.
Mileage is a good indicator as well, if its 5 years old and less than 1000 miles on the clock - why ?, is it unreliable etc, most should average 3-5K miles per year as an indicator.
Some are also factory builds or specialist builds and not 'DIY' projects, always check back with the builder for any info spec at build, does it match now.
Manufacturers often keep good records as well, especially of supply dates etc so you can check there as well.
Check tyres not just for tread etc but are they the correct rating for the car ie speed rating.
Thats it for now, will get back with some other tips in a while.
Try and get someone who knows the make of kit to go with you to have a look, dont just jump in and buy the first one you see, unless it comes via recommendation from a known source as it were.
Make sure its properly registered, check all the paperwork to ensure its as advertised, look at the general build quality, you get a good feeling for a kit judging its build quality, go over it with a fine toothcomb, outside inside underneath etc.
Mileage is a good indicator as well, if its 5 years old and less than 1000 miles on the clock - why ?, is it unreliable etc, most should average 3-5K miles per year as an indicator.
Some are also factory builds or specialist builds and not 'DIY' projects, always check back with the builder for any info spec at build, does it match now.
Manufacturers often keep good records as well, especially of supply dates etc so you can check there as well.
Check tyres not just for tread etc but are they the correct rating for the car ie speed rating.
Thats it for now, will get back with some other tips in a while.
Make sure it's correctly registered on the V5 and comes with a stack of paperwork.
Avoid Q plates and go for something with a proper registration that's been through the SVA test and not cobbled together. The easiest part of a kit car is bolting the thing together, the hardest thing is getting it all set up right for the SVA test - that's why you see a lot of 90% finished projects.
If it's an older engine, look out for things tuned to within an inch of their lives and running rich. It will go pop one day.
Electrics, it doesn't cost that much to get a full re-wire, we had to do ours and it wasn't too expensive but a lot of fuss and hassle. Look for odd wires dangling about, fuses tucked under carpets and not in a fusebox.
Avoid Q plates and go for something with a proper registration that's been through the SVA test and not cobbled together. The easiest part of a kit car is bolting the thing together, the hardest thing is getting it all set up right for the SVA test - that's why you see a lot of 90% finished projects.
If it's an older engine, look out for things tuned to within an inch of their lives and running rich. It will go pop one day.
Electrics, it doesn't cost that much to get a full re-wire, we had to do ours and it wasn't too expensive but a lot of fuss and hassle. Look for odd wires dangling about, fuses tucked under carpets and not in a fusebox.
Dibby said:
Make sure it's correctly registered on the V5 and comes with a stack of paperwork.
Avoid Q plates and go for something with a proper registration that's been through the SVA test and not cobbled together.
Agreed on the paperwork, check it's registered as the kit not the donor.Avoid Q plates and go for something with a proper registration that's been through the SVA test and not cobbled together.
As for Q plate, absolute rubbish. The Q plate is not a sign that it hasn't been through the SVA, anything registered in the last 8+ years will have been through the SVA test, the Q plate simply means that the car is of "unknown" age which can be a simple as using multiple donor sources. Such as the Tiger owner that tried to register as a Sierra donor but had swapped the engine for a Zetec so the DVLA gave him a Q, as they quite rightly pointed out that the Sierra never had a Zetec engine.
That could also be a disadvantage if someone was to 'tune' their engine by winding the fuel mixture up to make it do 0-60 once and belch out black smoke like a mapped diesel. I've also steered well clear of old Pintos that smelled rich and sounded too cammy when looking about.
Suppose it all depends on what you're looking for in a kit car, I don't mind the emissions test but then I'm not into squeezing every last drop of power from what is admittedly an ageing engine.
Suppose it all depends on what you're looking for in a kit car, I don't mind the emissions test but then I'm not into squeezing every last drop of power from what is admittedly an ageing engine.
Dibby said:
Maybe it was an assumption but the Q plates out there I have seen when looking to buy a kit car were all ropey so I thought that a Q was something to do with the SVA.
I'm always wary when I see a Q plated car
Q plates are issued when there are not enough parts from one car used to qualify for an age related conventional registration. I would be more wary of a kit that didn't have one, and would definitely check that it was correctly registered, as there are some owners who have simply kept the original donor's registration. Having said that I would check the registration thoroughly in any case.I'm always wary when I see a Q plated car
There is absolutely no correlation between type of registration (Q or non Q) and quality of build.
Dibby said:
That could also be a disadvantage if someone was to 'tune' their engine by winding the fuel mixture up to make it do 0-60 once and belch out black smoke like a mapped diesel. I've also steered well clear of old Pintos that smelled rich and sounded too cammy when looking about.
Suppose it all depends on what you're looking for in a kit car, I don't mind the emissions test but then I'm not into squeezing every last drop of power from what is admittedly an ageing engine.
I have a twin Dellorto carbed Pinto with a fast road cam and I have to admit they all sound 'cammy', as you put it, on the wilder types of cams, but the induction roar drowns that much of the time. As for rich smells, I don't seem to have that problem with mine. I was assured that a car would have to be VERY smoky to fail though.Suppose it all depends on what you're looking for in a kit car, I don't mind the emissions test but then I'm not into squeezing every last drop of power from what is admittedly an ageing engine.
My point, as always, is that if you don't KNOW, don't guess. 'Cos it's f
k all use to other people if you do.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E10Bp_mPXXA
k all use to other people if you do.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E10Bp_mPXXA
Slightly off topic here, but how old are each of you with kit cars and what sort of insurance are you paying. Contemplating a 7-a-like as a second car which would be doing under 4000 miles a year.
I would be buying second hand and in November.
You may have seen the Phaeton thread that I started and be thinking I'm a time waster
but I'm just after opinions. The thought of a cheaper barge, similar to the Phaeton but costing a bit less (thinking older Audi A8 or Jaguar XJ) plus something special for the weekend is starting to appeal more to me.
I love my current car but feel that, because it is driven everyday and is something of a jack of all trades, I don't get the same buzz any more.
Still really just ideas in my head, if kit car insurance is justifiably low for the use the car would be getting, it could certainly feature prominently on my list of cars.
As an aside, what is the wet weather gear like on a kit car. For example, a car that has piqued my interest is here: http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/1390023.htm
The benefits of it being that the wet weather gear is stored within the car. Obviously it will not be as easy as putting up a normal convertible roof, but at least if I get caught up in the north east's god awful weather, I have a way of keeping my feet dry
Cheers in advance.
James
Oh and I'm not 21 for 9 months yet, figured I'd get my research in nice and early
I would be buying second hand and in November.
You may have seen the Phaeton thread that I started and be thinking I'm a time waster
but I'm just after opinions. The thought of a cheaper barge, similar to the Phaeton but costing a bit less (thinking older Audi A8 or Jaguar XJ) plus something special for the weekend is starting to appeal more to me. I love my current car but feel that, because it is driven everyday and is something of a jack of all trades, I don't get the same buzz any more.
Still really just ideas in my head, if kit car insurance is justifiably low for the use the car would be getting, it could certainly feature prominently on my list of cars.
As an aside, what is the wet weather gear like on a kit car. For example, a car that has piqued my interest is here: http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/1390023.htm
The benefits of it being that the wet weather gear is stored within the car. Obviously it will not be as easy as putting up a normal convertible roof, but at least if I get caught up in the north east's god awful weather, I have a way of keeping my feet dry
Cheers in advance.
James
Oh and I'm not 21 for 9 months yet, figured I'd get my research in nice and early
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