Uk club racing after covid19?

Uk club racing after covid19?

Author
Discussion

MG CHRIS

Original Poster:

7,186 posts

125 months

Sunday 22nd March
quotequote all
After this horrid virus passes and eventually people start to regain some for of normal life how will the uk club racing look like. Maybe this could be the time to radically alter the way its run.
Surely clubs and organising will have to cut down dead duck series or merge to keep numbers and viability of the racing to continue. Ive noticed a huge list of championship or series with extremely low numbers surely that wont or cant continue after this has passed.
Could we see a heavily reduced number of series and more common sense involved in the industry or will it go back to how it was.

Kraken

1,539 posts

158 months

Sunday 22nd March
quotequote all
Autosport have done some excellent articles on the issue recently. It is a bit deceiving to be honest. The low grids tend to be one club/organiser in particular and a handful of specialist series. Many clubs are in rude health but there certainly does need to be a bit of pruning.

Problem is many clubs get formed when a group throw their toys out of the pram because they don't like the way their current club does things and then that dilutes the original club rather than attracting new people. A bit less ego and a bit more understanding that we do it for fun not to be the next Lewis Hamilton would go a long way.

I do wonder what the financial effect will be on a lot of club racers with job losses, wage cuts etc.

andy97

4,000 posts

180 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all

Tbh, I would think that the major concern will actually be how many competitors there will be with the financial ability to compete given the amount of people who may lose their jobs, businesses going bust, values of houses/ pensions/ cars likely to go or gone down etc.
Even if an individual survives in work, it may well force a total social re-think on the way people spend/ invest their “disposable” income for a while until confidence returns.
Not sure that motorsport is going to be a priority for many people for a while, even when the restrictions are lifted.

coppice

6,321 posts

102 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all
I am more hopeful. There will be an unprecedented appetite for motorsport after this ghastly thing ends . Of course many will have been hit financially. and I don't say that glibly , it will be terribly difficult for some, and racing will be the least of their worries.

But I think some of the more pricey series will be hit hardest, things like British GT .

I've been around the sport since the 70s and I still have to pinch myself at the apparently bottomless pit of money some racers seem to have . Some teams have far, far more kit than 70s and 80s F1 teams -monster transporters , opulent motorhomes and so on . Good luck to you if you've got that much cash to burn but it isn't , and shouldn't , be necessary to have a fortune to enjoy your sport .

There's still plenty of guys in tents, plenty with a cheap trailer and an affordable race car.. Just because budgets are relatively tiny doesn't mean the racing is poor . Quite the contrary - the best racing I have seen in the last few years has been HSCC FF1600 and CSCC Tin Tops

Drumroll

2,383 posts

78 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all
Some clubs may not survive. Also I am not sure what will happen with all the volunteers that make the meeting run. As they too will have taken a financial hit.

I do agree though that there does need to be a cull of race series in the UK.

BertBert

14,172 posts

169 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all
Perhaps MSUK should "nationalise" UK club racing. Can all the car clubs and run a much streamlined set of race meetings.
Not a serious suggestion, but it's hard to see how the individual clubs can make the most of the UK racers.
Bert

andy97

4,000 posts

180 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all
All testing and track days at MSV circuits halted now:
http://news.msv.com/dp-23032020.aspx

Surprised it took this long tbh.

LucyP

422 posts

17 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all
So am I. Perhaps we shamed them into it, or it was the negative publicity that they received on the radio yesterday as discussed in the other thread!

andrewcliffe

596 posts

182 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all
Different clubs have different financial models, but some of the less supported series which are relying on being susidided by better supported championships may face the axe unless they can be made to pay their way. It may be that a number of two day meetings could be reduced to a cheaper one dayer.

If you buy tracktime, its likely to cost circa £ 200 per minute of tracktime.

Dynion Araf Uchaf

2,580 posts

181 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all
BertBert said:
Perhaps MSUK should "nationalise" UK club racing. Can all the car clubs and run a much streamlined set of race meetings.
Not a serious suggestion, but it's hard to see how the individual clubs can make the most of the UK racers.
Bert
they should 'nationalise' UK rallying for sure.

Drumroll

2,383 posts

78 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all
Dynion Araf Uchaf said:
they should 'nationalise' UK rallying for sure.
Not going to happen, too many vested interests. (Same with racing)

Dynion Araf Uchaf

2,580 posts

181 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all
Drumroll said:
Not going to happen, too many vested interests. (Same with racing)
I'd say that the problem is that there is not enough of a vested interest.

Drumroll

2,383 posts

78 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all
Dynion Araf Uchaf said:
Drumroll said:
Not going to happen, too many vested interests. (Same with racing)
I'd say that the problem is that there is not enough of a vested interest.
Trying to get clubs to agree how they are going to run their events. Class structure, running order, what officials do what etc. is a nightmare (both for race and rally) All clubs seem to me to have their own interests and how they feel the sport should progress.

Hence in part why there are so many series (each club being vested in their own interests)

I know, as I have my own ideas that don't seem to go down well with the clubs I am involved with. (freely admit my ideas may (most likely aren't) the best.) but you try attending a club meeting and try to get some change.

Dynion Araf Uchaf

2,580 posts

181 months

Monday 23rd March
quotequote all
Drumroll said:
Trying to get clubs to agree how they are going to run their events. Class structure, running order, what officials do what etc. is a nightmare (both for race and rally) All clubs seem to me to have their own interests and how they feel the sport should progress.

Hence in part why there are so many series (each club being vested in their own interests)

I know, as I have my own ideas that don't seem to go down well with the clubs I am involved with. (freely admit my ideas may (most likely aren't) the best.) but you try attending a club meeting and try to get some change.
ha ha ha. Already did that back in the mid teens. Spent a year on the committee, tried to introduce some changes in order to increase the number of club members then got chucked out for daring to communicate in any other way than the monthly committee meeting! I mean using emails, what was I thinking? AnywayI upset the old boys and was sent packing. However they did eventually implement a couple of my ideas, but long after I left.

ginettajoe

2,064 posts

176 months

Tuesday 24th March
quotequote all
coppice said:
I am more hopeful. There will be an unprecedented appetite for motorsport after this ghastly thing ends . Of course many will have been hit financially. and I don't say that glibly , it will be terribly difficult for some, and racing will be the least of their worries.

But I think some of the more pricey series will be hit hardest, things like British GT .

I've been around the sport since the 70s and I still have to pinch myself at the apparently bottomless pit of money some racers seem to have . Some teams have far, far more kit than 70s and 80s F1 teams -monster transporters , opulent motorhomes and so on . Good luck to you if you've got that much cash to burn but it isn't , and shouldn't , be necessary to have a fortune to enjoy your sport .

There's still plenty of guys in tents, plenty with a cheap trailer and an affordable race car.. Just because budgets are relatively tiny doesn't mean the racing is poor . Quite the contrary - the best racing I have seen in the last few years has been HSCC FF1600 and CSCC Tin Tops
....... and of course you are forgetting Mini Sevens and Mini Miglias, and Mighty Minis!

coppice

6,321 posts

102 months

Tuesday 24th March
quotequote all
Not intentionally - I just highlighted some examples of really good racing , from everyone's perspective. There's lots more , such as FF2000, Swinging Sixties etc in historics .

The key to the success of historics is often cheaper cars which don't depreciate much , or at all , are often easier to fix and don't ; need a team of ten blokes with laptops even to start them up, It's not because they are older , but because they are simpler .

If we wean out some of the series I've seen - Chevron GR8 anyone ? Or the absurdly overhyped TCR - hours of track time wasted on grids that would be a good thing

Redlake27

2,255 posts

202 months

Tuesday 24th March
quotequote all
I run the new UK Sports Prototype Cup and have run three other championships (ranging from Fiat Unos to LMP type cars) in the last 30 years.

The 'nationalise' thing is interesting, but ultimately it is a free market. If a club or promoter wants to lose money, it's their choice. Ultimately, the fittest will survive and the weaker ones will be forced to collaborate.

We set up our Cup primarily for the new Revolution A-One , tested by PH here:

https://www.pistonheads.com/news/ph-driven/revolut...

This season there will be 12+ of these, with growth forecasted after that. That wasn't enough to justify the track time so we incorporated the BARC Radical SR3 Trophy and invited competitors from the sadly defunct Open Sportscar Series (OSS). That would have given us a 20-24 car grid at Donington on Easter Saturday.

So, we had to collaborate and compromise to get a decent grid. Going back to the original post, I think you will see more merging. If, and it's a big if, racing resumes in the late Spring/early Summer, BARC, MSV, BRSCC etc etc will be compressing 10 months worth of racing into less than half that. If that means we have to go halves on track time with other GT or Sportscar championships, it could be a win-win for all.

Looking ahead to 2021, many high-net worth racers at the LMP3/GT/Premium Historic type level may find their wealth is still 30-40% down on 2019. This will also force some consolidation. We would welcome it!

James Bailey, PitBox91 Motorsport Promotion



Edited by Redlake27 on Tuesday 24th March 08:43

Drumroll

2,383 posts

78 months

Tuesday 24th March
quotequote all
Redlake27 said:
I run the new UK Sports Prototype Cup and have run three other championships (ranging from Fiat Unos to LMP type cars) in the last 30 years.

The 'nationalise' thing is interesting, but ultimately it is a free market. If a club or promoter wants to lose money, it's their choice. Ultimately, the fittest will survive and the weaker ones will be forced to collaborate.

We set up our Cup primarily for the new Revolution A-One , tested by PH here:

https://www.pistonheads.com/news/ph-driven/revolut...

This season there will be 12+ of these, with growth forecasted after that. That wasn't enough to justify the track time so we incorporated the BARC Radical SR3 Trophy and invited competitors from the sadly defunct Open Sportscar Series (OSS). That would have given us a 20-24 car grid at Donington on Easter Saturday.

So, we had to collaborate and compromise to get a decent grid. Going back to the original post, I think you will see more merging. If, and it's a big if, racing resumes in the late Spring/early Summer, BARC, MSV, BRSCC etc etc will be compressing 10 months worth of racing into less than half that. If that means we have to go halves on track time with other GT or Sportscar championships, it could be a win-win for all.

Looking ahead to 2021, many high-net worth racers at the LMP3/GT/Premium Historic type level may find their wealth is still 30-40% down on 2019. This will also force some consolidation. We would welcome it!
I personally doubt we will get any serious racing this year. Might end up with a few winter series, but that will be about it.

As I said in other posts it isn't just about the drivers it is all the others that make a meeting happen. 30 to 40% down for someone who can run an LMP3 is not the same as 30 to 40% down for someone who makes just above the living wage.

andy97

4,000 posts

180 months

Tuesday 24th March
quotequote all
Several quite well known and high profile race clubs have posted losses in the last 2-3 years.
They probably still have offices, staff, insurances, utilities, web sites etc etc to pay for and this will be eating in to reserves. Some may not make it.

The majority of circuits will also have lease fees/ mortgages, staff and ongoing maintenance to pay for without the income from the clubs and track days. Will they all survive, will the costs to put meetings on when this is all over have to go up so much that they become unaffordable for many??

BertBert

14,172 posts

169 months

Tuesday 24th March
quotequote all
Redlake27 said:
I run the new UK Sports Prototype Cup and have run three other championships (ranging from Fiat Unos to LMP type cars) in the last 30 years.

The 'nationalise' thing is interesting, but ultimately it is a free market. If a club or promoter wants to lose money, it's their choice. Ultimately, the fittest will survive and the weaker ones will be forced to collaborate.
But that's just the "open market will see things right" argument. The overwhelming evidence is that this isn't really happening though when you look around the plethora of categories. Hence the idea of a higher authority intervening.
Redlake27 said:
We set up our Cup primarily for the new Revolution A-One , tested by PH here:

https://www.pistonheads.com/news/ph-driven/revolut...

This season there will be 12+ of these, with growth forecasted after that. That wasn't enough to justify the track time so we incorporated the BARC Radical SR3 Trophy and invited competitors from the sadly defunct Open Sportscar Series (OSS). That would have given us a 20-24 car grid at Donington on Easter Saturday.

So, we had to collaborate and compromise to get a decent grid. Going back to the original post, I think you will see more merging. If, and it's a big if, racing resumes in the late Spring/early Summer, BARC, MSV, BRSCC etc etc will be compressing 10 months worth of racing into less than half that. If that means we have to go halves on track time with other GT or Sportscar championships, it could be a win-win for all.

Looking ahead to 2021, many high-net worth racers at the LMP3/GT/Premium Historic type level may find their wealth is still 30-40% down on 2019. This will also force some consolidation. We would welcome it!

James Bailey, PitBox91 Motorsport Promotion
I love the idea of having capped lap times. Is that a thing used elsewhere? I've not seen it before.
I was looking forward to seeing the Revolutions out again, wishing Phil all the best in making a goer of them. Hoping that over the winter, he'd managed to make them faster than the SR3 biggrin
Bert

PS don't take what I am saying as a seriously held position, just stuck-in-the-house-when-I-should-be-out-testing banter!