BTCC Knockhill
Discussion
It's a fair penalty, but in last year's final outing at Brand Hatch GP when he ruined Moffat's race, he should have deserved more (although it kind of equalled out in the end).
But it is what it is, I will be watching all the rest, but not that exciting now.
All three drivers drive really well, but they just don't achieve the same level of consistency.
But it is what it is, I will be watching all the rest, but not that exciting now.
All three drivers drive really well, but they just don't achieve the same level of consistency.
His driving style seems to suit the Subaru really well, especially in the wet, where the ballast and boost restriction is less relevant compared to traction, handling and braking (It seems that now the Hondas are not as amazing in this regard anymore).
Silverstone should favour fwd (and cars with more boost), but we'll see what's the weather is going to be like.
Silverstone should favour fwd (and cars with more boost), but we'll see what's the weather is going to be like.
rallycross said:
Just shows what a fantastic racer Ash Sutton is, his drive through the pack from last place to 8th in the rain tells you just how good he is, not just quick but also a fantastic overtaker.
Sutton is undeniably good, but it seems like Plato has just given up. He’d be better off in a Eurotech or Norlin Civic than that Subaru at the moment, he just doesn’t seem to be that quick in rear wheel drive. Plato isn't that far behind on times but BTCC is so close 2/10ths puts you 10 places or more down the grid.
Sutton is a mercurial talent and is by far the best driver out there IMO. Plato does admit to not trying as hard as Sutton does when he's at the back though. Can't say I'm surprised about that given the relative ages and careers to date.
The problem with the Subaru is that it makes all it's time in the corners so if it's in the pack with drivers who aren't that fast through corners but squirt away on the straights it's really hard to make progress unless you're at the level of Sutton in the wet.
Plato needs to qualify better to get in with the cars that corner faster as Sutton is doing and he'll make more progress. The amount of lap time needed to do that is small but hard to find.
Sutton is a mercurial talent and is by far the best driver out there IMO. Plato does admit to not trying as hard as Sutton does when he's at the back though. Can't say I'm surprised about that given the relative ages and careers to date.
The problem with the Subaru is that it makes all it's time in the corners so if it's in the pack with drivers who aren't that fast through corners but squirt away on the straights it's really hard to make progress unless you're at the level of Sutton in the wet.
Plato needs to qualify better to get in with the cars that corner faster as Sutton is doing and he'll make more progress. The amount of lap time needed to do that is small but hard to find.
Dinoboy said:
Amazed at the difference in performance between Sutton and Plato.
I doubt we'll see Plato next season, and frankly I was fairly surprised he was back this year to start with. I know he brings a lot of sponsorship, but Subaru would be barking to keep him on in 2019 assuming he wanted to stay. There's only so long he can blame the car before even his biggest fans like me just stop listening. His attitude this year has stunk, frankly.agent006 said:
I doubt we'll see Plato next season, and frankly I was fairly surprised he was back this year to start with. I know he brings a lot of sponsorship, but Subaru would be barking to keep him on in 2019 assuming he wanted to stay. There's only so long he can blame the car before even his biggest fans like me just stop listening. His attitude this year has stunk, frankly.
From what I've heard Subaru are gone next year anyway. BMR is currently up for sale and it's pretty likely that Plato and Sutton will both be elsewhere next year anyway. I reckon Plato and Neal will pack it in at the end of this year. I also don't think we'll see Rob Collard back again. If, as per the rumours ive heard about BMR and Subaru are true it wouldn't be a bad idea for Ash Sutton to start sniffing around WSR to see if he can get himself into one of their BMW's for next year.
Kraken said:
No way Plato will pack it in when he's so close to 100 wins. With the cars all so close fortunes can change in a heartbeat.
thisand actually think he deserves 3 more wins too. I hope he finds a drive next year to prove whether he still has it or not. Sutton is an amazing talent no doubt. personally like to see him and turkington at BMW together...
I'd love to see Plato in something that suits him next year, but I can't help thinking that his approach to this year will have done him no favours with prospective teams. There are few teams who have a fully developed car so they need a driver who is happy to fight for places no matter what end of the field it is.
There are loads of good options that would suit him but the problem is that most of the better Fwd teams have a good driver lineup sorted that is likely to stand into next season as well. So he's left with things like the team hard revolving door or amd. Short of something interesting like a second team Parker or speedworks car.
From a fans point of view its a shame that he and the Neals don't get on as he'd make a cracking replacement for Disappointing Dan next year.
There are loads of good options that would suit him but the problem is that most of the better Fwd teams have a good driver lineup sorted that is likely to stand into next season as well. So he's left with things like the team hard revolving door or amd. Short of something interesting like a second team Parker or speedworks car.
From a fans point of view its a shame that he and the Neals don't get on as he'd make a cracking replacement for Disappointing Dan next year.
agent006 said:
I'd love to see Plato in something that suits him next year, but I can't help thinking that his approach to this year will have done him no favours with prospective teams. There are few teams who have a fully developed car so they need a driver who is happy to fight for places no matter what end of the field it is.
There are loads of good options that would suit him but the problem is that most of the better Fwd teams have a good driver lineup sorted that is likely to stand into next season as well. So he's left with things like the team hard revolving door or amd. Short of something interesting like a second team Parker or speedworks car.
From a fans point of view its a shame that he and the Neals don't get on as he'd make a cracking replacement for Disappointing Dan next year.
Just to be clear; “Disappointing Dan” = Dan Cammish = the bloke who just took pole & 2 podiums last time out and is currently 1 place behind Matt Neal in the overall points standings...?There are loads of good options that would suit him but the problem is that most of the better Fwd teams have a good driver lineup sorted that is likely to stand into next season as well. So he's left with things like the team hard revolving door or amd. Short of something interesting like a second team Parker or speedworks car.
From a fans point of view its a shame that he and the Neals don't get on as he'd make a cracking replacement for Disappointing Dan next year.
agent006 said:
Just my view that I expected better from him given his past success. I'm not a mind for stats but have watched every race this season and my abiding memories of him is going backwards down the field. Yes he's up there now but it's taken a while.
I think the difficulty in achieving consistent results is a really difficult thing in the btcc until you have had some prolonged experience of a year or so. They must also be completely alien to drive after Porsche supercup etc. Sticking it up at the front end for the first round in quali tho at Brands showed he has had the pace all along right from the start. The race craft of the btcc is a very different beast though compared to sports cars i would think. It is much more like karting where you will get a bump from behind and a train of cars comes past, whereas sports cars is basically non contact, and maybe get passed by one or two cars in a go, not ten. I think once he has more experience of the elbows out style and fickle nature of the penalty giving i.e. you can get away with quite a lot of rubbing, we will see him putting in consistent top performances and going for championships. Also this years honda doesn't seem completely sorted yet and is inconsistent in performance so that will have a lot to do with it. Can't think of many better long term prospect drivers than Dan to be honest. Look forward to seeing him and Sutton in years to come
designndrive62 said:
The race craft of the btcc is a very different beast though compared to sports cars i would think. It is much more like karting where you will get a bump from behind and a train of cars comes past, whereas sports cars is basically non contact, and maybe get passed by one or two cars in a go, not ten. I think once he has more experience of the elbows out style and fickle nature of the penalty giving i.e. you can get away with quite a lot of rubbing, we will see him putting in consistent top performances and going for championships.
I think that's a really accurate summary. He's proper quick but gets mugged too easily in the races. That's where I was coming from when I see him as dissapointing, he doesn't seem to really get amongst it in the same way as Sutton. But on the other hand I find Sutton too aggressive sometimes, although much better this season and without the clumsiness of some of the other mid-pack.Sammo123 said:
From what I've heard Subaru are gone next year anyway. BMR is currently up for sale and it's pretty likely that Plato and Sutton will both be elsewhere next year anyway.
I reckon Plato and Neal will pack it in at the end of this year. I also don't think we'll see Rob Collard back again. If, as per the rumours ive heard about BMR and Subaru are true it wouldn't be a bad idea for Ash Sutton to start sniffing around WSR to see if he can get himself into one of their BMW's for next year.
Where have you heard that BMR is for sale?I reckon Plato and Neal will pack it in at the end of this year. I also don't think we'll see Rob Collard back again. If, as per the rumours ive heard about BMR and Subaru are true it wouldn't be a bad idea for Ash Sutton to start sniffing around WSR to see if he can get himself into one of their BMW's for next year.
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