2007 F1 drivers
Discussion
flemke said:
I regret to inform you that Mr Cora Schumacher's contract with Toyota extends at least through 2007.
No, I cannot comprehend it either.
No, I cannot comprehend it either.
Why Toyota want to keep Trulli and Schumacher, the latter on a mega money contract as I recall, is a mystery. Toyota either need to get some decent drivers who are worth the outlay or find some young hopefuls who are willing to work for nought.
rubystone said:
Mrs ex Frentzen's squeeze husband may have a contract to the end of 2007, but since when did they matter - after all, there's a precedent set at Toyota already viz. Mr Gascoyne
She used to be Cora F.? Nabbing not one but two F1 drivers suggests that she must be a very special lady. Then again, at the height of last year's nonsense about Ralfie The Genius's proposed Slovakian sex shop empire, there were a lot of "Hard Cora" T-shirts about. Perhaps that's the very special part. The Japanese are famous for their aversion to looking foolish. It's one thing to sack Gascoyne (their leading but nonetheless relatively unknown technical manager) whilst some time is remaining on his contract, but I suspect that paying Ralfie $25M a year NOT to drive would be a bridge too far even for Toyota.
rubystone said:
Mrs ex Frentzen's squeeze husband may have a contract to the end of 2007, but since when did they matter - after all, there's a precedent set at Toyota already viz. Mr Gascoyne
frentzens ex bird is Michael Schumachers wife. Ralfs is one he picked up himself ( german glamour model )
talking of which, did you know that Salo's current wife was a Japanese porn star?
There is a story about a large chested essex woman who has the same name as a former F1 team trying to get off with a certain f1 world champs younger sibling.
when asked how it was going (by a friend in the ladies on evening at an event) the large chested lady said something along the lines of him batting for another side. whatever that might mean, maybe he is taking up cricket.
Either way I think that Toyota should get at least one new driver.
D
when asked how it was going (by a friend in the ladies on evening at an event) the large chested lady said something along the lines of him batting for another side. whatever that might mean, maybe he is taking up cricket.
Either way I think that Toyota should get at least one new driver.
D
Quite interesting:
"Latest from driver market," he said. "Ferrari sources say Schumacher staying. Raikkonen joining. Marlboro paying $75m. Two drivers equal status. Logic is that by paying large sum Ferrari secure two of top three drivers. Thus weaken opposition. Michael apparently willing to accept equal status. Odd. Felipe Massa to be farmed out to Toro Rosso with cut price Ferrari engines. Team boss Berger talking about Toro Rosso-Renault deal to lower Ferrari price. No real chance of Renault deal."
"Renault taking Fisichella and Kovalainen. Cheap. Fisichella will be number one. Kovalainen will beat him and thus be big new star. Flavio increases value of his asset. Fisichella takes blame if team does not win title. Renault split on supplying another team. Flav wants the money (as ever). Engineers want to win. Prodrive-Renault deal possible in 2007 with old cars and engines for testing operation. Time to build up infrastructure for two teams in 2008. Depends on money."
"McLaren takes Alonso and Lewis Hamilton. Logical move for McLaren in circumstances. Nothing to lose. No-one better on market. Thus McLaren and Renault each have young star. Montoya looking for work. Talking to everyone who will listen. No-one very keen. Maybe America for him. Williams likely to keep current duo. Cheap. Cheerful. Red Bull Racing to use Cosworth engines, Newey chassis. Drivers Tonio Liuzzi and David Coulthard. Klien in trouble. Speed OK at Toro Rosso. Toyota to re-sign Jarno Trulli to partner Ralf. Logic is mystery. Honda same but need better car. Russian still deciding about sale of MF1 team. Question over BMW drivers: Heidfeld plus one. Probably Villeneuve as Kubica still very young. Jacques is big name but not very good singer..."
...
"Sounds reasonable," said The Mole. "The only thing is that I cannot see Michael happily accepting Kimi on equal status. It is not his style. Michael likes servants rather than team mates. The team would have to change attitude completely."
"True," said The Colonel, "but I guess that Raikkonen is the future and they need him nailed down."
"The good thing," said The Mole, "is that if all of this happens we will have some big new stars coming in. A new generation for new fans to get excited about. The current lot have been around too long. Alonso and Raikkonen need some new challengers because the old lot are never going to do it. It is time for a clear out. There are eight drivers who are over 30 and change is needed. In the next couple of years I see them all disappearing: Michael, DC, Jacques, Rubens, Fizzy, Jarno, Ralf and Monty. They have all had their day in the sun. The team bosses are beginning to realise that it is time for change. The sport needs to appeal to a younger audience. I think that is very healthy. The new generation are going to be the babies of the 1980s: Button, Alonso, Liuzzi, Rosberg, Hamilton, Kubica and so on."
Taken from: www.grandprix.com/mole/mole17035.html
"Latest from driver market," he said. "Ferrari sources say Schumacher staying. Raikkonen joining. Marlboro paying $75m. Two drivers equal status. Logic is that by paying large sum Ferrari secure two of top three drivers. Thus weaken opposition. Michael apparently willing to accept equal status. Odd. Felipe Massa to be farmed out to Toro Rosso with cut price Ferrari engines. Team boss Berger talking about Toro Rosso-Renault deal to lower Ferrari price. No real chance of Renault deal."
"Renault taking Fisichella and Kovalainen. Cheap. Fisichella will be number one. Kovalainen will beat him and thus be big new star. Flavio increases value of his asset. Fisichella takes blame if team does not win title. Renault split on supplying another team. Flav wants the money (as ever). Engineers want to win. Prodrive-Renault deal possible in 2007 with old cars and engines for testing operation. Time to build up infrastructure for two teams in 2008. Depends on money."
"McLaren takes Alonso and Lewis Hamilton. Logical move for McLaren in circumstances. Nothing to lose. No-one better on market. Thus McLaren and Renault each have young star. Montoya looking for work. Talking to everyone who will listen. No-one very keen. Maybe America for him. Williams likely to keep current duo. Cheap. Cheerful. Red Bull Racing to use Cosworth engines, Newey chassis. Drivers Tonio Liuzzi and David Coulthard. Klien in trouble. Speed OK at Toro Rosso. Toyota to re-sign Jarno Trulli to partner Ralf. Logic is mystery. Honda same but need better car. Russian still deciding about sale of MF1 team. Question over BMW drivers: Heidfeld plus one. Probably Villeneuve as Kubica still very young. Jacques is big name but not very good singer..."
...
"Sounds reasonable," said The Mole. "The only thing is that I cannot see Michael happily accepting Kimi on equal status. It is not his style. Michael likes servants rather than team mates. The team would have to change attitude completely."
"True," said The Colonel, "but I guess that Raikkonen is the future and they need him nailed down."
"The good thing," said The Mole, "is that if all of this happens we will have some big new stars coming in. A new generation for new fans to get excited about. The current lot have been around too long. Alonso and Raikkonen need some new challengers because the old lot are never going to do it. It is time for a clear out. There are eight drivers who are over 30 and change is needed. In the next couple of years I see them all disappearing: Michael, DC, Jacques, Rubens, Fizzy, Jarno, Ralf and Monty. They have all had their day in the sun. The team bosses are beginning to realise that it is time for change. The sport needs to appeal to a younger audience. I think that is very healthy. The new generation are going to be the babies of the 1980s: Button, Alonso, Liuzzi, Rosberg, Hamilton, Kubica and so on."
Taken from: www.grandprix.com/mole/mole17035.html
stockhatcher said:
rubystone said:
Mrs ex Frentzen's squeeze husband may have a contract to the end of 2007, but since when did they matter - after all, there's a precedent set at Toyota already viz. Mr Gascoyne
frentzens ex bird is Michael Schumachers wife. Ralfs is one he picked up himself ( german glamour model )
talking of which, did you know that Salo's current wife was a Japanese porn star?
Really? No wonder they hate each other!
Andy M said:
Quite interesting:
"Latest from driver market," he said. "Ferrari sources say Schumacher staying. Raikkonen joining. Marlboro paying $75m. Two drivers equal status. Logic is that by paying large sum Ferrari secure two of top three drivers. Thus weaken opposition. Michael apparently willing to accept equal status. Odd. Felipe Massa to be farmed out to Toro Rosso with cut price Ferrari engines. Team boss Berger talking about Toro Rosso-Renault deal to lower Ferrari price. No real chance of Renault deal."
"Renault taking Fisichella and Kovalainen. Cheap. Fisichella will be number one. Kovalainen will beat him and thus be big new star. Flavio increases value of his asset. Fisichella takes blame if team does not win title. Renault split on supplying another team. Flav wants the money (as ever). Engineers want to win. Prodrive-Renault deal possible in 2007 with old cars and engines for testing operation. Time to build up infrastructure for two teams in 2008. Depends on money."
"McLaren takes Alonso and Lewis Hamilton. Logical move for McLaren in circumstances. Nothing to lose. No-one better on market. Thus McLaren and Renault each have young star. Montoya looking for work. Talking to everyone who will listen. No-one very keen. Maybe America for him. Williams likely to keep current duo. Cheap. Cheerful. Red Bull Racing to use Cosworth engines, Newey chassis. Drivers Tonio Liuzzi and David Coulthard. Klien in trouble. Speed OK at Toro Rosso. Toyota to re-sign Jarno Trulli to partner Ralf. Logic is mystery. Honda same but need better car. Russian still deciding about sale of MF1 team. Question over BMW drivers: Heidfeld plus one. Probably Villeneuve as Kubica still very young. Jacques is big name but not very good singer..."
"Latest from driver market," he said. "Ferrari sources say Schumacher staying. Raikkonen joining. Marlboro paying $75m. Two drivers equal status. Logic is that by paying large sum Ferrari secure two of top three drivers. Thus weaken opposition. Michael apparently willing to accept equal status. Odd. Felipe Massa to be farmed out to Toro Rosso with cut price Ferrari engines. Team boss Berger talking about Toro Rosso-Renault deal to lower Ferrari price. No real chance of Renault deal."
"Renault taking Fisichella and Kovalainen. Cheap. Fisichella will be number one. Kovalainen will beat him and thus be big new star. Flavio increases value of his asset. Fisichella takes blame if team does not win title. Renault split on supplying another team. Flav wants the money (as ever). Engineers want to win. Prodrive-Renault deal possible in 2007 with old cars and engines for testing operation. Time to build up infrastructure for two teams in 2008. Depends on money."
"McLaren takes Alonso and Lewis Hamilton. Logical move for McLaren in circumstances. Nothing to lose. No-one better on market. Thus McLaren and Renault each have young star. Montoya looking for work. Talking to everyone who will listen. No-one very keen. Maybe America for him. Williams likely to keep current duo. Cheap. Cheerful. Red Bull Racing to use Cosworth engines, Newey chassis. Drivers Tonio Liuzzi and David Coulthard. Klien in trouble. Speed OK at Toro Rosso. Toyota to re-sign Jarno Trulli to partner Ralf. Logic is mystery. Honda same but need better car. Russian still deciding about sale of MF1 team. Question over BMW drivers: Heidfeld plus one. Probably Villeneuve as Kubica still very young. Jacques is big name but not very good singer..."
Wot I said
If you're Ron Dennis, and you've already got the best driver nailed down, would you rather spend $30M on a second great driver who is not quite as effective as the first, or would you rather spend it on making a better car?
Even in F1, $30M/year can get you a meaningful improvement in performance.
Even in F1, $30M/year can get you a meaningful improvement in performance.
Good point flemke. As I see it these are McLaren's likely options for a second driver next year:
Montoya - Proven race winner, knows the team well but somewhat erratic and probably not cheap. Keeping him would benefit stability within team.
Hamilton - Very promising performances in the junior formulae, but an F1 rookie nevertheless. Probably wouldn't cost much.
Paffett - A rookie, but he knows the car and the team. Obviously not a bad driver given his DTM success. Again, should be cheap.
Montoya - Proven race winner, knows the team well but somewhat erratic and probably not cheap. Keeping him would benefit stability within team.
Hamilton - Very promising performances in the junior formulae, but an F1 rookie nevertheless. Probably wouldn't cost much.
Paffett - A rookie, but he knows the car and the team. Obviously not a bad driver given his DTM success. Again, should be cheap.
SamHH said:
Good point flemke. As I see it these are McLaren's likely options for a second driver next year:
Montoya - Proven race winner, knows the team well but somewhat erratic and probably not cheap. Keeping him would benefit stability within team.
Hamilton - Very promising performances in the junior formulae, but an F1 rookie nevertheless. Probably wouldn't cost much.
Paffett - A rookie, but he knows the car and the team. Obviously not a bad driver given his DTM success. Again, should be cheap.
Montoya will come a lot cheaper next year than he did this year. Montoya - Proven race winner, knows the team well but somewhat erratic and probably not cheap. Keeping him would benefit stability within team.
Hamilton - Very promising performances in the junior formulae, but an F1 rookie nevertheless. Probably wouldn't cost much.
Paffett - A rookie, but he knows the car and the team. Obviously not a bad driver given his DTM success. Again, should be cheap.
I'd guess that JPM would do most anything to retain his McL. seat for one more year, because there will be a number of seats available at end of '07, if only because he'll need to be in F1 during next season to have much of a chance at any of them.
With Hamilton, the concern is that if he comes into the big leagues prematurely, that could do his head in and spoil what is looking to be a stellar career.
Not sure what's happening with GP. If you look at his testing times, he is almost always down the table. I presume that that is because they're using him for heavy fuel loads, tyre durability, different aero configurations, etc. Just doesn't seem like the way that you would prepare someone for a season of competition.
My guess is that they're looking for someone who will perform a "Barrichello-style" role next year (without the political bullshit and blatant disingenuousness that is the lifeblood of Ferrari), whilst waiting for Hamilton to be ready. This in itself makes it less likely that they'll pay up for Raikkonen.
The main argument for retaining Raikkonen would be to keep him away from their main competitors.
Raikkonen's main argument for staying would be that that is the only way that he would know if he was the best, by competing in equal equipment against the guy who appears to be the best.
flemke said:
Montoya will come a lot cheaper next year than he did this year.
If I were Dennis I'd only sign Montoya on a performance related contract - starting at zero pay for not finishing the race. It appears fatherhood has taken some of the fire out of his belly, and hopefully this would motivate him more than we've seen this season.
I dont understand whats happened with Montoya. I dont think the maclaren move has been good for him at all for whatever reason but I wouldnt write him off as hopeless. He has talent, his indycar races were spectacular and the year he beat Franchitti for the title was nail biting stuff and he seemed able to pull wins from nowhere. I still think that if he's got a car which suits him then he can challenge the best but at this stage it seems like he's been written off by maclaren and is stuck in a downward spiral. I'd certainly rather have him in an F1 car than the likes of Sato and Ralf Schumacher.
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