RE: Deltawing sent flying
Discussion
I'm glad the driver is ok and it's being rebuilt in time for the race, and I'm disappointed to see this happen to this prototype AGAIN as I've been following its progress fondly ever since the design was announced. It was also taken out at Le Mans in a similar fashion, (ie/ sideswiped) albeit with a lot less damage as it didn't flip.
I have however been starting to think that a 'normal' configuration (4 planted wheels on each corner) could have resulted in a 'normal' car recovering and continuing to race. Racing is by definition a non-contact sport, but that is only if its looked at from an ideal world - otherwise we all know that contact is going to occur at some point for some unforseen reason.
I'm still all for a lighter, more fuel efficient form of racing as that is what is going to drive our future race cars and make then economically viable, but just MAYBE the design needs to be looked at from a shunt perspective. It's one thing to protect the driver (which in this case the driver capsule has done very well), but the idea of an economical race car goes out the window if the car is taken out of a race every time it is involved in an incident. It might not be time for a total rethink of design but I do think there is a lot of learning/lessens to be taken out of the 2 incidents.
I have however been starting to think that a 'normal' configuration (4 planted wheels on each corner) could have resulted in a 'normal' car recovering and continuing to race. Racing is by definition a non-contact sport, but that is only if its looked at from an ideal world - otherwise we all know that contact is going to occur at some point for some unforseen reason.
I'm still all for a lighter, more fuel efficient form of racing as that is what is going to drive our future race cars and make then economically viable, but just MAYBE the design needs to be looked at from a shunt perspective. It's one thing to protect the driver (which in this case the driver capsule has done very well), but the idea of an economical race car goes out the window if the car is taken out of a race every time it is involved in an incident. It might not be time for a total rethink of design but I do think there is a lot of learning/lessens to be taken out of the 2 incidents.
Definite loss of control from the Porsche on the corner exit. One of those unfortunate incidents partly caused by the Porsche driver running wide on the kerb, and partly from the Delta Wing driver lot leaving enough room for something like that to happen.
I think it would have still gone up like that even if it was a normal car (seems like the front wheel of the Porsche clattered the rear wheel of the Delta Wing), but I suspect it might not have gone fully over. Either way, it would have still been a big accident!
I think it would have still gone up like that even if it was a normal car (seems like the front wheel of the Porsche clattered the rear wheel of the Delta Wing), but I suspect it might not have gone fully over. Either way, it would have still been a big accident!
Much as I hate to say as I love the deltawing but it was the Nissan driver at fault - he went to pass the Porsche way too close to the lhs of the track knowing full well that the whole reason the Porsche had slowed and was off line was it had wandered on to the kerb. Porsche gets thrown off the kerb back into the track and the rest is obvious. It is a classic incident where cars of significantly different performance capabilities share the same track. There is even a moment of hesitation as the Nissan driver contemplates the pass - the odds are if he'd just gone for straight out of the corner the incident wouldn't have happened - equally so if he'd thought it through just a little bit further.
Porsche driver isn't blameless of course as the bit of track they are "supposed" to use does not include the kerbs as we are repeatedly reminded in every pre-race briefing (don't even mention the grass).
All that said - it is a proper racing incident. I've witnessed plenty of cars go the same way (including one that nearly landed on a Marshall's post at Oulton but mercifully got stuck on the barrier).
Porsche driver isn't blameless of course as the bit of track they are "supposed" to use does not include the kerbs as we are repeatedly reminded in every pre-race briefing (don't even mention the grass).
All that said - it is a proper racing incident. I've witnessed plenty of cars go the same way (including one that nearly landed on a Marshall's post at Oulton but mercifully got stuck on the barrier).
The porsche driver loses the back-end just slightly on the rumble strip coming out of the corner. This causes him to have a bit of a tank slapper which results in the front corner of the porsche stricking the rear wheel of the delta wing. The rotation of the driven wheels of the delta wing, combined with the force of the impact are enough to flip it over.
We have seen this kind of accident many times with cars that are standard in their configuration (both open and closed wheel). I highly doubt that the tripod set up of the delta wing made that much difference to the end result.
As for the driver of the delta wing, you can understand his frustrations, but i imgaine that after he has looked at the crash from all angles, he will come to the conclusion that it was a racing accident
We have seen this kind of accident many times with cars that are standard in their configuration (both open and closed wheel). I highly doubt that the tripod set up of the delta wing made that much difference to the end result.
As for the driver of the delta wing, you can understand his frustrations, but i imgaine that after he has looked at the crash from all angles, he will come to the conclusion that it was a racing accident
BeirutTaxi said:
dukebox9reg said:
the porsche driver lost control on the kerb, he didnt purposely steer into him
Yep, if you pause it at 48 seconds you can see the wheel is turned to the left, away from the Delta Wing.
ks.I'm not sure I get the Delta Wing. If that's allowed why not just race sidecars against cars? It's so different it reminds me of the anything goes Can-Am cars of the 70s.
It's time to drop the stealth fighter black paint and use something like the lurid green of that Porsche or McLaren orange so then at least its lower, different shape may be more visible?
It's time to drop the stealth fighter black paint and use something like the lurid green of that Porsche or McLaren orange so then at least its lower, different shape may be more visible?
Edited by carinaman on Thursday 18th October 12:48
frogy6 said:
Personally I think that was more the Nissans fault than the porche, the Nissan didn't give him enough space.
Saying that the other guy should have looked at the mirrors, but looked like he lost control and shot right as he regained control.
I'd say 80% the nissans fault
It was a racing accident. Nissan was properly positioned but the Porsche driver got it slightly out of shape and was correcting it. Can understand Jeannette getting upset at the time but once he sees the footage he will change his view I think.Saying that the other guy should have looked at the mirrors, but looked like he lost control and shot right as he regained control.
I'd say 80% the nissans fault
masermartin said:
I disagree, I think the Porsche was making a move to come into the pits. Just didn't see the DW.
There does seem to be a bit of a problem when it comes to visibility for the DW - not sure there's much that can be done about that though?
You are wrong, 48-49s you can see that the car is on opposite lock, caused by the bobble it has on the kerb. He wouldn't be doing that if trying to enter the pits.There does seem to be a bit of a problem when it comes to visibility for the DW - not sure there's much that can be done about that though?
Edited by zebedee on Thursday 18th October 12:48
masermartin said:
There does seem to be a bit of a problem when it comes to visibility for the DW - not sure there's much that can be done about that though?
Yep, I drive and Elise and its very similar on the road, people just don't see you as you are (relatively) small and low. Accident looks a bit of 50:50 to me. Porsche driver not looking/making a mistake and the DW driver not giving enough space.
frogy6 said:
Personally I think that was more the Nissans fault than the porche, the Nissan didn't give him enough space.
Saying that the other guy should have looked at the mirrors, but looked like he lost control and shot right as he regained control.
I'd say 80% the nissans fault
No one was at fault. These sort of events are inevitable in any sport where you are in close proximity of your competitor.Saying that the other guy should have looked at the mirrors, but looked like he lost control and shot right as he regained control.
I'd say 80% the nissans fault
Gassing Station | General Motorsport | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff