Video Tribute to Stefan Bellof...Le mans driver..
Discussion
flemke said:
jacobyte said:
ninemill said:
flemke said:
The next-best time by anyone was achieved at that same round - 6:25/Ickx.
Doesn't the commentary in that clip suggest that Bellof's time to beat is his team mates lap of 6:16.85?
As Joe911 says, these were in practice. In the race, Belloff did a 6.25.9
Bellof's lap of 6:11:13 was an official qualifying lap, not practice.
I don't know what Mass did officially.
Not intending to split hairs, but "qualifying" is just the colloquial term for practice, and I suppose more specifically what we all understand to be officially timed practice. Sorry for any confusion. (You should know that, it's even called "training" in the Vaterland
) It is strange that the organisers don't call it "qualifying" - it would be far easier for people to distinguish, resulting in it being less ambiguous for cases such as above.
Likewise, I don't whether Mass' practice time was in "qualifying" or not. Either way, it's a mighty laptime.
By the 1980s quite a few restrictions were already in place in most forms of motor racing - simply because the circuits caouldn't cope with the cars cornering much faster. The last unfettered era in motor sport was probably the mid 1960s when Le Mans cars and Can Am cars were pretty much unrestricted (apart from the basic formulae which usually related to engine size and vehicle weight). In that era, these cars were invariably faster than contemporary F1 cars.
jacobyte said:
Not intending to split hairs, but "qualifying" is just the colloquial term for practice, and I suppose more specifically what we all understand to be officially timed practice. Sorry for any confusion. (You should know that, it's even called "training" in the Vaterland
) It is strange that the organisers don't call it "qualifying" - it would be far easier for people to distinguish, resulting in it being less ambiguous for cases such as above.
Likewise, I don't whether Mass' practice time was in "qualifying" or not. Either way, it's a mighty laptime.
). I don't know what was the format for that particular race ('83 1000 kms, World Endurance Series), but most of what I have seen and assumed to be the norm is:
- free practice which is actually practice, to get the cars set up, scrub tyres, etc. I wouldn't know whether during free practice at this particular race the cars were being timed by a neutral party such as the organiser, or by their individual teams. I would have thought that in that early '80s it would have been the latter, as the former would have had no reason to record times.
If the latter, the times would be unreliable (which doesn't mean that Mass didn't do a 6:16, of course - and it might have been even quicker than that!).
Subsequently:
- qualifying for starting positions, which is timed by the organiser as the neutral party, using the same equipment and standards for all entrants. The accuracy of these times must be ascertained, the times are subject to protest if something seems amiss.
The consistency, single standard, bearing on the outcome of the race and subject to protest of these times are what make them official.
According to the record book, Bellof's 6:11:13 was his qualifying, "Pole position", time, which would make it different from a practice lap.
Cheers.
Race rsults/times ...
http://wspr-racing.com/wspr/results/w
and
www.teamdan.com/archive/wsc/1983/83nurb.html
and from the Official Ring site ...
www.nuerburgring.de/7_archiv/rekorde/index.html?L=1
http://wspr-racing.com/wspr/results/w
and
www.teamdan.com/archive/wsc/1983/83nurb.html
and from the Official Ring site ...
www.nuerburgring.de/7_archiv/rekorde/index.html?L=1
Edited by Joe911 on Saturday 5th August 13:17
Joe911 said:
Race rsults/times ...
http://wspr-racing.com/wspr/results/w
and
www.teamdan.com/archive/wsc/1983/83nurb.html
and from the Official Ring site ...
www.nuerburgring.de/7_archiv/rekorde/index.html?L=1
http://wspr-racing.com/wspr/results/w
and
www.teamdan.com/archive/wsc/1983/83nurb.html
and from the Official Ring site ...
www.nuerburgring.de/7_archiv/rekorde/index.html?L=1
Ah, so Mass did do a 6:16 in qualifying.
Other interesting trivia from the second link:
- Norbert Haug competed in this race.
- Vic Elford competed in this race
- Olaf Manthey drove two cars.
- Keke Rosberg also drove a 956 in this race. It was for Richard Lloyd, whose cars often were equal to the factory cars.
I presume that, amongst his co-drivers J Palmer and J Lammers, Rosberg would have set the qualifying time.
At the time, Rosberg was reigning F1 World Champion.
Rosberg's time was 28 seconds slower than Beloff's.
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