Nordschleife/956 question
Discussion
pablo said:
phatgixer said:
Brundle in the XJR14 at the 1991 Empire Trophy? 4 seconds lead on lap one... Just awesome.
It was Teo Fabi and it was at least seven seconds. I know because I was stood on the exit of Copse with my jaw in my hands! That car was as far from the original concept of Group C as possible though. Underneath it was a Leyton House F1 Car, I'm sure Adrian Newey had a hand in developing the XJR14.
Teo Fabi was no slouch in a car either, the Benetton of the late eighties wasnt the greatest but he was a respectable finisher in the Indycar series.
I was at copse too and it was deffo Brundle I'm afraid!
>> Edited by phatgixer on Wednesday 5th January 14:08
Guy Humpage said:
Didn't the LM winning Mazda car also have a link with the Jag chassis?
Don't think so. The 787B had been around during the XJR6/9 reign.
TWR used to fettle Mazda road cars, but not the Group C stuff. Maybe Tony Southgate helped pen the 787 moonlighting from his day job?
Guy Humpage said:
Didn't the LM winning Mazda car also have a link with the Jag chassis?
Porsche gave a prototype sportscar to Joest to provide some backup to their works GT1 cars. This car had been previously qualified at Le Mans as a Jaguar. It then appeared at Le Mans as a Mazda and then went to race in the World Sports Car series in the USA. Regulation changes saw it retired and set for a quiet life in a museum until it arrived at Le Mans in Joest's hands and promptly won the race ahead of the two works Porsche GT1s. Not sure if it was the same 787b chassis that won Le Mans in 1991 though.
No, it wasn`t the Le Mans winning car. The XJR14 `morphed into the Mazda during the final seasons of the doomed 3.5 ltre formula (but boy, were they good to watch!) when it unsuccessfully went up against the Peugeots and Toyota`s. Subsequrent to that it went topless and became a Portia.
ettore said:
No, it wasn`t the Le Mans winning car. The XJR14 `morphed into the Mazda during the final seasons of the doomed 3.5 ltre formula (but boy, were they good to watch!) when it unsuccessfully went up against the Peugeots and Toyota`s. Subsequrent to that it went topless and became a Portia.
The XJR14 went extremely successfully against the Pug and the Merc C112 (very trick flat v12) in the sprint races, but Jaguar entered the 12 cylinder car for le Mans as there was 100kg weight penalty for Group C cars and rear tyres and brakes were emasculated. The Mazda being a GTP1 car was immune and won to everyones surprise. The XJR14 was not co-exixstent with the Toyata GT One as far as I remember.
The XJR14 was the zenith of the "FIA fiddled" Group C and was the reason all the rest left the series (except Pug who elected to run exclusively at LM). Mercedes being particularly bad sports about it. Hey, they might have kept that Schumacher oik in tow had they kept on running...
>> Edited by phatgixer on Wednesday 5th January 15:53
No, this was a bit later after the XJR14 had been pulled. Pug`s had become the car to beat (Warwick and Dalmas) closely followed by the Toyota`s. Mazda and Jaguar were both owned by Ford, so they wheeled out a mildly re-bodied `14 as a Mazda. Even with Herbert on board it wasn`t up to the competition although it undoubtedly suffered from a much smaller budget.
It was at Silverstone that year that Warwick`s qualifying lap would have put him on the second row of the GP! - those Pug`s were pretty awesome things.
(Toyota`s were not the GT-one`s but a predecessor - TSR010 or similar)
>> Edited by ettore on Wednesday 5th January 16:01
It was at Silverstone that year that Warwick`s qualifying lap would have put him on the second row of the GP! - those Pug`s were pretty awesome things.
(Toyota`s were not the GT-one`s but a predecessor - TSR010 or similar)
>> Edited by ettore on Wednesday 5th January 16:01
It was Brundle at the Empire Trophy, because IIRC he broke the outright circuit record during that stint. I'm sure I've read that he got out of the car and cried his eyes out because he'd tried that hard*
Re the Zanardi comment, he's a very under-rated driver, and that GT1 Esprit was a bloody good car. Jan Lammers certainly worried the McLarens in it at Silverstone in 1996
*I should point out that I could be talking total bollox about that race, since I was only 5 at the time and not actually there.
>> Edited by The DJ 27 on Wednesday 5th January 18:22
Re the Zanardi comment, he's a very under-rated driver, and that GT1 Esprit was a bloody good car. Jan Lammers certainly worried the McLarens in it at Silverstone in 1996
*I should point out that I could be talking total bollox about that race, since I was only 5 at the time and not actually there.
>> Edited by The DJ 27 on Wednesday 5th January 18:22
http://wspr-racing.com/wspr/results/wscc/ms1991.html#3
makes for quite interesting reading if you play the "where are they now?" game!......
makes for quite interesting reading if you play the "where are they now?" game!......
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