2021 Rallying Thread (WRC, ERC and national rally)
Discussion
PaulW100 said:
Excellent analysis of a 19yr old ... jesus.
Always an issue, when he won the junior ERC, when he won countless RX rounds in a world RX supercar at 16yrs old.
When he sets top 5 overall times against WRC machines in Monte.
The question was what do we think he will do at this round, I gave my opinion based on my experience of him though admittedly little.Always an issue, when he won the junior ERC, when he won countless RX rounds in a world RX supercar at 16yrs old.
When he sets top 5 overall times against WRC machines in Monte.
Never said he would go onto to great things, given the upbringing he has had anything less than success would be a complete failure.
Thanks for your measured response
Great entry for Lapland. 13 world cars and a stacked WRC2 field.
https://www.ewrc-results.com/entries/69715-arctic-...
https://www.ewrc-results.com/entries/69715-arctic-...
Ah yes, Cronin - talented and a multi BRC winner. Didn't seem to have deep pockets and/or be able to get decent sponsors..... He's not the only BRC winner to come to a dead end though.
You seem to need talent, sponsors/ money and connections to get anywhere near a seat in the WRC.....Chris Ingram won the 2019 ERC, and has got nowhere since then due to a lack of £$£$£$£$
Anybody from these islands is at a disadvantage if they have no money - other ASNs tend to back their drivers with money.
You seem to need talent, sponsors/ money and connections to get anywhere near a seat in the WRC.....Chris Ingram won the 2019 ERC, and has got nowhere since then due to a lack of £$£$£$£$
Anybody from these islands is at a disadvantage if they have no money - other ASNs tend to back their drivers with money.
I think these days most of it is linked to managers and agents.
there have been numerous Brits fully deserving of seats, and yet people like Wilson had a seat for donkeys years when most would have been let go. Meeke stayed a long time on pace alone, despite being expensive yet the decision was made very quickly to pension off Wilkes who was just as quick at times.
His Dad was deserving of a seat, as was Higgy, guys like Jimmy and Russell only got one offs really.
Yet some keep on going despite being very average, like Sordo the nearly man for years, Latvala, quick but crashes when pressured, Mikkelsen et al, all decent but when you see how long they have been around, really do they deserve such long careers?
I suppose being an occasional podium man and getting thrashed by Loeb for your entire career in the same car must mean something to team bosses.
there have been numerous Brits fully deserving of seats, and yet people like Wilson had a seat for donkeys years when most would have been let go. Meeke stayed a long time on pace alone, despite being expensive yet the decision was made very quickly to pension off Wilkes who was just as quick at times.
His Dad was deserving of a seat, as was Higgy, guys like Jimmy and Russell only got one offs really.
Yet some keep on going despite being very average, like Sordo the nearly man for years, Latvala, quick but crashes when pressured, Mikkelsen et al, all decent but when you see how long they have been around, really do they deserve such long careers?
I suppose being an occasional podium man and getting thrashed by Loeb for your entire career in the same car must mean something to team bosses.
Sordo and Latvala are far from average. There isn’t many, if any ‘average’ drivers in contracted drives for works teams. If you saw Sordo on a regional event he’d win pretty comfortably, they really are different gravy.
If you look at the past few events he’s done in an R5 car for example, he’s won them all but one. The people that beat him were two other works drivers.
If you look at the past few events he’s done in an R5 car for example, he’s won them all but one. The people that beat him were two other works drivers.
Edited by Skylinecrazy on Saturday 13th February 12:48
LukeBrown66 said:
Meeke stayed a long time on pace alone, despite being expensive yet the decision was made very quickly to pension off Wilks who was just as quick at times.
Meeke struggled to even get a drive; I think he was nearly the wrong side of 30 when he got the IRC Peugeot drive back in 2009. He had no budget so sat on the sidelines. One off drives in a rented Impreza WRC in RallyGB 2005, Rally Ireland in 2007 showed flashes of speed, as did a strong showing in an ageing S1600 car in Rallye Deutschland in 2008. And once again when the Prodrive-Mini ran into budget issues, Meeke was left on the sidelines - and had another long wait before getting a regular drive.
What I mean is that guys like Sordo, Mikkelsen had a lot of time to get there, and their nationality helped.
Loeb ate Sordo for breakfast for years, yet for some reason he is still around, yes he is good, but he has proved incapable of beating the very top men. Safe pair of hands I guess.
Wilkes was a nightmare yes, but Meeke was too, only thing in his favour was pace to beat anyone now and then.
WRC is now the domain of one dominant force at a time, it's been that way for decades really.
Anyone else is a points man or making up the numbers or a pay driver.
Loeb ate Sordo for breakfast for years, yet for some reason he is still around, yes he is good, but he has proved incapable of beating the very top men. Safe pair of hands I guess.
Wilkes was a nightmare yes, but Meeke was too, only thing in his favour was pace to beat anyone now and then.
WRC is now the domain of one dominant force at a time, it's been that way for decades really.
Anyone else is a points man or making up the numbers or a pay driver.
It is actually hard for British drivers out there but hopefully things will change. I beleive total domination of Loeb and Ogier has made things very difficult for many drivers. Most of the manufacturers knows that if these 2 weren't in their car, it will be nearly impossible to win the championship so they just made sure they had very very reliable drivers to pick up as much crumbs as they could. When it comes to reliable drivers, sadly British drivers don't look very attractive and money wise, I don't think that they have strong sponsors like strong rally nations have.
You just have to look at Ogier's career, it costed him 25euros to become a rally driver. He entered "Rally Jeune" and won, the rest is history.
No such program in the uk. You want to enter a rally, you pay for everything. The creme de la creme do not get rewarded, only the ones who have money.
You just have to look at Ogier's career, it costed him 25euros to become a rally driver. He entered "Rally Jeune" and won, the rest is history.
No such program in the uk. You want to enter a rally, you pay for everything. The creme de la creme do not get rewarded, only the ones who have money.
M5-911 said:
It is actually hard for British drivers out there but hopefully things will change.
No such program in the UK. You want to enter a rally, you pay for everything. The creme de la creme do not get rewarded, only the ones who have money.
To be honest, it's hard to see how it will change, especially now with COvid-19 having decimated the sport in the UK. Our top championship is in a sorry state, we don't have an ERC round, and our historic WRC, is not only not in the WRC, it's not even running. And English forestry access isn't looking great either. The 'perfect' storm. 10-15 years of mismanagement of the sport here.No such program in the UK. You want to enter a rally, you pay for everything. The creme de la creme do not get rewarded, only the ones who have money.
And to be honest, even at world level the sport isn't as healthy as it could/ should be; new regs for 2022 - and there's hardly a long list of manufacturers wanting to join. Toyota, Hyundai - but rumours they're not happy/convinced by the new regs, and M-Sport, with some 'support from Ford, but not full factory backing.
The other worry you have is that the promoters who laughingly call themselves WRC promoter when we all know its Red Bull! Have just taken over WRX from the woeful IMG.
Their policy was to do chuff all except make sure they sponsored the leading cars and drivers, thereby ensuring their product is in the press promoted by erm them, isn't that a bit of a monopoly!!
So, if that takes off you can see WRC struggling to keep up.
Their policy was to do chuff all except make sure they sponsored the leading cars and drivers, thereby ensuring their product is in the press promoted by erm them, isn't that a bit of a monopoly!!
So, if that takes off you can see WRC struggling to keep up.
LukeBrown66 said:
The other worry you have is that the promoters who laughingly call themselves WRC promoter when we all know its Red Bull! Have just taken over WRX from the woeful IMG.
Their policy was to do chuff all except make sure they sponsored the leading cars and drivers, thereby ensuring their product is in the press promoted by erm them, isn't that a bit of a monopoly!!
So, if that takes off you can see WRC struggling to keep up.
Although if they plan more mash-ups between WRC/WRX like the proposed Spa event then my holiday at work will take a beating...Their policy was to do chuff all except make sure they sponsored the leading cars and drivers, thereby ensuring their product is in the press promoted by erm them, isn't that a bit of a monopoly!!
So, if that takes off you can see WRC struggling to keep up.
LukeBrown66 said:
I think these days most of it is linked to managers and agents.
there have been numerous Brits fully deserving of seats, and yet people like Wilson had a seat for donkeys years when most would have been let go. Meeke stayed a long time on pace alone, despite being expensive yet the decision was made very quickly to pension off Wilkes who was just as quick at times.
His Dad was deserving of a seat, as was Higgy, guys like Jimmy and Russell only got one offs really.
Yet some keep on going despite being very average, like Sordo the nearly man for years, Latvala, quick but crashes when pressured, Mikkelsen et al, all decent but when you see how long they have been around, really do they deserve such long careers?
I suppose being an occasional podium man and getting thrashed by Loeb for your entire career in the same car must mean something to team bosses.
I remember Galligan was the same. An abundance of talent who took advantage of the one make championships to make it in the BRC. Now we'll never know how much further he would have gone but he was in the same position as alot of others as regards to not having the cash behind him. Fate cruelly intervened there and I guess its one of the 'what if's'. there have been numerous Brits fully deserving of seats, and yet people like Wilson had a seat for donkeys years when most would have been let go. Meeke stayed a long time on pace alone, despite being expensive yet the decision was made very quickly to pension off Wilkes who was just as quick at times.
His Dad was deserving of a seat, as was Higgy, guys like Jimmy and Russell only got one offs really.
Yet some keep on going despite being very average, like Sordo the nearly man for years, Latvala, quick but crashes when pressured, Mikkelsen et al, all decent but when you see how long they have been around, really do they deserve such long careers?
I suppose being an occasional podium man and getting thrashed by Loeb for your entire career in the same car must mean something to team bosses.
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